Tourney Hosting a Newbie Game (1 Viewer)

[emunster18]

I have recently been alternating cash games and tournaments each month. Most of my players are very new and make many mistakes that are amplified in a tournament setting.

As the host to these close friends, I don't want to always be placing in money and giving off the appearance of playing just to take their money.

Any advice you could give me as the host, to either mask losing occasionally, or improving the skill level of my attendees?

For reference - 2 Table Tourney, 12-16 players, maybe 2-3 experienced players + me. Payouts to top 4 places.

 

[ValueTown]

When I had new folks to poker, I kept it light and entertaining. Played more hands, called a wider range, and gave action. Allowed folks to learn, make mistakes but guided them back on track in order to have better poker etiquette in the future.

 

[allforcharity]

Don't play GTO. Raise smaller. Check to a weaker player's position. Don't show your bluffs unless you have to.

But you can't do this forever. People who want to play better will learn. Keep the stakes manageable low until then.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

Echoing previous advice. I also encourage people to fold. Sounds silly but I tell all my beginner's that most good poker players fold a lot! Seems intuitive to many of us, but to some casual players they'll pay anything to see a flop then fold. The game's started getting much better once my newbies figured out they have a fold button.

 

[demonnic]

I would run the occasional 'newbies only' tournament for people who'd been to 0-2 of our games before. Would just be a single table, and I would deal the entire tournament and facilitate play and give advice. This way I'm not invested in the tournament and my advice is no longer suspect in the same way it might be if I had money on the table. Plus it frees me up to pay better attention to what they're doing and figure out what advice might help get them off to a better start. Plus then when I tell them they can fold they don't think I'm just trying to bluff them

 

[emunster18]

Thanks for the advice. We keep it a friendly game and have fun with it. However, I fold a lot... just my nature after playing for 20 years...

We play $50 buy in for both the cash game and tournaments. I feel that's the most appropriate amount to keep this group interested without anyone being destroyed when the lose a buy-in or two.

I'll take the advice of playing looser myself, and advising players to fold more. I like the reference of, "The game's started getting much better once my newbies figured out they have a fold button."

 

[Sparkynutz]

Play limit for dimes or quarters. Lots more fun and more luck based cuz everyone stays in balancing the playing field a bit

 

[emunster18]

Play limit for dimes or quarters. Lots more fun and more luck based cuz everyone stays in balancing the playing field a bit

The problem with a game like that, is the splashy-ness would get out of hand with this group. It's bad enough at the moment, even with playing NL.

 

[Sparkynutz]

How is it splashy playing Limit? Lower the limit then.

 

[emunster18]

How is it splashy playing Limit? Lower the limit then.

Splashy, as in every player playing every hand. "Oh, I'll play, it only costs me one unit."

 

[SteveEH]

Most of my friends aren't interested in studying and improving their game, so I provide food and drinks so they're more or less breaking even if they lose.

Still, once in a while I give more action to fish by bluffing in the wrong spots or calling down light. I usually regret this after the same guy calls me down with garbage, rivers a flush or something, and doesn't see it till everyone else points it out

 

[Poker Zombie]

Not everyone will be interested in improving. Some players view poker the same way they view scratch-off lottery tickets, so no amount of help will improve their game. Still, most will want to improve just to be competitive.

Make a few comments about play - your play - during breaks. Let Player X know why you called his min-raise with 20 BB in the pot. This discussion alone will help player. The focus of the discussion should be on what you were doing right, not what they were doing wrong. This will start the conversation, and probably be discussed the entirety of the break.

Newbies go through levels.
Level 1: Joined because it is social. Every hand is a possible winner.
Level 2: Not every hand is a possible winner. You need at least a 10 or higher, or 2 suited cards. Pair of 10s or higher is always a call. You will lose stacks trying to bluff a Level 2 player, because they only see what they hold, not the betting-story told.
Level 3: This is the toughest level - understanding that you can be beat. Sure, you have trip aces, but there are 4 hearts on the board and none in your hand. At least pause before you call. It usually takes some discussion with another player to reach level 3.
Level 4: Student of the game. Whether through books, YouTube, or in-depth discussion, this is the final level of newbiedom. It might be poorly executed GTO, or T. J. Cloutier basics. The important point is they are no longer new, and have actual tools in their toolbox.

Open up the discussion. I've had a couple come over and Mrs Zombie and I finished every hand turning our cards face-up, letting the couple know why we did what we did. It's never about what they did wrong, so they never feel "humiliated" or "stupid".

 

[allforcharity]

Not everyone will be interested in improving. Some players view poker the same way they view scratch-off lottery tickets, so no amount of help will improve their game. Still, most will want to improve just to be competitive.

Make a few comments about play - your play - during breaks. Let Player X know why you called his min-raise with 20 BB in the pot. This discussion alone will help player. The focus of the discussion should be on what you were doing right, not what they were doing wrong. This will start the conversation, and probably be discussed the entirety of the break.

Newbies go through levels.
Level 1: Joined because it is social. Every hand is a possible winner.
Level 2: Not every hand is a possible winner. You need at least a 10 or higher, or 2 suited cards. Pair of 10s or higher is always a call. You will lose stacks trying to bluff a Level 2 player, because they only see what they hold, not the betting-story told.
Level 3: This is the toughest level - understanding that you can be beat. Sure, you have trip aces, but there are 4 hearts on the board and none in your hand. At least pause before you call. It usually takes some discussion with another player to reach level 3.
Level 4: Student of the game. Whether through books, YouTube, or in-depth discussion, this is the final level of newbiedom. It might be poorly executed GTO, or T. J. Cloutier basics. The important point is they are no longer new, and have actual tools in their toolbox.

Open up the discussion. I've had a couple come over and Mrs Zombie and I finished every hand turning our cards face-up, letting the couple know why we did what we did. It's never about what they did wrong, so they never feel "humiliated" or "stupid".

Newbies go through levels.
Level 1: Joined because it is social. Every hand is a possible winner.
Level 2: Not every hand is a possible winner. You need at least a 10 or higher, or 2 suited cards. Pair of 10s or higher is always a call. You will lose stacks trying to bluff a Level 2 player, because they only see what they hold, not the betting-story told.
Level 3: This is the toughest level - understanding that you can be beat. Sure, you have trip aces, but there are 4 hearts on the board and none in your hand. At least pause before you call. It usually takes some discussion with another player to reach level 3.
Level 4: Student of the game. Whether through books, YouTube, or in-depth discussion, this is the final level of newbiedom. It might be poorly executed GTO, or T. J. Cloutier basics. The important point is they are no longer new, and have actual tools in their toolbox.

Thanks for posting in explicit detail how I've never evolved beyond a solid level 2 noob. I might as well wear a shirt that says "Donator" at every game.

 

[emunster18]

Most of my friends aren't interested in studying and improving their game, so I provide food and drinks so they're more or less breaking even if they lose.

Still, once in a while I give more action to fish by bluffing in the wrong spots or calling down light. I usually regret this after the same guy calls me down with garbage, rivers a flush or something, and doesn't see it till everyone else points it out

I have run 2 tournaments with this group and ended up taking 2nd both times. I folded the nuts once just so I wouldn't stack multiple people in a big pot...

 

[PokerSTLplayer]

I have recently been alternating cash games and tournaments each month. Most of my players are very new and make many mistakes that are amplified in a tournament setting.

As the host to these close friends, I don't want to always be placing in money and giving off the appearance of playing just to take their money.

Any advice you could give me as the host, to either mask losing occasionally, or improving the skill level of my attendees?

For reference - 2 Table Tourney, 12-16 players, maybe 2-3 experienced players + me. Payouts to top 4 places.

Patients helps and sounds like it is needed!

 

[Preditor]

Any advice you could give me as the host, to either mask losing occasionally, or improving the skill level of my attendees?

Similar here for my home game: lots of recreational players, and few people who want to learn. We're 18 months in and most still don't know the oversized chip rule. But these are my friends, and I love playing with these hooligans (it's my favorite night of the month).

Personally, I am not a fan of capping your play, but that is up to you. My feeling is it's not right to chastise someone for "playing bad" (as long as they're not holding up play). Why should you be be chastised for playing well? If people buy in, they should be able to play how they want to play.

My advice would be two-fold:

FIRST: Make the stakes the cost of an average night out on the town. They shouldn't be "nothing", but they should be the cost of dinner and a movie/concert. The exact cost of this will depend on your season of life. Are you in college? That could be $20. Are you middle-class professionals? That may be $50-100.

I believe this is the most imortant thing to a casual home game. People will want to win... but even if they don't, they paid $50 to play poker for a dinner, and a few hours of good fun. They would have spent the same amount of money (if not more) going out on the town.

SECOND: Make alternate ways to make money outside of the prize pool. For my game, the buy-in is $45 total. That's $30 to the prize pool, $10 for a bounty, and $5 for Bad Beat. I offer one $20 rebuy to the first break, and a 5K add-on for $10 at the first break. The most someone can lose is $75 in one night.

The bounties are $10 per knockout ($20 on the previous month's winner), and the Bad Beat is $5 per player, winner take all (it ends at the second break). With 8 players, winning the Bad Beat can be $40, which is nearly our full buy-in amount. With the exception of maybe one game, each winner of the bad beat has not made the money that night.

With those two items, it keeps the recreational players not so much caring who wins or who loses, as long as they're having FUN... even fun while losing. But it's also not SO low stakes they're playing like total maniacs. I have won 3 months in a row once, and other people have won 2-3 times in a row. No one has ever complained.

 

[emunster18]

Thanks for the commentary. I have been hosting cash games the past couple months, but will be doing another tournament in November. We ran a mystery Bounty tournament last time, and it was a lot of fun. $50 buy-in ($40 to pot, $10 to bounty). I kicked in some scratch off tickets, so the mystery bounties were $5 ticket, $10, or $25, and I gave a boobie prize to the first person out.

The bounties make it fun for those who don't make the money. Planning on 2 tables, likely 14-16 players.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

I gave a boobie prize to the first person out.

wat

 

[emunster18]

wat

First person out of the tournament wins a scratch off ticket too. Last month, 2 people went out on the same hand, so double the booby prizes!

 

[Labrat]

Nothing wrong with double boobies.