Pocket Queens, out of possition seven way. (1 Viewer)

[DrStrange]

We are playing $0.25/$0.50 ($20 max buy-in) eight handed. Hero is playing a lot of hands out of the blinds or UTG. The stacks are mostly short, leading to "easy" decisions without much implied odds / reverse implied odds. This is the next of several hands, which are not being posted in order of occurrence.

Cast of Characters:

Almost everyone is playing this hand. All of the villains but one is passive and loose. Stacks range from $10 to $60. Hero has $30. More details later.

The hand:

Hero sees five players limp to him plus the big blind. Hero is the small blind and looks down to see

Hero raises to $3.50 and everyone calls. Ick! Seven way action, $24.50 in the pot. Effective stacks are no more than Hero's $26.50.

Flop is

What should Hero do? Shove all in / check call / check fold ?

 

[upNdown]

Most people miss the flop. A bet of $7 will get rid of most of them.

 

[mummel]

Check fold if the bet is more than $3.50. That K is going to own you.

 

[Kain8]

Seven way action with an overcard to your pair? Easiest check/fold ever.

 

[SemiNumerical]

Check fold
1 persons range you are good.
7 peoples ranges you are looking for another Q.

Almost certain you are up against a K-10, K-J, maybe even a K-9.

The hands you might be head of in this spot are A-Q, A-J, A-10, J-10

Most flops miss most hands, problem is you have many hands that need to miss for you to be good.

 

[upNdown]

You guys are right, but the odds aren't THAT bad.
As far as a king goes, there's probably like what, a 25% chance that nobody has one?
And even if they do, it could be with a low low kicker that some squeamish person might fold.

 

[SemiNumerical]

You guys are right, but the odds aren't THAT bad.
As far as a king goes, there's probably like what, a 25% chance that nobody has one?
And even if they do, it could be with a low low kicker that some squeamish person might fold.

Sure,

but what about someone playing 9-9, 8-8, 9-8, got to factor those is too.

Also, what card are you comfortable seeing on the turn that is not a Q?

A 6, 7, 10 or A on the turn and you are now in a tough spot, even with 1 caller

 

[jbutler]

Heads up and a lot of times 3 handed I'm leading out, but this is a check fold all day and twice on whatever day it was that you were playing.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Check with the intention of folding.

Mayyyyyybe there could be more to say about this hand if the flop checks around, but let's give that a chance to happen first. (Even then, meh from worst possible position.) Anything else, and it's time to regroup for the next battle.

 

[upNdown]

I guess my thinking is that if it checks around and EVERYBODY gets another card, I have no chance at this hand. But if a raise knocks out most people, I might want to play it out.

 

[DrStrange]

Hero doesn't much room for maneuvering with a $24.50 pot and a $26.50 stack

 

[AlPresidente]

checkfold

 

[thorwilliam]

Agree with check fold.

 

[Jimulacrum]

I guess my thinking is that if it checks around and EVERYBODY gets another card, I have no chance at this hand. But if a raise knocks out most people, I might want to play it out.

If it were HU to start, sure, that's a time to maybe play it out.

When it starts 7-handed and we thin it to HU on the flop, that player who stuck around probably has us crushed 99% of the time.

 

[Adam Crowley]

Obvious check fold. It also means you could probably raise larger pre flop. When you get dealt KK next hand make it $5.

 

[cgraham86]

Agree with the check-fold, but only because of the opening pre-flop raise and the stakes you're playing at. Is 5 limps plus 5 calls of a slightly-than-larger-than-pot size bet normal for this game? Me's starting to think the stakes are too small for the players. Opening bets sound more like $5-$6, but of course that almost commits you to a post-flop move regardless of what the flop texture is, so your stacks are small relative to the action. This sounds more like a $.50/$1 game.

 

[DrStrange]

The stakes are too small for some players, even some of the weakest. But the weakest players are getting slaughtered for several thousand dollars a year because they play 80+ sessions a year. It is a curious tension, they feel the losses cumulatively but have a great time and want to play. They aren't losing important money but are not too far off their collective pain threshold.

I spread $0.25/$0.50 ($20 max buy in), $1/$1 ($100 max buy in) and $1/$2 (match the biggest stack buy in) to cater to a wide range of player interests. if the players wanted a "bigger" low stakes night, I would reluctantly accommodate them. But I am relatively sure a markedly higher loss rate isn't good for my game.

 

[Adam Crowley]

A bit off topic but how do you choose what game you play in? I assume your a winner in all of the games you spread?

 

[DrStrange]

second Saturday = $0.25/$0.50 ($20 max)
fourth Saturday = $1/$1 ($100 max)
Random Fridays depending on interest and schedules = $1/$2 (match the biggest stack if desired)
fifth Saturday = dealers choice or mixed games $1 to $4 spread limit played with only $1 chips (a lot of one dollar chips)
Tuesday = $0.25/$0.50 ($20 max, spread limits $0.25 to $4) mixed games not hosted by me.

Works out to be about 40 games a year at my house and another 50 games hosted elsewhere. My plate is full, but I still have plenty of room for new sets in the rotation. Right now some sets get over used (the ones with $0.25 chips)

 

[DrStrange]

*** Any takers? ***

Hero checks followed by four more checks. Our one aggressive player makes a stab at the pot, betting $15. The button folds and we are back to Hero with four others behind him.

Should Hero fold or push his stack in?

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

Fold. Even if aggro guy doesn't have a king, you still have four others behind you who could be slow-playing one. Wait for a better spot.

 

[upNdown]

Fold. Even if aggro guy doesn't have a king, you still have four others behind you who could be slow-playing one. Wait for a better spot.

I agree with that. I'm a folder now, but I'd be annoyed that I didn't raise it first.

 

[ChipTalker]

i'm in the check fold camp

 

[Jimulacrum]

Still folding. Terrible spot for queens.

 

[SemiNumerical]

Queens are almost as bad as 2-3 in this spot.

You are beaten almost all of the time here. Easy fold.

 

[DrStrange]

*** Results ***

Hero folds as does everyone else. We don't get to see villain's hand.

 

[SemiNumerical]

that leads me to believe that villain had something decent,

If it were a stone cold bluff, or even middle pair, in a 7 person pot, pushing that many people out, at least at my games, people would show a non top pair hand all day.