Understanding Logical Fallacies and Improving Respectful Discourse on PCF (1 Viewer)

davislane

davislane

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I think we all could benefit from taking the time to understand the following principles in relation to logical fallacies when engaging in discourse here on PCF and beyond.

Most discussions Ive witnessed that "breakdown" here on PCF suffer from many of the fallacies mentioned in this video


The video isnt all encompassing but is a good primer on the subject.

Got a "favourite" fallacy that isnt included feel free to share or any other technique to improve communication between members.
 
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Is this the thread to replace the thread that replaced that other thread?
Thanks Mods, for allowing us discourse?
 
bergs said:
Sometimes when I write “fuck” like “wow this is so fucking stupid” I’m actually not talking about the thread itself. I’m just thinking about @Josh Kifer. So next time i say fuck, remember, it’s not you, it’s Josh.
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You look like the new year's baby that's hopped up on steroids and human growth hormone.
 
bergs said:
Sometimes when I write “fuck” like “wow this is so fucking stupid” I’m actually not talking about the thread itself. I’m just thinking about @Josh Kifer. So next time i say fuck, remember, it’s not you, it’s Josh.
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They make t-shirts for this:

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FWIW, I think a lot of the conflict I’ve witnessed on here can be traced to semantics, especially with all the flipper talk.

Most members define PCF as a sort of social club, a means to interact with people they wouldn’t ordinarily meet, because they share a common interest: poker chips.

For these members, the PCF marketplace is a vehicle to buy, sell, and trade either partial or complete sets, usually for the purpose of aiding other members in their own projects (relabel, collections, fantasy sets, etc.).

Then, there are members who aren’t here for the social aspect of the forum. Those who aren’t looking for meet up games, aren’t building a set or collection for a specific purpose, and aren’t necessarily looking to make connections with other members.

For these members, the marketplace is a venue for making money, and the way you make money is by buying low and selling high. They don’t have the same motivations as the other members, and therefore don’t judge their interactions by the same moral or ethical standards.

I think there is room for both types of members on PCF. We might need to get a little more specific with etiquette regarding flipping chips you don’t personally have before you have them, but that’s a specific problem with a specific solution. I also think conflict arises when the expectations of one group clash against those of the other.

And, FWIW, I don’t think someone who joins this forum for the express purpose of making money is likely to accomplish that task, considering that a vast majority of members will recognize that, and not patronize them. Relationships are the engine that drives this machine. Without them, not even the most savvy businessman can expect to make a sale, let alone a profit. It’s just a bad business model.
 
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HughDrackman said:
FWIW, I think a lot of the conflict I’ve witnessed on here can be traced to semantics, especially with all the flipper talk.

Most members define PCF as a sort of social club, a means to interact with people they wouldn’t ordinarily meet, because they share a common interest: poker chips.

For these members, the PCF marketplace is a vehicle to buy, sell, and trade either partial or complete sets, usually for the purpose of aiding other members in their own projects (relabel, collections, fantasy sets, etc.).

Then, there are members who aren’t here for the social aspect of the forum. Those who aren’t looking for meet up games, aren’t building a set or collection for a specific purpose, and aren’t necessarily looking to make connections with other members.

For these members, the marketplace is a venue for making money, and the way you make money is by buying low and selling high. They don’t have the same motivations as the other members, and therefore don’t judge their interactions by the same moral or ethical standards.

I think there is room for both types of members on PCF. We might need to get a little more specific with etiquette regarding flipping chips you don’t personally have before you have them, but that’s a specific problem with specific solution. I also think conflict arises when the expectancies of one group clash against those of the other.

And, FWIW, I don’t think someone who joins this forum for the express purpose of making money is likely to accomplish that task, considering that a vast majority of members will recognize that, and not patronize them. Relationships are the engine that drives this machine. Without them, not even the most savvy businessman can expect to make a sale, let alone a profit. It’s just a bad business model.
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Very intelligent and on-point observation for somebody who's been here for just over six months.
 
HughDrackman said:
FWIW, I think a lot of the conflict I’ve witnessed on here can be traced to semantics, especially with all the flipper talk.

Most members define PCF as a sort of social club, a means to interact with people they wouldn’t ordinarily meet, because they share a common interest: poker chips.

For these members, the PCF marketplace is a vehicle to buy, sell, and trade either partial or complete sets, usually for the purpose of aiding other members in their own projects (relabel, collections, fantasy sets, etc.).

Then, there are members who aren’t here for the social aspect of the forum. Those who aren’t looking for meet up games, aren’t building a set or collection for a specific purpose, and aren’t necessarily looking to make connections with other members.

For these members, the marketplace is a venue for making money, and the way you make money is by buying low and selling high. They don’t have the same motivations as the other members, and therefore don’t judge their interactions by the same moral or ethical standards.

I think there is room for both types of members on PCF. We might need to get a little more specific with etiquette regarding flipping chips you don’t personally have before you have them, but that’s a specific problem with specific solution. I also think conflict arises when the expectancies of one group clash against those of the other.

And, FWIW, I don’t think someone who joins this forum for the express purpose of making money is likely to accomplish that task, considering that a vast majority of members will recognize that, and not patronize them. Relationships are the engine that drives this machine. Without them, not even the most savvy businessman can expect to make a sale, let alone a profit. It’s just a bad business model.
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I agree with about 99% of this. Very nice write up.

The only part that I don’t believe to be true is those that won’t patronize the money first crew. There are plenty of people, veteran and new, that know who the gougers are, but they just have to have the chips RIGHT NOW, and they knowingly and willfully take it over and over.
 
DMack said:
I agree with about 99% of this. Very nice write up.

The only part that I don’t believe to be true is those that won’t patronize the money first crew. There are plenty of people, veteran and new, that know who the gougers are, but they just have to have the chips RIGHT NOW, and they knowingly and willfully take it over and over.
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Point taken. I agree that, at the end of the day, money talks. There will always be a begrudging acceptance for known gougers who can provide access to highly desirable chips.

I also think that the most successful pure capitalists on here at least understand the difference between them and the social chippers, and take steps toward not violating the unwritten social norms of that group.
 
Machine said:
That vid is very hard to watch, and I enjoy the topic.

One of my favorites is Post hoc ergo propter hoc
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Wait. So you're telling me that wearing my lucky hat isn't the reason I win my poker games? It's all just a lie?
 
That should have been hidden under a spoiler alert, I haven't had breakfast yet!
 
DMack said:
There are plenty of people, veteran and new, that know who the gougers are, but they just have to have the chips RIGHT NOW, and they knowingly and willfully take it over and over.
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Agree, and don't think this is necessarily a bad thing.

As I've gotten older, I've come to value my time a lot more than my money. I've also come to value checking things off my list/getting shit done/moving on to the next thing.

And I've found that I've never regretted paying too much for something I liked and used, but have regretted missing out on things because I felt they were too expensive.

E.g., if I need one more barrel of not-easy-to-get chips to complete a set that historically have gone for $6/chip, but someone is selling them for $8/chip, I'm likely going to buy them, because $40 is worth the future time saved continuing to hunt for this chip as well as the peace of mind of no longer thinking about this set.

I'd add that if your goal is to make money, chipping is not the best use of your time :-)
 
Poker Zombie said:
You should not Log onto PCF. You will buy more chips than you need and then buy even more.

Slippery Slope argument. Therefore, the argument is invalid.

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Invalid, indeed.
:unsure:
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Clearly you have a problem. I am here to help by generously taking your 160 PCR v2 greens off your hands.
 
ninedeuce said:
Agree, and don't think this is necessarily a bad thing.

As I've gotten older, I've come to value my time a lot more than my money. I've also come to value checking things off my list/getting shit done/moving on to the next thing.

And I've found that I've never regretted paying too much for something I liked and used, but have regretted missing out on things because I felt they were too expensive.

E.g., if I need one more barrel of not-easy-to-get chips to complete a set that historically have gone for $6/chip, but someone is selling them for $8/chip, I'm likely going to buy them, because $40 is worth the future time saved continuing to hunt for this chip as well as the peace of mind of no longer thinking about this set.

I'd add that if your goal is to make money, chipping is not the best use of your time :)
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I understand what you’re saying, but there are still plenty that get screwed over by this behavior. As has been mentioned in several other threads, this site’s notorious eBay vendor targets what unsuspecting members are looking for. He bids the chips to the moon and goes after stuff he has absolutely no use for (straight from his fingers) then holds the members hostage in ridiculous trade demands or price gouging. This is where me and my friend @bergs totally agree…that type of POS behavior is a pure cancer.
 
DMack said:
As has been mentioned in several other threads, this site’s notorious eBay vendor targets what unsuspecting members are looking for. He bids the chips to the moon and goes after stuff he has absolutely no use for (straight from his fingers) then holds the members hostage in ridiculous trade demands or price gouging. This is where me and my friend @bergs totally agree…that type of POS behavior is a pure cancer.
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Agree 100%, no place for that kind of behavior!
 

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