AA Weird Spot Against Short Stacks (2 Viewers)

[bmichaelhorn]

Playing a 1/2 home game 6 handed against a table of loose villains who buy in for $60-80 (a very strange but typical LA buyin). Villains tend to play passive preflop and more aggressive postflop. It's very hard to put them on any range as I've seen them call large preflop bets with ATC.

Villain 1, - Host of game, not a strong player will bet/call down light
Villain 2, - Arrived at game two hands before this hand. I've played against him once, not a good player but is aggresive
Hero, - Have dragged a big pot when flopped a straight earlier and have some history with Villain 1. Think he thinks I'm tight but don't know if that effects his play.


Villain 1 UTG ($40) - limps
Villain 2, HJ ($80) - limps
Hero BUTTON ($170) - AdAh raises to $8 (could've been bigger but there have been almost zero preflop raises so wasn't sure how much to make it)
Villain 1 calls
Villain 2 calls

Flop (Pot-$27) Ks9d9s
Villain 1 bets $15
Villain 2 shoves remaining ~$70


I wasn't too worried about Villain 1, think he could do that with a K but Villain 2's line was pretty polarized. I tried talk to him and get some reads, he seemed comfortable, didn't give much off.

What does Hero do?

 

[Anthony Martino]

preflop: With the limpers in I'd raise to somewhere between $10-12
post-flop: ick. I mean, I guess he could be shoving to protect his king from flush and straight draws? The problem is you're facing UTG who is leading into two players after calling a pre-flop raise and another guy shoving. I think the right play is fold unfortunately. Lemme guess, they both had Kx and you would've won?

 

[detroitdad]

preflop: With the limpers in I'd raise to somewhere between $10-12
post-flop: ick. I mean, I guess he could be shoving to protect his king from flush and straight draws? The problem is you're facing UTG who is leading into two players after calling a pre-flop raise and another guy shoving. I think the right play is fold unfortunately. Lemme guess, they both had Kx and you would've won?

First thing I thought of when I read the flop. Fold...........You have 8 bucks invested.

Normally I'd agree with raising more than 8. It sounds like you might only win the blinds with a bigger raise. What fun is that.

 

[JoseRijo]

No way am I ever folding. Didn't you say you had aces?

 

[detroitdad]

No way am I ever folding. Didn't you say you had aces?

Pocket Aces three handed vs two bad players. I'm good. Keep my 8 bucks. I'll felt you guys later. Plus their stack sized just suck ass. I mean. Who buys in for 60 bucks in a 1/2 game unless your playing all in pre flop, double up, hit and run.

 

[bmichaelhorn]

...Who buys in for 60 bucks in....

almost every 1/2 game in LA has this structure it's annoying AF but you just have to get used to it or play higher limits. this game was pretty good despite the low buyin, they just love getting it all in and reloading.

 

[detroitdad]

almost every 1/2 game in LA has this structure it's annoying AF but you just have to get used to it or play higher limits. this game was pretty good despite the low buyin, they just love getting it all in and reloading.

I just don't get it. Takes away a lot of the strategy imo.

You have to assume that Villain one is going to call as well. Hence why I'll defend my "fold" statement.

 

[Nbk]

Fold

 

[bmichaelhorn]

I just don't get it. Takes away a lot of the strategy imo.

You have to assume that Villain one is going to call as well. Hence why I'll defend my "fold" statement.

i think that's why casinos do it, it takes away a lot of strategy so people don't lose huge stacks or get in uncomfortable spots post...then since people are used to buying in for that amount they replicate that in home games often. I personally prefer min 100bb buyin but not my game. Not really disagreeing with "fold" statement.

 

[kirchhausen]

fold.

 

[detroitdad]

i think that's why casinos do it, it takes away a lot of strategy so people don't lose huge stacks or get in uncomfortable spots post...then since people are used to buying in for that amount they replicate that in home games often. I personally prefer min 100bb buyin but not my game. Not really disagreeing with "fold" statement.

I know you weren't. I was just restating my opinion of the action I would take.

I prefer 100-150 x's the BB. 100 x's is plenty though.

 

[Nbk]

so what happened?

 

[bmichaelhorn]

so what happened?

I said, "I don't think you got it this time Johnny and I pushed all in". He just looked at me, and....

just kidding

I eventually folded, V1 called with K6o V2 mucked after his FLUSH DRAW (wtf?) missed. I really thought V2 had a 9. Hard to put these guys on hands.

 

[Ben]

I think it's close and folding or calling are probably about equal in the long run. IF you fold, do NOT say anything about having/folding aces.

 

[Nbk]

i think it was anyway the good move without a good knowing of the players.

usually a single pair is not enough after a reraise on the flop.

 

[bmichaelhorn]

i think it was anyway the good move without a good knowing of the players.

usually a single pair is not enough after a reraise on the flop.

Agree, and like detroiddad said earlier, i can find better spots to stack these guys, they're not great.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

I'm calling here.

 

[manamongkids]

Hey lets lose $60 in 5 hands, or $300 in one hand!

 

[stocky]

Easy call.....

But no I sigh fold then tell everyone to gtfo when villain doesn't show a 9

 

[Nbk]

Easy call.....

not sure...noob don't go allin with a draw that often.

easier call with a pro in fact.


imho

 

[thorwilliam]

I don't think I would be able to make hero folds for 35bb in a home game.

 

[stocky]

not sure...noob don't go allin with a draw that often.

easier call with a pro in fact.


imho

You read the rest of my post??

 

[bmichaelhorn]

You read the rest of my post??

It was kind of hard for me to tell if it was sarcasm or not....same for nbk maybe?

 

[lherron]

It would've been hard to make that call with pot odds that weak. Assuming he almost never has a K (because when is this guy flatting with AK pf or shoving with worse than KQ), so being generous we'll say he has has a flush draw 50% of the time and trips 50% of the time...without doing the math I'm pretty sure that's an easy fold considering you're getting like 5:2. Even if he has a flush draw 2/3s of the time like a maniac, it's still probably a fold. We need a forum bot to do math for us...

ill do the math in a few and report back

 

[stocky]

It was kind of hard for me to tell if it was sarcasm or not....same for nbk maybe?

Only said easy call because I knew the results

As played it's a fold IMO.

 

[bmichaelhorn]

Only said easy call because I knew the results

As played it's a fold IMO.

I heard myself saying "fuck i knew i had you beat" after they showed down only to correct myself by saying "then why did you fold, idiot?" haha

 

[lherron]

I was way off in my first post. You're geting 1.7:1 (119:70). So you need 37% equity to call

Being generous and saying V1 will always fold, if V2's range is:

- 50% flush draw (you're ~68% to win)
- 45% trips (you're 10% to win)
- 5% complete air (you're 90% to win)

Your equity is .34+.045+.04 = 42.5%, so that's a call.

If V2's range is a little less crazy:
- 40% flush draw
- 60% trips

Your equity is .272+.06 = 33.2% which makes it a pretty easy fold given V1 is still behind.

In the end, considering these guys are maniacs... scenario 1 could definitely be more likely, and I could see making the call. My gut said fold off the bat. Interesting to come around after I see the math.

 

[JoseRijo]

...they just love getting it all in and reloading.

...they just love getting it all in and reloading.

...they just love getting it all in and reloading.

...they just love getting it all in and reloading.

Also..

i can find better spots to stack these guys, they're not great.

No, you probably won't.They'll lose their money before you can set-over-tptk them.

 

[lherron]

...they just love getting it all in and reloading.

When in Rome...

 

[detroitdad]

Also..



No, you probably won't.They'll lose their money before you can set-over-tptk them.

possibly, but then they'll reload again.