Buyers / sellers be wary of tariffs (60 Viewers)

[DrStrange]

There is a significant chance of new and more aggressive tariffs being applied to international transactions. We all need to be contemplating who is going to be paying these taxes on chips that cross international borders. Note this goes both ways - into or out of the USA.

To date, "consumer level" trade hasn't been effectively subject to tariffs. e.g. you can buy straight from China and not see the taxing authorities about any duties you might owe. Or, you could reship from the USA to foreign destinations without much of a concern.

It doesn't have to be this easy way. Every package could end up in a customs warehouse. An employee of the External Revenue Service might need to open and inspect the packages and assess / collect the taxes if they weren't prepaid by the shipper. Yes, this can be quite slow. Ask some of our international members about how this sort of thing works in their nation.

Group buys need to be eagle eyed about this if the chips are being made / shipped internationally. Group buys can easily be thousands or tens of thousands of dollars. The legendary ones are six figures. Back in the good old days, the sponsor of the group buy either didn't fill out customs forms or lied about the transaction. No one seemed to care. Perhaps the future will be different.

Even someone coming / going to an international meet-up needs to be aware of how things work if they are carrying valuable chips. There are regulations about these sorts of "trade show" items.

Keep in mind these taxes are potentially "significant". The felony level sort of significant. We all need to be aware of the evolving law(s) when we deal with foreign transactions. Such fees need to be included in the pricing / negotiations starting soon if not already.

Ignorance of the law is no defense -=- DrStrange

 

[Eriks]

We all need to be contemplating who is going to be paying these taxes on chips that cross international borders.

Oh so now you guys wanna have that conversation?

 

[LowerBama1714]

Ship all your chips to me…I’ll hold them until this tariff thing blows over.

 

[BarrieJ3]

Almost all desired chips are stateside.

I think that in general, shipping overseas is bad for the overall market, as most non US/CAN chippers want their money back, and realist at *their* price, tacking on those fees they paid to get them. Add to that the shipper generally lying on a form with their signature, and the superflous amount of local buyers available, then add the issues around payments being off and PayPal holding $ until delivery because certain countries can only use G&S - it simply doesn’t make sense for US chippers to sell to chippers outside the US other than out of kindness/helpfulness.

Tl;dr: Y’all get real medical care and social safety nets, we get poker chips

 

[LotsOfChips]

Almost all desired chips are stateside.

Expect your Chanman table to increase in cost by 25% in the coming days, thanks to "Tariffs are the most beautiful word". And no, it won't be Tony paying the tariffs...

 

[BarrieJ3]

Expect your Chanman table to increase in cost by 25% in the coming days, thanks to "Tariffs are the most beautiful word". And no, it won't be Tony paying the tariffs...

Oh I’m on y’all’s side for sure. I’ve flown with 5 figures of chips to get them in without fees to Europe, I’ve been a reshipper station several times, etc.

But facts is facts, it’s easier to buy/sell in country. I def want a Chanman one day, but of course wanting the nice stuff plus the shipping and taxes plus as we add on tariffs and new stuff? It’s just becoming a tad cost prohibitive. But if you don’t have a chanman table, do you really get to wear a chipper pin/badge/lapel?

 

[TheWhat]

Has anyone shipped to or from Canada since the US began violating USMCA, and Round 1 of Tariffs took place? Just failed to complete a deal because of the uncertainty.

I am optimistic it doesn't matter for most, as almost all decline extra insurance, hence the standard value of $100 being selected, amd that value "was" previously exempt / ignored from additional duties / taxes.

But would love a first hand experience.

 

[ekricket]

Has anyone shipped to or from Canada since the US began violating USMCA, and Round 1 of Tariffs took place? Just failed to complete a deal because of the uncertainty.

I am optimistic it doesn't matter for most, as almost all decline extra insurance, hence the standard value of $100 being selected, amd that value "was" previously exempt / ignored from additional duties / taxes.

But would love a first hand experience.

You go first

 

[TheWhat]

You go first

Yeah, the limbo is the worst part ... I probably should have just done it. Maybe something will pop up again to tempt me.

 

[surfik]

We already have it in Poland...
Tarrifs introduced to fight off cheap goods from China now effecting shipments from USA and etc. Usually 27% VAT
and even after you proof that there are no valuables and/or new goods you need to pay "handling fees"...

 

[Bronson]

They got me this time, bastards!
Probably because TCR declared value of the parcel, but I might be mistaken.

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

From Europe, we were used to pay import fees for anything coming from outside.

The difference will be that US buyers will now have to pay fees to their authorities when importing goods.

#HaveYouSaidThankYouOnce

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

Almost all desired chips are stateside.

Certainly.

Impact will mostly be on plaques, "Tina" chips and non-US cards.

 

[ekricket]

From Europe, we were used to pay import fees for anything coming from outside.

The difference will be that US buyers will now have to pay fees to their authorities when importing goods.

#HaveYouSaidThankYouOnce

It’s really not the end of the world. Prices go up, what’s new? It may change in a month, we are still getting used to this European thing.

 

[ssanel54]

Paulson produced in Mexico. Might see them even less in Casinos now

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

@ekricket ,
Yes, as I said, we are used to it and tarriff have never pevented anyone to buy oversea.
For European buyers, it'll not change anything. So nothing new, at least for us.

 

[ekricket]

Paulson produced in Mexico. Might see them even less in Casinos now

I have a feeling casino supplies might become exempt…..

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

Paulson produced in Mexico. Might see them even less in Casinos now

Did not thought about that one indeed.

 

[drdr]

I have a feeling casino supplies might become exempt…..

Tax deductions for business expenses could happen. Maybe.

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

I have a feeling casino supplies might become exempt…..

As the one who annonces tarriff is a casino owner, it might be possible indeed.

 

[Bronson]

I had multiple parcels from US and never pay a shilling for it, this must be a case of a high value of goods or just a case of “random parcel” got docked. However I haven’t pay that much before, usually would be a £50 top!

 

[LotsOfChips]

As the one who annonces tarriff is a casino owner bankrupter, it might be possible indeed.

FYP...

 

[DrStrange]

In the USA, the de minimus exception for consumer use is $800 per parcel. Not only aren't we taxed on our packages, but our packages also aren't opened or inspected. That's why foreign narcotics often come into the country via parcel post. Who needs a complicated drug mule plan when you can just drop off a package of drugs in the mail? This "personal choice" exception to global tariffs seems likely to be gone in a matter of a few months.

We send our chips all over the world. Occasionally foreign governments do inspect the box and/or charge taxes, but it wasn't that way in the USA. My post/thread is a caution that international "chipping" as we know it seems likely to change. Delivery will be slower and more expensive. There may be tariffs owed. The taxing authorities might not be willing to accept the sender's assertion that the market value is low. Agreeing who is paying the tariff might become a sticking point.

Group buys are especially at risk for unexpected taxes. Almost all the chip makers are foreign. The group buy's pricing was set pre-tariff. It isn't small amounts of money either. The tariff might be 25% - 33% or more on top of what the buyers anticipated paying.

This is a first world problem. Even so, there might be some hard feelings about slow / missing deliveries and unexpected taxes on chips. I hope people are talking about this before it becomes a problem -=- DrStrange

 

[Kid_Eastwood]

Agreeing who is paying the tariff might become a sticking point.

When international buyers buy from the US it has never been a question.

Why do you think it'll be become a sticky point now ?

 

[BNads86]

No seller has ever offered to pay the duties/import fees I incur when buying chips, nor did I ever consider asking. That would be the responsibility of the buyer as far as I'm concerned?

 

[Eriks]

Non US sellers watching US buyers discussing who should pay their import taxes:

 

[DrStrange]

Americans are sometimes naive, inexperienced and feel entitled. It might not cross their minds a set of chips would come with a formidable consumption tax levied by the USA. Group buys are especially tricky because the organizer is potentially being hit with an unexpected tax burden and the down stream buyers are being asked to foot their fair share of the additional costs.

 

[TheWhat]

No seller has ever offered to pay the duties/import fees I incur when buying chips, nor did I ever consider asking. That would be the responsibility of the buyer as far as I'm concerned?

Yep, I think @DrStrange is trying to make aware that the US Government is likely to begin charging tariffs, which the importer, or buyer in our scenario would be responsible for.

 

[upNdown]

Americans are sometimes naive, inexperienced and feel entitled. It might not cross their minds a set of chips would come with a formidable consumption tax levied by the USA. Group buys are especially tricky because the organizer is potentially being hit with an unexpected tax burden and the down stream buyers are being asked to foot their fair share of the additional costs.

In the past, group buys were actual group buys with the organizer taking no profit. But now that group buys have evolved into for-profit ventures, I wonder if attitudes have changed, in the case that something unexpected happens.

 

[LeGold]

I had multiple parcels from US and never pay a shilling for it, this must be a case of a high value of goods or just a case of “random parcel” got docked. However I haven’t pay that much before, usually would be a £50 top!

The rules for import are pretty clear, so you either got lucky before or the customs form was not filled out truthfully.

https://personal.help.royalmail.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/7208/~/help-with-paying-customs-fees