Fournier EPT Marking Problem (1 Viewer)

[OzzieJim]

I picked up a 12 pack of Fournier EPT Playing cards at a reasonable but still pretty high price. They have nice designs, shuffle, pitch and slide well.

But I could absolutely never reccomend them because they are so easily marked. I cannot get through a single session without replacing cards, to the point where I think I'm going to need to put a fresh deck in every week. My players aren't total rock apes but every few hours another card has a very visible fingernail mark on it. This has happened every session for four weeks with different players, and it's clearly not intentional as there's no rhyme or reason to the marking.

How on earth can people fawn over these cards when they are quite simply not fit for purpose vis a vis card security?

 

[SaleFin]

I picked up a 12 pack of Fournier EPT Playing cards at a reasonable but still pretty high price. They have nice designs, shuffle, pitch and slide well.

But I could absolutely never reccomend them because they are so easily marked. I cannot get through a single session without replacing cards, to the point where I think I'm going to need to put a fresh deck in every week. My players aren't total rock apes but every few hours another card has a very visible fingernail mark on it. This has happened every session for four weeks with different players, and it's clearly not intentional as there's no rhyme or reason to the marking.

How on earth can people fawn over these cards when they are quite simply not fit for purpose vis a vis card security?

Where did you buy the cards? Could you post a picture? In general, these cards should be durable. How much did you pay for them?

 

[OzzieJim]

Where did you buy the cards? Could you post a picture? In general, these cards should be durable. How much did you pay for them?

Bought them from Jack's Poker which is an Australian poker supplier retailer. Paid $215 AUD for the 12 box. They are 100% genuine product and the issue has been across more than one deck.

Will post pictures in the morning.

 

[JMC9389]

Sounds like a problem with your players rather than the cards themselves. I've hosted probably 50 times since 2019 and have not once noticed a marked card. And I use Fourniers pretty regularly.

 

[surfik]

Make your players trim their nails... That is not a joke

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

Unsure if its this you mean? I agree, they show up pretty regularly but this may be the culprit.

https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/poor-card-capping-technique.93623/

 

[OzzieJim]

Unsure if its this you mean? I agree, they show up pretty regularly but this may be the culprit.

https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/poor-card-capping-technique.93623/

This is very much what they look like. I only have one player that uses a chip to protect his cards, so I will keep an eye on this. I think they are fingernail marks though.

I will note that this hasn't been an issue over several years with COPAG, Desjgn, Da Vinci or Chips and Games cards.

So regardless of it potentially being a player behaviour issue, it is clear that the Fourniers are far less robust than other cards.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

This is very much what they look like. I only have one player that uses a chip to protect his cards, so I will keep an eye on this. I think they are fingernail marks though.

I will note that this hasn't been an issue over several years with COPAG, Desjgn, Da Vinci or Chips and Games cards.

So regardless of it potentially being a player behaviour issue, it is clear that the Fourniers are far less robust than other cards.

It could be the way they're being peeked. I saw the same thing and thought it was odd, we don't use cappers very often either. Don't know, bummer because they're my favorite feeling cards.

 

[Machine]

So regardless of it potentially being a player behaviour issue, it is clear that the Fourniers are far less robust than other cards.

I would also check to see which card specifically is having the issue, if its all paint cards you might have a different problem

 

[upNdown]

Sounds like a problem with your players rather than the cards themselves. I've hosted probably 50 times since 2019 and have not once noticed a marked card. And I use Fourniers pretty regularly.

100% this. I’ve had this problem with decks from many different brands. Because it’s not a deck problem, it’s a people peeking problem.
Don’t hate the cards, hate your players.
(Fourniers are not less robust than copags. You’ve handled them; you must know this.)

 

[OzzieJim]

I would also check to see which card specifically is having the issue, if its all paint cards you might have a different problem

No it's all manner of things. I have had to replace a Qd, 2d, 9c, 9s, 9h, 3s, 4s twice etc. totally meritless if marking to cheat.

100% this. I’ve had this problem with decks from many different brands. Because it’s not a deck problem, it’s a people peeking problem.
Don’t hate the cards, hate your players.
(Fourniers are not less robust than copags. You’ve handled them; you must know this.)

I generally use a fresh setup each month. For a year of using Copag Elites I replaced one card. The Desjgns, Da Vinci's lasted their month. C+G had one marked card after a month of use.

I am into my third red deck and second blue deck in 3 weeks and there's so many butchered cards after my session yesterday that I can't be bothered replacing individual cards anymore.

I will check the card capping thing though. That player will be away for the next few weeks so it should be pretty indicative.

 

[OzzieJim]

It could be the way they're being peeked. I saw the same thing and thought it was odd, we don't use cappers very often either. Don't know, bummer because they're my favorite feeling cards.

At first I thought it was Chinese players because of their tendency to have longer fingernails and peek from the side "baccarat style", but I didn't have any Chinese players yesterday and it was by far the worst session for marking.

 

[Irish]

What you may be dealing with isn't a card durability issue, but a card flexibility issue combined with players that are used to more flexible/flimsy cards. You can lay a pair of Kem or Copag cards and fairly effortlessly lift a corner to peak at your cards and the rest of the card lays flat with little to no pressure in the card back. Do that same motion with any heavier card stock (Fournier, Modiano, NTP, Desjgn, etc) and the rest of the card will lift up when you peak. The player isn't used to this and compensates by pushing down too hard on the card back, and in a manner that can easily mark the card - fingernail, or even just the tip of your finger in the wrong spot may mark them.

A little education/awareness on the issue should go a long way in fixing the problem.

 

[Josh Kifer]

100% this. I’ve had this problem with decks from many different brands. Because it’s not a deck problem, it’s a people peeking problem.
Don’t hate the cards, hate your players.
(Fourniers are not less robust than copags. You’ve handled them; you must know this.)

This is the generally quickest way we ruin decks at my game. Pulling corners while capped destroys any deck. Taken out many copags.