Advice wanted for first upgraded set (brand and count) (1 Viewer)

[jumboshrimpz]

Hello all,

I've been going down this poker chip rabbit hole the past couple days and looking for some advice/input. I've been using a 300-chip dice set and another 300-chip lower-quality set for the past 15 years or so. Originally, I was planning on consolidating into one 500-chip dice set so I don't have to carry around two cases. I would like to upgrade the chip quality as well and also have denominations as in every game I am constantly being asked what each chip is worth. I've gone through a few progressions in what I want in the last few days.

For starters:
- We are usually 6-8 people in the group.
- $20 buy-in with rebuy-ins for the first hour. Blinds double every half hour or so. I like having the chips be equivalent to real money even though it's still more tournament-style. I'd say max pot ranges from $120-300
- Typically start at the .05/.10 or .10/.20 range for blinds.
- would like to keep the set under $150 ideally but could maybe go a little higher for the right one

Chip Count:
- So far I'm thinking of denominations of .05/.25/1/5/10
- Originally I was planning on 500 chips but wondering if I can get by with this 300 breakdown
.05 = 75
.25 = 100
1 = 75
5 = 25
10 = 25
Total = $478.75
I know it's not a lot of .05 but we always end up not using the lowest chips after the 2nd blind raise and have never had a total pot come close to this full amount.

Where I'm at with research so far:
- I like having correct denominations equivalent to cash or unobtrusive $ signs (i.e. rather not use a $25 for .25)
- not a big fan of the classic casino look or fake casino names (Dune's, Majestic)
- I do like the more stylized but still clean looks (Dia de los muertos, Outlaw, Tiki)
- It seems like for our play style, it probably makes sense to order by the chip and not get a set as I don't think we would use the lowest or highest chips in most sets

Chips I'm considering:
Crowns Casino Clays - https://www.discountpokershop.com/25pc-135g-crown-casino-clay-poker-chips-colors-p-489.html
I like that the main number doesn't have the $ sign attached so we could use a $25 as 25c. I like the look more than most but could go more stylized too. I like the price.

Outlaws - https://www.discountpokershop.com/25pc-13g-law-clay-poker-chips-colors-p-722.html
I like the price and look. Don't love the $ being featured as we'd probably have to mentally reduce each chip by 10x. ($100 chip is really $1 chip)

Dia de los muertos - https://brpropoker.com/collections/dia-de-los-muertos
Love the look. Would probably customize to get the denominations I want. A bit too pricey, especially if 500 is needed over 300.

Majestic - https://www.apachepokerchips.com/product/majestic-poker-chips/
Has the denominations I want. I don't hate the design but also not super drawn to it, I do like it more than the other china clays. Little more pricey than I'd like.

TLDR:
Right now leaning towards the Crowns and possibly upgrading to the Dia de los Meurtos some day. Are the Crowns decent chips still and do you think I could get away with 300 count in the above denominations? Is there another brand I'm overlooking that fit's criteria I'm looking for?

 

[Eriks]

Your game is a bit confusing. Why do you want to bother with small denoms representing cash if you’re doing tourney style? You could definitely get by with 300 or less chips for 6-8 players using a T25 structure.

A structure where blinds double is generally considered too steep. A typical T25 could be

25/50
25/75
50/100
75/150
100/200
150/300
Etc

 

[lane_robert_s]

Hopefully you got samples. If you didnt.... then definately do so.

Interestingly, you have 3 totally different chips represented.
Crowns and outlaws are ABS metal slug
DDLM are ceramic
Majestically are china clay

All feel different, and feel matters!

You'll get alot of opinions in here. But ultimately I'd say get samples and swe what feels nice to you.

Also, if you have not, check out @Hobbyphilic on youtube. He has some great reviews if these chips and more.

 

[jumboshrimpz]

Your game is a bit confusing. Why do you want to bother with small denoms representing cash if you’re doing tourney style? You could definitely get by with 300 or less chips for 6-8 players using a T25 structure.

A structure where blinds double is generally considered too steep. A typical T25 could be

25/50
25/75
50/100
75/150
100/200
150/300
Etc

It's always been nice to have all the chips direct equivalent to money for buying in or assessing how big the pot or bet is. If someone rebuys for 20, can just hand them 2 $10 chips and then they can easily change them out with chip leader. Or raising by $2 but putting in $200 of chips seems confusing. Or even worse if the chips aren't direct multiples of their value. Then it seems like the denominations are kinda arbitrary as long as they scale properly. I also thought it would make counting out the initial stacks easier as you just need to get to $20 total and could mix and match some values.
Our games do go fairly fast, 2-3hrs. Usually, that's a pro if it's after work but I could see reducing some of the later doubles for a slower game. Is there a standard for how fast you raise the blinds in the T25 structure?

 

[jja412]

I will not go down the road of breakdowns and game structure.
BUT if the choices are those chipsets, get the DDLMs. It's NOT CLOSE.
China Clay and ABS Sluggos do not compare to BR Pro's chips.

 

[jumboshrimpz]

Hopefully you got samples. If you didnt.... then definately do so.

Interestingly, you have 3 totally different chips represented.
Crowns and outlaws are ABS metal slug
DDLM are ceramic
Majestically are china clay

All feel different, and feel matters!

You'll get alot of opinions in here. But ultimately I'd say get samples and swe what feels nice to you.

Also, if you have not, check out @Hobbyphilic on youtube. He has some great reviews if these chips and more.

Definitely have been watching a ton of Hobbyphilic's videos. I should probably order the samples. Looks like discountpokershop only does rolls of 25 though unless I'm missing a sample page on there.

 

[Eriks]

It's always been nice to have all the chips direct equivalent to money for buying in or assessing how big the pot or bet is.

Still doesn’t make sense. You relate the size of bets and pots to the size of the stacks. You can have $10 buy-in and award players 1000.000 in chips, it doesn’t matter.

Whatever works for your group is obviously fine for your group. Just trying to say there’re better/more standard ways of doing it. But if it ain’t broken…

Is there a standard for how fast you raise the blinds in the T25 structure?

Totally arbitrary. Depends on how long you want the tournament to last and how much you want skill to matter. Luck will always be a factor in any single game but with a fast structure with steep blind raises, its inpact will be even bigger

 

[Colquhoun]

Also, getting $20 chips instead of $10 means you’ll need half as many…saving you $$.
$10 chips are generally not recommended for this reason.

 

[lane_robert_s]

Have you considered the Bank chips from Apache? They have alot of denominations.

 

[Eriks]

Regarding the chips I would recommend getting samples of all that you are considering. Have only handled Brpro and Majestics myself out of the ones you listed. They are both good options but are very different from one another. The sluggos will feel noticably heavier, that much I can say. 13,5g is too heavy for my taste but some like it.

 

[Silver_Fiend]

Before you worry about buying chips, you need a better understanding of the game. Buy-in has nothing to do with starting stacks for tournaments, and never mix cash and tourney chip sets. Decide what you want to play, what level to play, and then you can figure what chip denoms you need. The specific design or maker of your chips is irrelevant

 

[lane_robert_s]

I am not as passionate as some other people regarding chip values not matching buy in size in tournaments. I will give you one reason that it's beneficial to have chip values different than buy in cost... people are more relaxed if they don't don't associate chips with real value.

IA this a winner takes all tournament? Or does second (and maybe third) place leave without too? If someone can bust out in third and still leave with money then that's another reason that it would be on to have chip value not equal real cash value.

 

[jumboshrimpz]

Before you worry about buying chips, you need a better understanding of the game. Buy-in has nothing to do with starting stacks for tournaments, and never mix cash and tourney chip sets. Decide what you want to play, what level to play, and then you can figure what chip denoms you need. The specific design or maker of your chips is irrelevant

Is there a good reason for not using the cash value in tournament style? Especially tournament style with a low, fixed buy-in? I think most of the group likes knowing the value of all the chips without having to do any further calculations. More, "I raise you $5" than I'm raising 5x big blind with a potentially giant number in the 1000s. Once in a while, we do have someone who might leave early and chip out as well. Not very common though, but nice being able to add up the face value as cash value. I could see if it was a larger tournament or accounting for varying buy-ins across different tournaments that detaching the cash value from chip value makes sense and then using a standard chip count set up each time.

 

[jumboshrimpz]

Have you considered the Bank chips from Apache? They have alot of denominations.

Yup, took a look at those as well. They are decent but a little plain for my tastes. Or maybe it's the colors I'm not a huge fan of.

 

[4SUMERZ]

As mentioned, you have to first figure out the amount of chips each player starts with, and figure on minimum 1 rebuy per player, depending on the blinds, etc etc.
I only have 350 chips in my cash game $20 buy in, typically 4-5 buy ins on a 4.5 hour night. I have extra $5.00 chips in case we have a high buy in night.
Tournaments tend to have more rebuys, so more chips are required, but this can be allievited by introducing higher denom chip the further the tournament goes on.
Good Luck with your choices.
These are the clay composite chips I use, .25-.50 1.00 and 5.00 but have ordered Mirage NoMold chips to replace them with.

 

[natumes]

So are you playing until there is 1 winner who takes all the buy ins, or are players able to leave when they need to and get paid out for whatever chips they have left?
If you're playing until there is 1 winner who takes all the money aka a tournament, the value of the chips to cash is irrelevant and you would be better off reading through the tournament structure threads and building your set that way. Otherwise you're playing cash, at which point I wouldn't suggest raising the blinds throughout the night and people can buy-in for varying amounts and cash out whenever they need to leave. Cash vs tournament sets are very different.

 

[lane_robert_s]

So that's the problem/confusion. You're running a cash game with multiple stakes. You're essentially needing a cash set of chips that can support all these stakes if you're doubling the blinds every half hour for 3 hours.

.05/.10
.10/.20
.20/.40
.40/.80
.80/1.60
1.60/3.20
You need 6 chip sets. Yes, some chips can be used for different stakes, but still....That's not reasonable.

It's hard, and maybe impossible, but maybe this would work better

.05/10
.10/.25
.25/.50
.50/1
1/2
1/3 or 2/3
Then 2/5 or 3/5 if you want to push the action and get the game to end.

You could do this with initial buy ins of $20 for 8 people with
$0.05 x 10
$0.25 x 10
$1 x 12
$5 x 1
And rebuys with $5 × 4 with the table making change.

Set of
0.05 x 80
0.25 x 80
1 x 100
5 x 40
300 chips

 

[Silver_Fiend]

Is there a good reason for not using the cash value in tournament style? Especially tournament style with a low, fixed buy-in? I think most of the group likes knowing the value of all the chips without having to do any further calculations. More, "I raise you $5" than I'm raising 5x big blind with a potentially giant number in the 1000s. Once in a while, we do have someone who might leave early and chip out as well. Not very common though, but nice being able to add up the face value as cash value. I could see if it was a larger tournament or accounting for varying buy-ins across different tournaments that detaching the cash value from chip value makes sense and then using a standard chip count set up each time.

This is why I first suggested you need a better understanding of poker! You are trying to mix cash ring game with a tournament structure which is INSANE. Play a straight cash game, or play a tournament game. You want a chip set that spreads all the micro and low blind games, youre going to need at least 1000 chips for your 8 players. Have you ever played in a casino? You really should, so that you can get a better understanding of how the game is supposed to work.

 

[jumboshrimpz]

So that's the problem/confusion. You're running a cash game with multiple stakes. You're essentially needing a cash set of chips that can support all these stakes if you're doubling the blinds every half hour for 3 hours.

.05/.10
.10/.20
.20/.40
.40/.80
.80/1.60
1.60/3.20
You need 6 chip sets. Yes, some chips can be used for different stakes, but still....That's not reasonable.

It's hard, and maybe impossible, but maybe this would work better

.05/10
.10/.25
.25/.50
.50/1
1/2
1/3 or 2/3

I think we need to reevaluate the doubling a little bit, but we do a little more than double on the switch from 10/20 to 25/50. Last game we had was:
.10/.20
.25/.50
.50/$1
$1/$2
$2/$4
$4/$8 and this is where it ended. With 35min per blind raise so a little over 3hrs.
With more people would probably start at .05/.10 and maybe add in $2/$3 and $4/$6 after $1/$2
I've seen the T25 structure and the math behind it seems legit but actually running a game with ~17 blind changes and so many varying blind increases sounds like a lot of work to keep track of during a casual game.

 

[jumboshrimpz]

This is why I first suggested you need a better understanding of poker! You are trying to mix cash ring game with a tournament structure which is INSANE. Play a straight cash game, or play a tournament game. You want a chip set that spreads all the micro and low blind games, youre going to need at least 1000 chips for your 8 players. Have you ever played in a casino? You really should, so that you can get a better understanding of how the game is supposed to work.

I get this isn't how it's done at an actual casino, but no, I haven't played poker in a casino. We've been fine with ~300-400 chips for the last 10 years of doing these though, albeit maybe not the most optimal way. What do you mean by?

a chip set that spreads all the micro and low blind games

It seems like most tournament chip counts I've seen suggest having denominations that increase 4-5x.
Here's the one in the stickied beginner thread:
120 x T25
120 x T100
50 x T500
75 x T1000 (includes 15x for T25 and t100 color-ups)
35 x T5000

Isn't .05/.25/1/5/10(or 20) pretty similar to this just at a lower multiple? Which then allows matching the buy-in/re-buy-ins at face value.

 

[LeLe]

Is there a good reason for not using the cash value in tournament style? Especially tournament style with a low, fixed buy-in? I think most of the group likes knowing the value of all the chips without having to do any further calculations. More, "I raise you $5" than I'm raising 5x big blind with a potentially giant number in the 1000s. Once in a while, we do have someone who might leave early and chip out as well. Not very common though, but nice being able to add up the face value as cash value. I could see if it was a larger tournament or accounting for varying buy-ins across different tournaments that detaching the cash value from chip value makes sense and then using a standard chip count set up each time.

OP is kinda playing a cash game with raising stake since he allow people the possibility to cash out.

Either way, it’s good to upgrade to chip with denominations and drop the dice chips

If you not looking into spending much for chips, getting a set of 500 from discounted poker chip will be enough as most user around here have slightly much expensive and dictated taste.

 

[Eriks]

Here’s the problem with your game (and why I wouldn’t play in it). I have no idea what my $20/40 buys me. You’re sort of playing a cashgame tourney style but letting players cash out in the middle, essentially taking money from the prize pool.

Tourney: buy-ins for a set amount (along with possible re-buys/add-ons) create a prize pool from where a first, second prize etc (depending on number of players) is set beforehand. Each player gets a set amount of no cash value chips. They can equal the cash buy-in but generally they don’t, it doesn’t matter. They are essentially game pieces. Since players need to be knocked out to determine the winners, blinds are consistently raised in order to force action by decreasing the value of the players’ chips in relation to the blinds (see why there’s a problem letting someone turn those chips into cash midway?)

Cashgame: a set blind level, usually something where your players would be comfortable re-buying a 100-200 big blind stack at least a couple of times. Blinds don’t increase and the game therefore plays a lot deeper (number of big blinds in players’ stacks) than the tourney which will allow for a lot more manuvering). Players can re-buy/add-on (usually up to a table max) and cashout whenever they need. This format requires a different skill set than the tourney. It is also arguable better suited for a casual game as it doesn’t take much organizing. Tournaments are what most new players feel comfortable starting with though as the potential $ risk is set beforehand.

You are doing some kind of mix of these two and I guess whatever works for you is fine. But you’re making us poker/chip nerds uncomfortable

 

[ekricket]

Hello all,

I've been going down this poker chip rabbit hole the past couple days and looking for some advice/input. I've been using a 300-chip dice set and another 300-chip lower-quality set for the past 15 years or so. Originally, I was planning on consolidating into one 500-chip dice set so I don't have to carry around two cases. I would like to upgrade the chip quality as well and also have denominations as in every game I am constantly being asked what each chip is worth. I've gone through a few progressions in what I want in the last few days.

For starters:
- We are usually 6-8 people in the group.
- $20 buy-in with rebuy-ins for the first hour. Blinds double every half hour or so. I like having the chips be equivalent to real money even though it's still more tournament-style. I'd say max pot ranges from $120-300
- Typically start at the .05/.10 or .10/.20 range for blinds.
- would like to keep the set under $150 ideally but could maybe go a little higher for the right one

Chip Count:
- So far I'm thinking of denominations of .05/.25/1/5/10
- Originally I was planning on 500 chips but wondering if I can get by with this 300 breakdown
.05 = 75
.25 = 100
1 = 75
5 = 25
10 = 25
Total = $478.75
I know it's not a lot of .05 but we always end up not using the lowest chips after the 2nd blind raise and have never had a total pot come close to this full amount.

Where I'm at with research so far:
- I like having correct denominations equivalent to cash or unobtrusive $ signs (i.e. rather not use a $25 for .25)
- not a big fan of the classic casino look or fake casino names (Dune's, Majestic)
- I do like the more stylized but still clean looks (Dia de los muertos, Outlaw, Tiki)
- It seems like for our play style, it probably makes sense to order by the chip and not get a set as I don't think we would use the lowest or highest chips in most sets

Chips I'm considering:
Crowns Casino Clays - https://www.discountpokershop.com/25pc-135g-crown-casino-clay-poker-chips-colors-p-489.html
I like that the main number doesn't have the $ sign attached so we could use a $25 as 25c. I like the look more than most but could go more stylized too. I like the price.

Outlaws - https://www.discountpokershop.com/25pc-13g-law-clay-poker-chips-colors-p-722.html
I like the price and look. Don't love the $ being featured as we'd probably have to mentally reduce each chip by 10x. ($100 chip is really $1 chip)

Dia de los muertos - https://brpropoker.com/collections/dia-de-los-muertos
Love the look. Would probably customize to get the denominations I want. A bit too pricey, especially if 500 is needed over 300.

Majestic - https://www.apachepokerchips.com/product/majestic-poker-chips/
Has the denominations I want. I don't hate the design but also not super drawn to it, I do like it more than the other china clays. Little more pricey than I'd like.

TLDR:
Right now leaning towards the Crowns and possibly upgrading to the Dia de los Meurtos some day. Are the Crowns decent chips still and do you think I could get away with 300 count in the above denominations? Is there another brand I'm overlooking that fit's criteria I'm looking for?

But you’re making us poker/chip nerds uncomfortable

Uncomfortable? I want to drive up to wherever this game is and straighten it out tonight. Or film it for a series called “crazy ways people play card games”.
I’ve had to delete like 10 responses so far. Better to just leave it like this.

 

[Eriks]

Uncomfortable? I want to drive up to wherever this game is and straighten it out tonight. Or film it for a series called “crazy ways people play card games”.
I’ve had to delete like 10 responses so far. Better to just leave it like this.

I’m working on my diplomatic skills

 

[jumboshrimpz]

Here’s the problem with your game (and why I wouldn’t play in it). I have no idea what my $20/40 buys me. You’re sort of playing a cashgame tourney style but letting players cash out in the middle, essentially taking money from the prize pool.

But it buys you the direct equivalent in chips? Just doesn't have these massive inflated numbers you're pushing around that dissociate from the buy-in amount. I feel like you have a better idea of what $20 buys you when you get $20 in chips instead of $20,000. But I can see I am in the minority here for sure. I get that the chip values don't really matter for a tournament, but don't see why it's an outright bad thing to associate them with real value.
The letting players cash out early thing is something that happens maybe once a year if someone has an emergency and needs to leave early and we don't want to just take all their money. Not a regular part of the game structure.
Now I see maybe you meant you're not sure how much the $20 buys you if you aren't guaranteed the full pot if someone leaves early. But that really hardly ever happens. And you also never know how many re-buy-ins there's going to be so the pot can end up way larger than the initial headcount.

 

[Eriks]

But it buys you the direct equivalent in chips? Just doesn't have these massive inflated numbers you're pushing around that dissociate from the buy-in amount. I feel like you have a better idea of what $20 buys you when you get $20 in chips instead of $20,000. But I can see I am in the minority here for sure. I get that the chip values don't really matter for a tournament, but don't see why it's an outright bad thing to associate them with real value.
The letting players cash out early thing is something that happens maybe once a year if someone has an emergency and needs to leave early and we don't want to just take all their money. Not a regular part of the game structure.
Now I see maybe you meant you're not sure how much the $20 buys you if you aren't guaranteed the full pot if someone leaves early. But that really hardly ever happens. And you also never know how many re-buy-ins there's going to be so the pot can end up way larger than the initial headcount.

You do whatever you prefer of course. To me it sounds weird but to each their own.

 

[Silver_Fiend]

OK, you want to run a weird tournament with cash equivalent chips, for 8 people, with rebuys. Here is what you need:
starting stacks are:
10- nickels
10- quarters
12- $1
1- $5

That gives your player cash value of a $20 buy-in while still being a decent spread of chips. Starting blinds would be 5/10 cents. For 8 people with 8 total rebuys, and color-up chips, and rounding up to barrel quantities for purchase, you need:
160- nickels
200- quarters
240- $1s
80- $5s

 

[Colquhoun]

But it buys you the direct equivalent in chips? Just doesn't have these massive inflated numbers you're pushing around that dissociate from the buy-in amount. I feel like you have a better idea of what $20 buys you when you get $20 in chips instead of $20,000. But I can see I am in the minority here for sure. I get that the chip values don't really matter for a tournament, but don't see why it's an outright bad thing to associate them with real value.
The letting players cash out early thing is something that happens maybe once a year if someone has an emergency and needs to leave early and we don't want to just take all their money. Not a regular part of the game structure.
Now I see maybe you meant you're not sure how much the $20 buys you if you aren't guaranteed the full pot if someone leaves early. But that really hardly ever happens. And you also never know how many re-buy-ins there's going to be so the pot can end up way larger than the initial headcount.

Think of a poker tournament like say, a tournament playing Monopoly. 4 players make a $20 bet to see who wins. In monopoly, each player starts with $1,500 in Monopoly money.
See how the real cash invested at the start of the tournament has nothing to do with the game money?

Basically the game you’re playing is a cash game , with increasing blinds all night, with a winner-takes-all finish. Definitely unconventional, is there ever any consolation for coming in second?

 

[jumboshrimpz]

Think of a poker tournament like say, a tournament playing Monopoly. 4 players make a $20 bet to see who wins. In monopoly, each player starts with $1,500 in Monopoly money.
See how the real cash invested at the start of the tournament has nothing to do with the game money?

Basically the game you’re playing is a cash game , with increasing blinds all night, with a winner-takes-all finish. Definitely unconventional, is there ever any consolation for coming in second?

We've been playing this style for the last decade or so. I'm not sure if we have ever done a 2nd place prize in person. During covid, we went to weekly online games where we did pay out 2nd and sometimes 3rd depending on the final pot total (under $100, winner take all, over $100 3rd gets $10 and remaining split 80/20). Seems like what I'm looking for is a set that can accommodate low-stakes cash and tournament which I gather is a bit frowned upon to combine into one set or format here. Appreciate all the feedback though.

 

[4SUMERZ]

We've been playing this style for the last decade or so. I'm not sure if we have ever done a 2nd place prize in person. During covid, we went to weekly online games where we did pay out 2nd and sometimes 3rd depending on the final pot total (under $100, winner take all, over $100 3rd gets $10 and remaining split 80/20). Seems like what I'm looking for is a set that can accommodate low-stakes cash and tournament which I gather is a bit frowned upon to combine into one set or format here. Appreciate all the feedback though.

It comes down to whatever works and satisfactory to your playing group. Everyone on here have their own opinions, but it's good to get different perspectives and ideas to make the poker experience more pleasant.
Good Luck