Full inlay replacement: challenges of vinyl vs. paper - my thoughts (1 Viewer)

allforcharity

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So, fellow chippers, I'm in the midst of preparing a bunch of chips to accept textured stickers (from @Gear, natch), and I wanted to share some observations regarding removal of vinyl and paper.

Specifically, my project involves turning CdM 1's into CDI98 25 cent fracs, CdM 200's into CDI98 $5000 (of which I have already done 180, detailed elsewhere), and CdM 50's into CD98 $25000. All the CdM 200's I had previously done all had vinyl inlays, as did the CdM 1's I recently received. Imagine my surprise when I discovered that about 75% of the CdM 50's I've done so far (60 done, 45 to go) had paper inlays!

I will not go deep into the general process, as there are already good threads on inlay replacement, with many pictures and video, but will summarize my experiences as follows:

a) Vinyl inlays

As you are peeling away the laminate layer with your pliers, it is generally considered a good sign if the vinyl inlay underneath completely or partially pulls away with the laminate. This indicates that the epoxy holding the inlay to the chip surface is very weak, and will likely pull off using just your fingers or maybe with some light scraping, which may be made easier with the nail polish remover (aka NPR, I prefer non-acetone). Vinyl inlays are easy to remove when the epoxy is weak because the vinyl does not tear as easily as paper (it wants to stay in one piece), and has flexibility and maintains integrity when being lightly stretched. Since the vinyl is non-porous, the NPR is basically there to help dissolve the remaining epoxy and give a little lubricant layer to allow your cutter to slide between the inlay and the chip surface. It is best to pull from a piece of inlay that you've pried up from the outer edge.

If the vinyl inlay does not pull away with the laminate, you know that the epoxy bond is still strong so you're going to have to do a lot of scraping to get the vinyl off, and it is extremely unlikely to come off in one, or even a few, big piece(s). Scraping a vinyl inlay off the surface of a chip takes the longest time and requires a lot of small, precise, and forceful movements. Because of the need for applied force, be aware to avoid damaging the chip unnecessarily (by gouging into it, or slipping and marking the mold or other surface elements toward the rim).

b) Paper inlays

Paper is obvious because it is fibrous. There are basically three layers of paper that go into an inlay. The top surface, of course, has the printed part, then there's a middle layer, and the bottom layer is epoxied to the chip surface. Most of the time the top printed layer will come off with the laminate, and if not (or not completely) then it is a fairly simple process to rip the rest off with your fingers, or it can be softened up with a little NPR first. Because the inlay is porous, the NPR now acts as a lubricant and helps to separate the paper layers from each other, and also separate the fibres from within each layer. So, after the printed paper layer comes off, you can add a couple drops of NPR right onto the second layer and then do a quick, strong scrape with your cutter to remove the second layer, which will quickly gum into a wet ball at the end of your blade, which is fine because it will keep you from damaging the edge of the recess as you keep scraping. Seriously, it is almost impossible to do wrong here, you can scrape with wild abandon, no precision needed.

After the second paper layer is scraped off, you're left with a small amount of the third layer still adhered to the chip. You've probably already scraped away a certain percentage of the third layer in the last step because you will see the base chip colour through gaps in the white paper layer. You will need a couple more drops of the NPR to coat the third layer before scraping that off as well, but the remaining thin layer comes off fairly easily. It just takes a little bit more time and a little more precision, but very little force. Paper labels rarely come off as neatly as vinyl labels, as it is difficult to remove every single visible fibre from the chip surface, especially those in the corners of the recess.

All-in-all, it is a time-consuming process no matter how you do it. In general, I see a wider range of time required per chip for vinyl, whereas paper seems to be more predictable.

Vinyl inlay removable (both sides) takes me about under 2 minutes per chip if the epoxy is weak throughout, or over 4-5 minutes per chip if the epoxy is very strong.
Paper inlay removal is essentially a scrape-fest, but less precision required, and it take me about 3 minutes per chip.

I'd be very interested if people have similar, or indeed perhaps contrary, experiences in this regard.
 
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Good summary. Round vinyl is infinitely easier/faster than paper. Shaped paper inlays are a nightmare time suck...but shaped inlays>all so it’s worth the hassle?

Some murder victims
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I just find that correctly done, you can often get vinyl to peel off in one go with your fingers.

Paper type ones generally tear and need the nail polish remover to get them off, unless you want to sit and scrape for ages.

Generally new paulsons are super easy to do, and old ones suck.
 
Is the impression for the shaped inlays formed when the chip is pressed or some other way?
 
Is the impression for the shaped inlays formed when the chip is pressed or some other way?
Yes, the depression in the base chip (whether circular or shaped) is created by diplacement of the clay from the thickness of the inlay during compression.
 
Good info!! Thank you for that:)

Going to turn these AS $100s into CDI $100s!
View attachment 356511View attachment 356512
I'd say your technique is wrong (or at least suboptimal) the way those look.

Try cutting the pie shape out and ensuring that the blade slightly scores the chip underneath the inlay (don't go too hard though).

If you do it that way, you are more likely to have the underneath part of the label peel off in one go.
 
I'd say your technique is wrong (or at least suboptimal) the way those look.

Try cutting the pie shape out and ensuring that the blade slightly scores the chip underneath the inlay (don't go too hard though).

If you do it that way, you are more likely to have the underneath part of the label peel off in one go.

Oh it was my first time ever attempting this, so Im not surprised with the outcome thus far. As long as the end result looks good, thats all I care about!

I have 40 AS $20 chips that I will be converting to CDI $20 chips, so I will attempt your technieqe on those.

Thank you!
 
Oh it was my first time ever attempting this, so Im not surprised with the outcome thus far. As long as end result looks good, thats all I care about!

I have 40 AS $20 chips that I will be converting to CDI $20 chips, so I will attempt your technieqe on those.

Thank you!
Wrong was probably the wrong word lol sorry. The end result of yours will be perfect, but you will learn as you murder more, that certain cutting techniques will lead to a quicker overall removal time.
 
Wrong was probably the wrong word lol sorry. The end result of yours will be perfect, but you will learn as you murder more, that certain cutting techniques will lead to a quicker overall removal time.

No apology needed! I hope so! It wasn't easy the way I was doing it.

I simply made one cut from the top, to the center of the label. Then I was able to slide the point edge of my knife under the clear laminate, but above the vinyl label. Then lift the knife ever so slightly, and part of the laminate would pop up. Enough to the point I could pull the lamination off with my fingers.

Now all I need to do is add a few drops of Non-acetone NPR, and get the vinyl label off!
 
I've not had the pleasure (?) of attempting inlay removal on relatively new chips. All the chips I've done inlay removal on so far are probably about `15-20 years old.
 
No apology needed! I hope so! It wasn't easy the way I was doing it.

I simply made one cut from the top, to the center of the label. Then I was able to slide the point edge of my knife under the clear laminate, but above the vinyl label. Then lift the knife ever so slightly, and part of the laminate would pop up. Enough to the point I could pull the lamination off with my fingers.

Now all I need to do is add a few drops of Non-acetone NPR, and get the vinyl label off!

This is the method I used on a rack worth of chips, it has to be one of the fastest ways of doing in. Just one cut, lift, and peel. Little bit of npr to loosen the vinyl inlay left behind.
 
I've not had the pleasure (?) of attempting inlay removal on relatively new chips. All the chips I've done inlay removal on so far are probably about `15-20 years old.
It's a pleasure lol because they come off in no time
 

So just pulled out 2 of the HSIs last night, one of them the vinyl came off with the laminate. Wondering:

  • Should I take off the laminate everytime, as your video?
  • Or is it worth the effort to try and cut through laminate + vinyl at the same time?

Also, can I trouble you for the type of NPR you are using, outside of Non-Acetone, is there anything else I need to worry about?
 
So just pulled out 2 of the HSIs last night, one of them the vinyl came off with the laminate. Wondering:

  • Should I take off the laminate everytime, as your video?
  • Or is it worth the effort to try and cut through laminate + vinyl at the same time?

Also, can I trouble you for the type of NPR you are using, outside of Non-Acetone, is there anything else I need to worry about?

I don't understand the first question. You must take off the laminate before you can take off the inlay proper. If you're lucky enough the inlay pops right off with the laminate, then celebrate! I understand this happens much more often with brand spanking new mint Paulsons (like the NAGB chips) as well as CPC chips (because they use less epoxy).

You don't have to try to cut through the laminate and vinyl (or paper) at the same time. But it does give you a small lip to start your peeling/scraping work with. Don't worry about small gouges into the face of the chip - this will be covered up by the laminated sticker, which will be thick enough not to conform to the gouge. Just watch out that you don't slip your knife/scraper past the recess area and damage the mold of the chip.

Happy customizing!
 
I don't understand the first question. You must take off the laminate before you can take off the inlay proper. If you're lucky enough the inlay pops right off with the laminate, then celebrate! I understand this happens much more often with brand spanking new mint Paulsons (like the NAGB chips) as well as CPC chips (because they use less epoxy).

Don't worry about small gouges into the face of the chip - this will be covered up by the laminated sticker, which will be thick enough not to conform to the gouge.

Happy customizing!

Thanks for the extra info! I've had a good amount (Small sample size lol) where the inlay has come off at the same time as the laminate, if I go slow. Was wondering what I was doing different, but I'll just count my lucky stars haha.
 

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A tale of 2 Barrels, after removing the laminate.

$100s the best removal can be seen laying out front.

$25s furthest left pile (6) has inlay left on both sides. Middle Pile (7) inlay clean on one side, with others looking like chip in front. Furthest right pile (7) both sides inlay came off clean.

This gonna be fun, and gonna love the manual work put into them!
 

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And I think the chemical in the non-acetone nail polish remover I use is ethyl acetate. It does have a slight vinegary smell.
This is what I have been looking for, thank you. The only non-acetone i could find uses propylene carbonate and if it sits too long it starts leeching color, both from the chip and from the label onto the chip, so I've stopped using it. Now I know what to look for!
 

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