97s in the CO (1 Viewer)

[DrStrange]

I have a couple of hands where Hero might be getting out of line. It leads to issues . . .

Playing 1-2 live, eight handed. (actually two tables of eight, Crazy isn't at my table.) It is about an hour into the session. The table is a little passive compared to normal and a wee bit tighter too. Nothing like a normal casino game, but for us a little tame.

Cast of characters:

MP is Old Man, Coffee playing $120. It has not been a good start for him. I don't think he has won a chip, just bleeding a bit here and there. The last few sessions played out the same way. He looks like it is beating him down.

MP+1 is the ultamate calling station playing $150. The start hasn't been great for him, but the night is young. Still feeling flush from his last session and willing to try his luck.

Hero is in the CO with $200 on his original buy-in of $60. Hero's night is basically one hand where he tripled up on a pair + flush draw making the winning flush. Other than this hand, the night has been remarkably uninteresting.

Crafty is the Button with $350. He is a capable older guy who loves to LAG it up. Not the best player at the table, but solidly profitable.

Crazy Jr has the small blind, but he is in the kitchen getting a plate of food and making fun of Crazy, he might not be playing this hand - has $250 or so in play.

The Cougar is the BB with $300. He just joined the table this hand (we move a player or two every 45 minutes to get some socialization of the two tables. Prior to Crazy getting here, Hero's table was the prime table but not any more.) The Cougar is a trick-trappy loose passive who loves to slow play.

The hand:

MP and MP+1 limp for $2. Action on Hero is . Crazy Jr hollers he will call up to $5 blind from the kitchen. Action on Hero. Limp, fold or raise? If raising how much? Normal raises have been on the smaller side so far, say $6 to $10.

DrStrange

 

[detroitdad]

Make it 5

 

[Jimulacrum]

Make it $7 (so that it's $6 for Crazy Jr to call ).

If we're going to play this despite the likelihood of a multi-way pot that we probably won't win uncontested, it would be nice to at least steal the button from Crafty.

 

[DrStrange]

Crazy Jr is the small blind. Crafty has the button - and it isn't easy to steal it.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Crazy Jr is the small blind. Crafty has the button - and it isn't easy to steal it.

Fixed my reference to "Crazy" above.

If we're almost never stealing the button, given this lineup, this is either a limp or a fold. Tend toward a fold if we're likely to often face a decent raise from the button or blinds.

Why play a bloated multi-way pot with a so-so speculative hand like this? Can we really be happy on the flop without smashing a made straight, flush or boat? It's not like we're taking down an uncontested pot here very often, which is the main benefit to raising in position with a hand like this.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

97ss is the type of hand that plays wells in position in multiway pots, so I see no reason not to bloat it. Make it $10.

 

[DrStrange]

*** Well, we already suspect this will happen ***

Hero raises to $7. Crafty calls from the button. We holler at Crazy Jr asking if he will call $7 dark but all we can hear is a mumble and see him still in the kitchen - so his hand goes in the muck (he comes to the table at the turn saying he said call it, sorry ....) Cougar and Old Man, Coffee fold. The Ultimate Calling Station calls. Three players to see a flop, $26 in the pot. Hero holds

Flop is

The Ultimate Calling Station checks. Action on Hero, bet or check? If betting how much?

Crafty holds the button and is not telegraphing any intentions.

DrStrange

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

Bet $20.

 

[moojersey]

The Ultimate Calling Station calls... ROFL

 

[moojersey]

Well we make top pair...def betting. Pretty connected flop. Need to see where we are all at. Bet $20 to full pot.

 

[moojersey]

I wish my line up was half as interesting as yours lol. I play in a home game with a bunch of nitty old men.

 

[dickzapper]

Bet sixteen.

 

[DrStrange]

I just realized I have never posted a hand with Capt. A***ole - his choice of names, not mine. He is a semi-regular for over a decade. I'll have to keep an eye open for a candidate.

 

[Jimulacrum]

I'm tempted to go for a check-raise here. I know, I know, a low pair like this doesn't love giving out free cards. But hear me out.

A bet from us here looks like a c-bet. Though we do have top pair, it essentially is a c-bet, as we wouldn't mind taking down the pot uncontested and can't stand significant action. Crafty is to our left and will probably see this dynamic, and with his position he may raise or call us light, and we'll be stuck in a weird spot and will probably have to give up the pot, not really knowing whether we were best.

If we check, however, we should often entice a loose bet from a LAG-type player like Crafty with absolute position. When it comes back and we check-raise, it will look very strong, especially if Ultimate Calling Station has called Crafty's bet before we raise. Crafty will no longer be able to make moves on us and will have to fold his weakest hands; he may even fold some hands that beat us, such as 9s with better kickers and some overpairs. If he remains involved after our check-raise, of course, we can be confident that a pair of 9s with a 7 kicker is no good.

We should size the check-raise so that we can make a reasonable shove on the turn, assuming UCS calls and Crafty folds, and UCS checks to us on the turn. And if our check-raise buys the pot on the flop, that's a pretty sweet outcome too.

Of course, if it checks through, we can be near-certain that our 9 was best on the flop and can use that information moving forward.

 

[DrStrange]

except the calling station might even check an overpair, worried that hero has a bigger pair.

I do like the thinking though.

 

[DrStrange]

*** the turn ***

Hero bets $15. Crafty mucks without a thought. The Ultimate Calling Station calls. Heads up, $56 in the pot. $128 effective stacks. Hero holds

Turn is < >

Villain checks. Action on Hero, bet or check? If betting, how much? Why?

DrStrange

 

[moojersey]

Barrel I think. 1/2 pot. We are way ahead of the ULTIMATE CALLING STATION - lol love it.

I don't want to give a free one. Plan hopefully is to check behind on River for cheap showdown.

 

[moojersey]

He is AT&T. I want to bet for value more often and lighter. Hopefully river isn't too scary if he calls.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

Normally I like to bet 2/3 pot, but I'm not so sure UCS didn't bink trip 4s on us. I make a smaller bet, like $22 or so, and hope to check behind most rivers unless a nine peels off.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Barrel I think. 1/2 pot. We are way ahead of the ULTIMATE CALLING STATION - lol love it.

I don't want to give a free one. Plan hopefully is to check behind on River for cheap showdown.

^ I'm on board with all of this. Let's not miss out now that we have it down to the loose, predictable guy in a good value spot. He may have us beat sometimes, but those are the breaks, and his tendencies should keep it from being too expensive.

Of course, due to the fact of this thread, I've got a feeling UCS is about to do something interesting.

 

[moojersey]

If UCS check raises we definitely fold this one lol

 

[moojersey]

I think our hero will check behind for pot control on this street.

 

[DrStrange]

Hero is feeling LAGish . . . just saying

 

[trever]

The reason you raise preflop with 97 vs a calling station is to squeeze value out of improbable holdings like 97 when they hit. To do that, you've got to value bet when you've got it.

Bet $40

 

[DrStrange]

*** The river ***

Hero bets $33. The Ultimate Calling Station calls. Heads up, $112 in the pot. $95 effective stacks. Hero holds

Turn is < >

Villain checks. Action on Hero, check or bet? If betting, how much? Bet/call or bet/fold if Hero bets rather than jams.

DrStrange

 

[AlPresidente]

Think this is a check vs most opponents, but vs ultimate calling station we should bet. $35 sets up a thin river value shove.

 

[AlPresidente]

Not a great card. I think it's close but check behind.

 

[Jimulacrum]

The king on the end is not as bad a card as it seems. We now tie all 9s other than A9 and K9, and it's not like we were ever getting a 9 to fold anyway.

I'm inclined to check back. It seems like there might be a small sliver of value to get by betting on the end here, but it's close. As much as we might get some value from 6x and 88 or smaller pairs, we may also be often paying off hands that beat us where we could have simply shown our hand down for free. It's not like on the turn, where there were a lot of draws and overcards he could call with.

I would be more inclined to bet if we were to have some fold equity here against hands that previously beat us, like TT or a bigger 9, but I don't think that fold equity has much meaning when our opponent is the Ultimate Calling Station.

 

[moojersey]

Against 99% of opponents I say check behind ... but we are in a heads up pot against T-Mobile World Wide lol. I can almost hear him asking 'how may I help you' from across the country ROFL. At first I was leaning towards getting the thin value from 22 - 88 and A high hands. Honestly we don't beat much that any decent player is calling 2 streets with lol. Albeit, there are some chops. But he is a STATION!!!

Would he call with A high? Going for thin value is a bit dangerous too, because it opens the action back up. What if the ULTIMATE CALLING STATION check raises us on the river? That pretty much blows us off our hand.

Hmmm...typing this out I want to say just check behind and we are 75% good I think. Let's not get greedy here guys. Be honest, the station is always calling with better than we have. Pocket 10's+ maybe he has a 4. We aren't blowing him off his hand. $112 is not a bad $1/$2 pot.

These are all things to consider.

 

[DrStrange]

This villain isn't calling Hero down on the river with ace high. There is at least one who might, but not here.

I did give a clue about this action on a different thread. So far, no one has picked up on it and said something.

DrStrange