Tournament AQ vs ?? (2 Viewers)

[p5woody]

This hand has been bothering me. I am not a professional player and have lots to learn.

Here is the situation, I am playing in a 10 player tournament - 100 buy-in. We are down to 5 players, they pay top 3 (600,300,100). Playing last hand at 400/800, blinds will go to 500/1000 next hand. starting stacks 10,000 - approximate current Stack sizes Player 1 - 45,000, me - 17,500, player 2 - 17,000, player 3 - 8000, player 4 - 8000

The cast of characters are all solid winning players. They play a combination of home and casino games. We have a $30 monthly league of 30+ players and these are the top 6-7 players plus a few players that won't waste their time in $30 dollar games.

Here is the hand:
Player 1 (the big stack) - first to act folds
Me - I look down at AQ unsuited, I decide to do a small raise to 2200
Player 2 - re-raises to 5000
Player 3 and 4 both fold the blinds.

Action is back on me: 8400 in the pot, 2800 to call
Player 2 is a solid player but I would not say he is a great player, probably one of the weaker players at the table, but weak is relative. He has been getting big hands and they have been holding. My thoughts: I don't think he is bluffing, so he has a hand. I am thinking pocket pair (AA-99), AK-AJ. Also possible to have KQ suited type of hand but thinking he would just call with hands like that. So does this sound like a reasonable range and should I call/fold/raise?

 

[Frogzilla]

The weird sizing of the raise- could be setting up a flop jam. Are you going to call it off if you flop top pair? If so, call pre could be ok. If not, either all-in or fold now, and it feels close

 

[Mr Tree]

This hand has been bothering me. I am not a professional player and have lots to learn.

Here is the situation, I am playing in a 10 player tournament - 100 buy-in. We are down to 5 players, they pay top 3 (600,300,100). Playing last hand at 400/800, blinds will go to 500/1000 next hand. starting stacks 10,000 - approximate current Stack sizes Player 1 - 45,000, me - 17,500, player 2 - 17,000, player 3 - 8000, player 4 - 8000

The cast of characters are all solid winning players. They play a combination of home and casino games. We have a $30 monthly league of 30+ players and these are the top 6-7 players plus a few players that won't waste their time in $30 dollar games.

Here is the hand:
Player 1 (the big stack) - first to act folds
Me - I look down at AQ unsuited, I decide to do a small raise to 2200
Player 2 - re-raises to 5000
Player 3 and 4 both fold the blinds.

Action is back on me: 8400 in the pot, 2800 to call
Player 2 is a solid player but I would not say he is a great player, probably one of the weaker players at the table, but weak is relative. He has been getting big hands and they have been holding. My thoughts: I don't think he is bluffing, so he has a hand. I am thinking pocket pair (AA-99), AK-AJ. Also possible to have KQ suited type of hand but thinking he would just call with hands like that. So does this sound like a reasonable range and should I call/fold/raise?

Calling is out here with a third of your stack going in. This is an all in or fold situation IMO. Tournaments are high variance and you can’t be afraid to push your chips when they blinds start to escalate (which they are.) AQ is the number one elimination hand at the WSOP but it is still a quality hand. Against the range you have assigned to villain you are in a good spot. I say shove and embrace the variance. This seems like a prime spot to me. Many of the pairs that are 50/50 to you such as 99 and 1010 may sit down to an act of aggression as well.

 

[upNdown]

If your read is good, and it sounds like it is, then you’re behind. If he were all in at 5k, I’d call. But here, I don’t mind laying this down, keeping my 15 bigs, and waiting for a better spot.

 

[Forty4]

AQ is the number one elimination hand at the WSOP

Could have used this tip a few weeks ago...

But yeah like above it’s all or nothing at this point.

 

[Mr Tree]

Could have used this tip a few weeks ago...
View attachment 188964View attachment 188963


But yeah like above it’s all or nothing at this point.

Clearly your mistake here was getting it in ahead. Rookie move.

 

[colter ripton]

I'm not folding here. I probably jam.

If you call and wiff the flop then maybe you can get away from it if he goes all in. This would leave you with 10.5bbs.....not great but manageable because of everyone's realativly short stacks. If you do call and hit an A or a Q high board you have to go with it.

I would say raise>call>fold

Aq is a pretty strong hand when your short stacked and down to 5 players. I would probably reccomend just putting it all in.

 

[BGinGA]

Pre-flop 5-handed with those stacks:
all-in >> call >> raise >> fold.

As-played, I'm jamming, but would rather not be in this spot. Can't just call that much of your remaining stack out-of-position.

 

[CraigT78]

 

[p5woody]

Okay, I think I have given this enough time. I thought for a few minutes, my first thought was I should probably fold because I am behind to any pocket pair. However, I have a tendency to play too tight and I have been trying to play a little more aggressive, so my 2nd thought was to shove in my stack. I counted out my stack and decided I still had 10BB left and still have a playable stack if I don't catch and I fold after the flop. so I call

The flop comes Q,5,2 with two diamonds, I have the Ace of diamonds. I am first to act, now what?

 

[Jonesey07]

Jam it.

 

[DrStrange]

That's among the best flops Hero could hope for. Hero should be willing to play for stacks. But I am not in the jam camp. I think Hero should trap and check. Villain could find a fold with much of his losing range if facing an all-in. Let's give villain a chance to c-bet bluff off a pile of chips.

Note that Hero is never going to escape when he is behind. The whole idea is getting something of value from villain when villain is drawing to three outs or less. I am ok with risking a 2-3 out free card in hopes of getting a bluff from villain.

 

[colter ripton]

Well it's about the best possible flop you could hope for. Gotta jam it.

Maybe check / jam if you think he might fold to an open jam. Either way got to get it in there with a Q high flop.

 

[BGinGA]

Check-call/jam, jam most turns (if no diamond, A, or Q) if he checks back.

Since you passively called, give him a chance to shove his Jacks, Tens, or Nines.

 

[Mr Tree]

Don’t even try to reason out if you might be behind here. At this stage in the tournament with your investment and what you hit you are playing for your stack no matter what. What you want is to give villain every opportunity to put it in with bad hands. A jam only gets called by hands that think they are winning. A c-bet from villain will likely pot commit him so try to let him hang himself.

 

[Forty4]

Think I’d rather jam now. If he folds and I take down the pot right now great if he calls not the worst case either. If it goes check check and then what happens on the turn? You’re probably jamming there anyways so let’s skip the inevitable and take action now.

 

[Mr Tree]

Think I’d rather jam now. If he folds and I take down the pot right now great if he calls not the worst case either. If it goes check check and then what happens on the turn? You’re probably jamming there anyways so let’s skip the inevitable and take action now.

I think the reason not to jam here is because most hands you are beating will fold so you don’t gain much besides taking the pot down now. If this was a cash game I like that but in a tournament I want to take your stack when I am in this position because I don’t know that I will get a better shot at it.

 

[ChaosRock]

Pre flop, as Dave said, shove is the best option IMO as well. Once Villain raised and committed half his stack, there's no fold equity anymore. I don't like limping almost ever, and wouldn't do it here the limp/calling routine. Not folding pre also so the only option is to shove IMO.

As played, I don't care for the shove on the flop. Everything that would call you would bet if you check. And if you check/call the shove, you have the advantage of picking up some bluffs also.

 

[Mr Tree]

Pre flop, as Dave said, shove is the best option IMO as well. Once Villain raised and committed half his stack, there's no fold equity anymore. I don't like limping almost ever, and wouldn't do it here the limp/calling routine. Not folding pre also so the only option is shove IMO.

As played, I don't care for the shove on the flop. Everything that would call you would bet if you check. And if you check/call the shove, you have the advantage of picking up some bluffs also.

Holy shit, Paulo agreed with me. Maybe I’m learning.

 

[ChaosRock]

Holy shit, Paulo agreed with me. Maybe I’m learning.

Or maybe I am learning?

 

[Mr Tree]

Or maybe I am learning?

Dr Strange agreed with us too so probably we are both learning.

 

[UKS]

I check, then he jams. Then I call. Then he shows KK.

 

[BGinGA]

Then you hit your ace, queen, or diamond and say nice play.

 

[Forty4]

So what happens if the flop is check check? I only ask because the plan is to check call/jam. I’m not saying the plan is wrong but as stated he’s committed most of his stack already will be getting ~2/1 on the jam, blinds go up next hand also is he going to lay down 99-JJ, KQ in this spot? That’s the range that @p5woody has him on, sure AJ & AK go away.

 

[Jimulacrum]

If your assessment of his range is 99–AA and AK, AQ, AJ, then it's a fold preflop. You're a 3:1 favorite against one of those hands, a big dog against half, and a coin flip against the rest.

As played, check the flop with the intention of getting some of Villain's worse hands to c-bet or shove, as others have said. Betting sets you up to only get action when you're beaten/tied. If he checks behind, consider checking the turn as well, setting up a suspicious shove on the river that he may be tempted to call with all kinds of hands.

 

[PlaidDragon]

The flop comes Q,5,2 with two diamonds, I have the Ace of diamonds. I am first to act, now what?

You know of his play as "solid". Does he know of your play as "too tight"?

Depending on the answer to that and given his pre-flop 3-bet, I'd say his range is a mid to high pair or a suited hand to the A or K. The nightmare scenario is that he'd have 5,5, but would he 3-bet pre-flop with that? I generally wouldn't.

My inclinations are to check-raise or shove... leaning towards the former. If it goes check-check, that's fine and we can re-assess at the turn.

 

[p5woody]

I am viewed as a solid tight player I believe, I do very well in the league but haven't played the $100 game before. So a little history but not a lot of direct play against this opponent.

My thoughts - I think about checking but don't like to give free cards and what happens if another diamond comes? So I start to think about a raise, with stack sizes and pot size I think the only other option is shove it in and hope he doesn't have AA or KK.

Results: We count out the chips, I have him covered by 500 and he tanks for a little bit so I am feeling good. He then calls and turns over AA, but I still have outs right? Come on Queen, then the 4th ace hits the turn giving me top two but obviously still a losing hand. Time to play some cash

 

[Steve Birrer]

All this points out is how the first bet you make for a hand dictates how its going to play out. If you start with a mistake its tough to play correctly the rest of the way. Not shoving pre flop just makes it hard to figure out the right line the rest of the way.

But given the way it played I am with others post flop. Check and hope you get a bet then shove..

 

[p5woody]

I went back through all the comments.

My thoughts:
First decision - small raise to 2200, was hoping to either just pick up the blinds or get one of the blinds to shove with a weaker hand since they were short stacked. This backfired when player 2 re-raised with a stack equal to mine. I could have limped but then blinds could limp and if I don't hit the flop I have no idea what the blinds have. I could have shoved but then I am only getting called by a hand that has me beat pre-flop. This a major mistake? not sure if my logic makes sense

Second decision - what do I do with a re-raise? Obviously if I put him on AA,KK,QQ, AK I should fold. I am okay gambling if he has any other hand for 2800 at this point but didn't want to play for stacks since it is a coin flip against any pair. Even with the call if I miss the flop I can fold and still have a playable stack. Should I have put him on one of those 4 hands? Honestly my gut was telling me he had one of those hands, but like I said I am making an effort to loosen up to try to build a bigger stack and go for the win and not just to place. I probably should have shoved here but the result would have been the same, however not trying to be result oriented.

Third decision - Flop top pair with top kicker, after calling the re-raise no way I can fold now with that flop. I jammed but thinking about it now I think the check/jam would have the better play. Should have tried to trap, but obviously results would have been the same.

Thanks for all the feedback!

 

[ChaosRock]

I could have shoved but then I am only getting called by a hand that has me beat pre-flop.

The statement might be closer to the truth, however: 1-Good players with big stacks know that they should call small stack's shove light so you could get call by hands you beat, like AJ, AT, KQ, KJ (and even wider to include more As and Ks). 2-The shove is not so much about getting called by worse hands but more about forcing hands with good equity to fold. You pick up a ton of free EV from those hands that would be flipping or close to flipping against your AQ.