Cash Game Asking for advice on hosting a cash game for the first time (2 Viewers)

[larch]

I’ve hosted No Limit Texas Hold’em tournaments on and off for over a decade now, but have never hosted (or even played in) a cash game. For the past year I’ve been hosting a pretty successful monthly tourney, and I’m planning on starting a monthly cash game night on a separate night of the month.

Right now, I’m planning on doing micro stakes (5¢/10¢) with a $10 min / $20 max buy in. I’m also wanting to introduce mixed games for something different, especially as I plan on this being the more social "let people talk" game as the tourney night gets bigger.

I’ve read a good bit of other posts here for advice, but I had some further questions after that. If my questions are answered somewhere else feel free to point me there.

My questions are:

1. With not having a cash game and tourney going on at the same time (because they’re on different nights), is it more acceptable to use a single chip set for both the cash game and the tourney?​

I mostly understand the “don’t use the same set for tourneys and cash games” recommendation, but I’m not entirely sure I understand all the caveats. The main thing I get as the concern is that chips can migrate from the tourney to the cash game. If I’m hosting cash games and tourneys on different nights, can I just confirm at the end of the night each time that I have all chips accounted for (which I’m already doing)? If any chips aren’t accounted for, I know I can’t use that set for the cash game going forward.

Once I figure out what works for my group (denoms/quantities/etc.), I plan on buying a nice dedicated set for my cash game based on that. Maybe that will enable me to get a custom CPC set sooner if I can get the chip quantities down lower than what I would need for tourneys…

I just purchased my first non-dice chips (Majestics) for my tourney setup, and would much prefer to use those for the cash game over the dice chips in the meantime. I think I can make either work for my expected stakes and group size. My poker table seats a max of 10, and it seems like most people only do 1 table for cash games anyway?

Here are the chip set breakdowns I have now*, and what quantities and values I was thinking of running for the cash game:

*The only chips I don’t currently own are the red Majestics, but would purchase those for the cash game if I am given the blessing to move forward with that setup lol…

2. What mixed games would you recommend starting out with, and how would you recommend introducing them?​

I was thinking of doing one type of game for an entire orbit before switching to a different game. Mostly I’m wanting recommendations on which mixed games to introduce in what order over time (for people used to No Limit Texas Hold’em).

Would it be best if I was a dedicated dealer (still playing) as we learn to play the new games?


I’m sure I’ve left out information that would be helpful to answer my questions, so ask away if there's anything I left out!

 

[satisfyingbutton]

Question 1

My first instinct is that you won't need that many nickels, regardless of which chips you use. 10 per player is plenty, in my experience. You are going to see them as blinds. Occasionally as limps. But a lot of bets will use the quarters instead. I usually go with 10 nickels and add two more to whatever quarter count I'm going with to "make up" the fifty cents. If you know that you are going to see a lot of limping, then 20 is probably fine. However, it sounds like this is a group that has played some decent level NLHE before.

I'd go with 10 nickels, 18 quarters, 5 ones for the first $10. Then anyone buying in for $20 gets the remaining amount in quarters and ones. Rebuys go with ones until they run out and then you dip into fives. You're unlikely to need bigger chips at this level.

Additionally, I wouldn't buy fives for your tournament set merely to run as a cash chip. If you wanted to run T5 tournaments too, then I could see that working. However, it seems like a layout of money that would best be put elsewhere.

Question 2

I think you should stay as the dealer unless you have other qualified dealers. Keeps things simple. I'd also start small for the first few mixed games. Omaha. Omaha 8. Pineapple. Super Hold 'em. Then you can start modifying from there.

 

[Machine]

Q1) You'll be fine for a few games while you figure it out.

Q2) I would introduce 3 games. SOHE, Tahoe Pitch and Role, 3 Hand Holdem (yes do orbits) - I would pass the deal shuffle behind.

 

[larch]

My first instinct is that you won't need that many nickels, regardless of which chips you use. 10 per player is plenty, in my experience. You are going to see them as blinds. Occasionally as limps. But a lot of bets will use the quarters instead. I usually go with 10 nickels and add two more to whatever quarter count I'm going with the "make up" the fifty cents. If you know that you are going to see a lot of limping, then 20 is probably fine. However, it sounds like this is a group that has played some decent level NLHE before.

Additionally, I wouldn't buy fives for your tournament set merely to run as a cash chip. If you wanted to run T5 tournaments too, then I could see that working. However, it seems like a layout of money that would best be put elsewhere.

Eh, it's definitely a more social group but more recently has gotten a few more serious players. There's still a decent amount of limping but that seems to be going away as more and more people join who are raising pre-flop.

 

[larch]

Q1) You'll be fine for a few games while you figure it out.

Q2) I would introduce 3 games. SOHE, Tahoe Pitch and Role, 3 Hand Holdem (yes do orbits) - I would pass the deal shuffle behind.

Thanks!

I just switched to shuffling behind, and it's so much better. I have no clue why I shuffled ahead for so many years

 

[satisfyingbutton]

Thanks!

I just switched to shuffling behind, and it's so much better. I have no clue why I shuffled ahead for so many years

If you've got folks who can shuffle, then going in orbits should be fine once you teach the game.

I agree with @Machine - keep the number of games to three or so, and don't forget to give them a palate cleansing orbit of NLHE from time to time.

 

[satisfyingbutton]

Thanks!

I just switched to shuffling behind, and it's so much better. I have no clue why I shuffled ahead for so many years

Also, IDAHO? What's going on here! @Josh Kifer, has this one been identified?

 

[Josh Kifer]

Also, IDAHO? What's going on here! @Josh Kifer, has this one been identified?

MORE IDAHOIANS..... sonofabitch. Nope. He snuck in. Get the pitchforks!

 

[larch]

MORE IDAHOIANS..... sonofabitch. Nope. He snuck in. Get the pitchforks!

 

[satisfyingbutton]

Sneaked in through the pan handle, I reckon!

 

[Goldfish]

My two cents……..
Post in thread 'Asking for one time donations...'
https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/asking-for-one-time-donations.73900/post-1497472

 

[LeLe]

1. With not having a cash game and tourney going on at the same time (because they’re on different nights), is it more acceptable to use a single chip set for both the cash game and the tourney?

It didn’t matter ultimately if you are using a mass market chips set as people can still buy them online and smuggle them in

It is just way easier to smuggle them if you are playing them on the same night you are playing tourney + cash

2. What mixed games would you recommend starting out with, and how would you recommend introducing them?

Do be aware that some mixed game can only be played up to 8 person, an experienced dealer will be preferred for first timer mixed game

 

[larch]

It didn’t matter ultimately if you can using a mass market chips set as people can still buy them online and smuggle them in

Oh... yeah, that's a great point

 

[allforcharity]

Just be sure to count put your chips after every game to ensure things don't go missing. Have ONE person handle all the cash and keep plenty of change handy to pay out accurately.

I personally don't sweat losing out on odd nickels, quarters, even dollars. But if I can't reconcile multiple $5s or higher constantly, it would bug the hell out of me.

The smallest variations on holdem would be easiest to introduce, like Pineapple and its variants. PLO-hi is not too bad, either.

 

[4SUMERZ]

I agree with most of those that replied. Keeping the smaller denomination chips to a minimum will give you less headaches and time consumption when counting for cashing out.
We play NL, dealer choice between Hold,em, Pineapple, and Big Omaha. Most of my table prefer Pineapple as the variation option.
When we first introduced the variations, we did trial test runs prior to starting the night to go over the rules and show how the game played.

Good Luck and have fun

 

[nevr2late]

I am hoping to start hosting one day. following...

 

[TX_Golf_N_Poker]

Late to the party. Did you get this resolved? Hopefully you've had a couple of successful cash games by now and you are ready to buy a dedicated set of cash chips.

I couple things I didn't see mentioned (might have missed) but I didn't see a lot of discouragement to using the chips both ways. Temporarily, sure. But hopefully not long term. For one, as a mostly cash player, it would drive me nuts not to have chips with the correct denominations on them. Especially if I was also coming to your tournaments and using the same chips with different denoms.

Also - this is PCF!!! Dammit! MORE CHIPS is the ONLY WAY!!! I will say, if you like majestics, there is a way to use one set for both cash and tournaments without doubling up with any one chip. Majestics have plenty of denoms. Are you doing T25 or T100 base tournaments? If T25, then buy Majestic nickel, quarter, $1 & $5 chips. Then buy one other denon and relabel it as a $20 chips for a high value chip, if you even need it. That way you won't have to use the $25 in both games. Or if you plan to stay with only nickel dime blinds, then just get plenty of $5s for your bank and you'll be fine. I play lots of nickel/dime and we almost never get enough on the table to need anything bigger than a $5.

 

[larch]

So far I've only had one cash night, I was actually just reviewing this thread for suggestions for our second cash mixed games night coming up next week. The first night was a blast for everyone who joined, but it definitely seems like getting some of the regular tourney-NLHE players to try out cash mixed games will be tough.

I definitely plan on getting a dedicated cash set once I've nailed down exactly what denoms/quantities I want and can afford to do so. May get my first CPC set as a cash set because I can get by with it being smaller/cheaper.

I do like Majestics for the price, but definitely would prefer real clay if money were no option (not to mention the time to acquire). For now I'll be using my Majestic set with dollar amounts as cents (I.E. the $25 chip is 25¢, the $100 chip is $1, etc.) and it should work out. It also gives me a way to test out how many chips I'll truly need (as well as buy some plaques...). I'm not running a cash game the same nights that I'm doing a tourney. If I do that, I'll use my old dice chips for the cash game on tourney nights for now.

I tried out 5¢/10¢ stakes with my first cash game night, but it seemed somewhat pointless as my group was constantly betting it up so much that I'm just going to switch to 25¢/25¢ blinds to make it simpler overall.

Going to do a set $25 buy in (100 BB) for all players, and then allow add-ons and rebuys between $5-$50 (20-200 BB). Any recommendations for when to start allowing add-ons? It seems silly to allow them as soon as the game starts.

Last time we played (in orbits):
- No Limit Texas Hold’em
- Pineapple
- Crazy Pineapple
- Super Hold’em
- Omaha (first time playing Omaha, didn't like it as much as I expected to)

I think for this upcoming game I'm also going to add in:
- Hollywood
- Double-Board Hold’em
- 3 Hand Hold’em

 

[TX_Golf_N_Poker]

So far I've only had one cash night, I was actually just reviewing this thread for suggestions for our second cash mixed games night coming up next week. The first night was a blast for everyone who joined, but it definitely seems like getting some of the regular tourney-NLHE players to try out cash mixed games will be tough.

I definitely plan on getting a dedicated cash set once I've nailed down exactly what denoms/quantities I want and can afford to do so. May get my first CPC set as a cash set because I can get by with it being smaller/cheaper.

Great choice going with CPCs!

I do like Majestics for the price, but definitely would prefer real clay if money were no option (not to mention the time to acquire). For now I'll be using my Majestic set with dollar amounts as cents (I.E. the $25 chip is 25¢, the $100 chip is $1, etc.) and it should work out. It also gives me a way to test out how many chips I'll truly need (as well as buy some plaques...). I'm not running a cash game the same nights that I'm doing a tourney. If I do that, I'll use my old dice chips for the cash game on tourney nights for now.

I tried out 5¢/10¢ stakes with my first cash game night, but it seemed somewhat pointless as my group was constantly betting it up so much that I'm just going to switch to 25¢/25¢ blinds to make it simpler overall.

Going to do a set $25 buy in (100 BB) for all players, and then allow add-ons and rebuys between $5-$50 (20-200 BB). Any recommendations for when to start allowing add-ons? It seems silly to allow them as soon as the game starts.

Yes, for relatively experienced players, 0.25/0.25 or even 0.25/0.50 makes for a much better game. I do play a lot of nickel/ dime too, but mostly with family members who only play a few times a year. And yes, a couple crazies can even bet up a nickel/dime game to get it a little juicy! But for my more experienced poker friends, we play 0.25/0.50 with a $40 buy-in.

The games I play usually allow add-ons up to some percent of the biggest stack. Most common is 50%. So in order to add on for more than the base buy-in of $25, somebody else has got to be up over $60. Usually for the first hour it's just rebuys at the initial amount when you go bust. Then once several people have busted out and bought back in, and someone starts to accumulate a big stack, then the limits for buying back in just naturally go up.

The reason for the 50% limit is - imagine that you were that guy who's been grinding away and has built your stack up from $25 to $50. How would you like it if someone else busted out, but then could come back in with a stack equal in size to the one you worked so hard to get?

Last time we played (in orbits):
- No Limit Texas Hold’em
- Pineapple
- Crazy Pineapple
- Super Hold’em
- Omaha (first time playing Omaha, didn't like it as much as I expected to)

I think for this upcoming game I'm also going to add in:
- Hollywood
- Double-Board Hold’em
- 3 Hand Hold’em

That's a good list. I've found that many of the popular circus games are based on Omaha, so I would recommend trying to get comfortable with it. It's a good game, but definitely has to be played differently from Hold'em. My favorite game is SOHE - Simultaneous Omaha & Hold Em. Also, are you playing pot limit with your mixed games? Some of them can get big fast if you don't. I suggest people get pretty comfortable with pot limit Omaha before tackling too many crazy mixed games.

 

[larch]

Also, are you playing pot limit with your mixed games? Some of them can get big fast if you don't. I suggest people get pretty comfortable with pot limit Omaha before tackling too many crazy mixed games.

Last game we only played No Limit, partially just to... limit... how many new variables I was introducing. Planning on introducing Limit versions this time, especially after I saw how big some of those pots got with all the increased variability with having more cards out there.

Do people tend to play specific games always as No Limit, Pot Limit, or Limit? For instance, I know Omaha is often played as PLO.

What recommendations do you all have on how we play the following games that our currently going to be in our repertoire?
- Hold’em
- Double-Board Hold’em
- Pineapple
- Crazy Pineapple
- Hollywood
- Super Hold’em
- Omaha
- 3 Hand Hold’em

For now, I've just been going off of how they're listed in Abby's Mixed Game Cards.

 

[TX_Golf_N_Poker]

I am absolutely NOT an expert on the mixed games. In fact, I only recently started playing them a little after resisting for awhile. I personally have a strong preference for playing only Hold'em and PLO. But I am starting to warm up on some of the mixed games, which you will typically hear referred to on PCF as circus games.

Having said that, all games other than hold'em that I have been involved with have been pot limit. I've not yet taken the fixed limit poker plunge except on one online group I play in where we played limit stud, and I did not care for it that one time.

 

[larch]

Also... being new to limit games: can players raise for *less* than the limit at any time? It seems like that'd be unlikely to occur (and if I'm understanding correctly against normal poker rules that I'm used to in tournaments).

But say in my game, my blinds are 25¢/25¢, with the small bet being 25¢ and the big bet being 50¢. If someone on the river bets 50¢, a player raising has to raise to $1, correct? And then the next raise has to be $1.50?

 

[Colquhoun]

Also with no-limit, players should be allowed to add on to their stack at any time (between hands)...up to the max buy in. For example, if the initial buy-in is maxed at $25, a player with only $9 left in a stack can add $16 between any hand.

 

[springbox]

Last game we only played No Limit, partially just to... limit... how many new variables I was introducing. Planning on introducing Limit versions this time, especially after I saw how big some of those pots got with all the increased variability with having more cards out there.

Do people tend to play specific games always as No Limit, Pot Limit, or Limit? For instance, I know Omaha is often played as PLO.

What recommendations do you all have on how we play the following games that our currently going to be in our repertoire?
- Hold’em
- Double-Board Hold’em
- Pineapple
- Crazy Pineapple
- Hollywood
- Super Hold’em
- Omaha
- 3 Hand Hold’em

For now, I've just been going off of how they're listed in Abby's Mixed Game Cards.

How familiar are your players with Omaha, and how do people feel about bomb pots? Typically we do one bomb pot an orbit for 3~5BB ea. Whoever has the bomb pot button decides the game and the stakes. People are always allowed to sit out bomb pots, after the game and stakes are decided. After each bomb pot the button moves right, when the dealer button reaches the bomb pot button you play a regular hold em hand then a bomb pot hand. Typically any Omaha style games are PL, but they can also be played as NL. Bomb pots are (not counting games you've listed)

5-2-2 (Five cards, 2 boards, 2 winners. Double board Omaha, Hi only, players get 5 cards each, winner of each board gets 1/2 pot. Also can play as 6-2-2 if you're a real sick fuck.)
Double Barrel (Double board Omaha, highest high wins 1/2 lowest low wins 1/2 either board.)
Drawmaha (Each player gets 5, flop is dealt. After flop you can redraw up to 3. 1/2 pot to best Omaha, 1/2 pot to best 5 in hand. Limited # of players for this one, 5 with no re-shuffling of mucked cards. Play draw up to 2 if you want to involve more people.)
Texaha (Each player gets 6. Before the flop you must designate 4 cards for Omaha and 2 for Hold em. If they touch your hand is mucked. Best Omaha hand wins 1/2, best Hold em hand wins 1/2)

and probably a few others I'm forgetting...

 

[springbox]

Also... being new to limit games: can players raise for *less* than the limit at any time? It seems like that'd be unlikely to occur (and if I'm understanding correctly against normal poker rules that I'm used to in tournaments).

But say in my game, my blinds are 25¢/25¢, with the small bet being 25¢ and the big bet being 50¢. If someone on the river bets 50¢, a player raising has to raise to $1, correct? And then the next raise has to be $1.50?

Wait, are you playing NLHE or Limit poker? There's no such thing as a small bet and big bet in NLHE, and in Limit poker those are the only amounts you can ever bet/raise. In regular NLHE the minimum bet is whatever the big blind is (25c in your example), and the minimum raise is however much the last player increased by (e.g. if the action is betting 0 to 25c the minimum raise is 25c. If the action is a 25c bet raised to 75c, the next minimum raise is to $1.25). The only exception is if your total stack is less than the legal raising amount, you can still go all in (e.g. the last raise was from $5 to $10 and you have $12.50. A legal raise is to $15, but you can still all-in for $12.50)

 

[larch]

How familiar are your players with Omaha, and how do people feel about bomb pots?

Only introduced Omaha last game, up until then no one had played anything but NLHE as far as I know. Haven't done bomb pots yet either. I've considered introducing them (and bounties to tourneys) at some point.

 

[larch]

Wait, are you playing NLHE or Limit poker?

Up until now, I/we've only ever played No Limit for anything. But with introducing some new mixed games that get kind of crazy I was planning on playing Limit versions of those.

 

[springbox]

Only introduced Omaha last game, up until then no one had played anything but NLHE as far as I know. Haven't done bomb pots yet either. I've considered introducing them (and bounties to tourneys) at some point.

Only thing I'd watch out for is it's very easy to gamble away your stack, especially when you're unfamiliar with bomb pots and since the minimum bet is raised to 3~5x what it would normally be. If your players are looking to splash around a bit more it's great, but if not maybe just do mixed games at regular stakes.

Up until now, I/we've only ever played No Limit for anything. But with introducing some new mixed games that get kind of crazy I was planning on playing Limit versions of those.

Okay, that makes more sense.

 

[Colquhoun]

If you switch to limit, don't be surprised if you get some complaints from players with made hands (AA, KK QQ) that get drawn out and lose to straights, flushes, etc.
The nature of the smaller bets means drawing hands will be getting the right odds to continue, and made hands will not be able to push them into making bad odds decisions. Players only used to NLHE may have a tougher time adjusting.

 

[TX_Golf_N_Poker]

Up until now, I/we've only ever played No Limit for anything. But with introducing some new mixed games that get kind of crazy I was planning on playing Limit versions of those.

I've just started a new local home group myself. We've met once and played only NLHE. I would be careful about doing too much, too fast. Next session I will ask them about adding PLO, and possibly a double board Bomb pot. I will probably just set a timer and play the bomb pot every 30 minutes. Then possibly reduce that to 15-20 minutes after I get a feel for if everyone likes it.

Personally, I would be sure everyone is comfortable with PLO (5-6 sessions) before moving on to circus games.