Big Pot Takedown & Quick Cash Out - How to Address? (2 Viewers)

[justsomedude]

I realize there are no "rules" for cash outs, only some general etiquette "guidelines" for keeping cash in play after scoring a big pot, but I'd like some advice to see how other people handle a situation like this...

Recently at one of my home cash games, a player who had been sitting a couple of hours and just kind of bouncing around his buyin amount ($40 or so), finally took down a very good sized pot with 2-3 people all in. He essentially ended up tripling up and immediately came to me to ask for racks for his $140 or so. I mean, RIGHT after the hand ended. I asked, definitely with a shocked expression (knowing he just busted a couple of players), "dude - are you really cashing out right now?!" He answered with a weird, "yea... I mean... not just yet... but I do have to go" kind of a response. He took his racks to his table, sat down, and started stacking chips.

The busted players came to me for rebuys and took their seats. The guy who busted them played a couple hands, I think vibe-ing that I wasn't happy about his cash out, but sure enough, he cashed out about one orbit later. This was about 2-3 hours into a 6 hour game night, so by no means was it "late." What makes this especially frustrating is this is one of the players I had judged as being a "more serious" poker player, with some respect for the game. He's not a direct friend of mine, but a friend of a friend who ended up being invited to my games, simply because he expressed interest in finding a "well run game" in town. He always complimented me on my hosting and game management, was always a calm and level head at the tables, and was always good with rules implementation, which again perplexes me as to why he would cash out after a big win.

A few players at his table made some comments under their breath, and only one player made a "formal" complaint. Basically pulling me aside after the game to tell me how "f*cked up it was" that Player X cashed out after taking so much money off other players. It really screwed up the dynamic of that table for the night, because so much cash had been taken out of play.

Anyway - here's the crux of my situation... this guy is still interested in my games, but I've received some off handed comments from people who don't want to see him again specifically because of his "rude" cash out. We've had two games since this event, and I haven't invited him, mainly to avoid a scene, or some one saying something out of line. If it was some a-hole, or another random guest player, I wouldn't even be in this boat, I'd just take him off the invite list and call it a day. ButI like this guy, and definitely want to give him another chance, but I fear the "dude - what you did was f*cked up and I can't have it at my games" conversation.

Do I contact him and let him know he pissed people off? Do I just not invite him again and leave it alone? What's the best way to handle this mess I find myself in?

Thanks in advance.

 

[manamongkids]

We have a couple rules since we generally play 1 table of NL .50/1

either a: let us know when you plan to leave when the night starts
b: give us a 15 minute notice
c: agree to give a one orbit notice


edit: I would let him know people were generally irritated and since its a smaller group, knowing his intentions up front are important, such as the ones I described above. maybe implement them in your game, otherwise he is free (and others) to do what they please if they win a big pot

 

[derekdd23]

There was nothing rude about his actions, in a cash game you can get up and go which is why people like to play it. If this was a constant behavior of hitting and running I might not ask him back, but he has every right to leave whenever he wants. I might not enjoy it when it happens, but I accept that when I sit at a cash table this can and often will happen. In home games this happens more infrequently since it is mostly the same player pool, but in the casinos I have seen this happen many times.

The real issue is that people like to complain about everything when they lose money. I think they need to be told that this is something that can and will happen and they need to get over it or start playing tournaments.

 

[ssanel54]

We usually play that its respectful to give an Orbits notice. However, would it have mattered if he had stuck around for a few more hours and never played another hand? Its the same thing. I think some people have the patience to play one hand a night and triple up and be happy taking their profits. Others want to play as many hands as they can because its fun.

If this is his normal MO, i would expect people to start folding every hand where he becomes involved and not letting him double/triple up...

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

I've found that honesty is the best policy. I would explain to him that while he has the right to cash out whenever he wants to, some people are going to be upset at what appears to be "hitting and running" at a home game.

 

[detroitdad]

I agree with all the etiquette statements above and I follow them when cashing out (so do most of my friends). At least he did play for a couple of hours.

Once we had a chick triple up on the 4th hand I think (not even one orbit) then cash out and leave. The host (not me) never invited her back.

 

[Ghoti]

If I were him I'd much rather be told that I screwed up and get the chance to redeem myself then just never get an invite again. If he's cool like you think he is he'll most likely appreciate it.

 

[guinness]

I had this exact thing happen to me. Here are the cliffs:

• Guy frequently emailed me about all things poker. I too, took him as a semi-serious player/reg in life which is good.
• Guy would come to my games which normally go 8-12 hours, he always cashed out an orbit after winning a big pot within 2 hours of playing.
• Guy always stayed longer if he wasn't running well, but would sit ultra rock and not play hands.
• He accidentally told me he was throwing a similar cash game at his house (he lives 15 mins away). Said its with a certain group of friends and coworkers and something "you wouldn't be interested in". Okay watever fu.
• I took him off the invite list, he wasn't that cool a personality either, kinda toolish.

If he ever contacts me about a game, I'm telling him I took him off the list because seats are sacred and I need to lock them up for players who are in for the long haul which clearly he isn't. I did this after he pulled his cashout bullshit a 3rd time. I don't care if people cash out after a big pot, but when they do that repeatedly and the sun isn't even down yet for a Friday night game thats kinda awful.

 

[bonesnjnts]

I realize there are no "rules" for cash outs, only some general etiquette "guidelines" for keeping cash in play after scoring a big pot, but I'd like some advice to see how other people handle a situation like this...

Recently at one of my home cash games, a player who had been sitting a couple of hours and just kind of bouncing around his buyin amount ($40 or so), finally took down a very good sized pot with 2-3 people all in. He essentially ended up tripling up and immediately came to me to ask for racks for his $140 or so. I mean, RIGHT after the hand ended. I asked, definitely with a shocked expression (knowing he just busted a couple of players), "dude - are you really cashing out right now?!" He answered with a weird, "yea... I mean... not just yet... but I do have to go" kind of a response. He took his racks to his table, sat down, and started stacking chips.

The busted players came to me for rebuys and took their seats. The guy who busted them played a couple hands, I think vibe-ing that I wasn't happy about his cash out, but sure enough, he cashed out about one orbit later. This was about 2-3 hours into a 6 hour game night, so by no means was it "late." What makes this especially frustrating is this is one of the players I had judged as being a "more serious" poker player, with some respect for the game. He's not a direct friend of mine, but a friend of a friend who ended up being invited to my games, simply because he expressed interest in finding a "well run game" in town. He always complimented me on my hosting and game management, was always a calm and level head at the tables, and was always good with rules implementation, which again perplexes me as to why he would cash out after a big win.

A few players at his table made some comments under their breath, and only one player made a "formal" complaint. Basically pulling me aside after the game to tell me how "f*cked up it was" that Player X cashed out after taking so much money off other players. It really screwed up the dynamic of that table for the night, because so much cash had been taken out of play.

Anyway - here's the crux of my situation... this guy is still interested in my games, but I've received some off handed comments from people who don't want to see him again specifically because of his "rude" cash out. We've had two games since this event, and I haven't invited him, mainly to avoid a scene, or some one saying something out of line. If it was some a-hole, or another random guest player, I wouldn't even be in this boat, I'd just take him off the invite list and call it a day. ButI like this guy, and definitely want to give him another chance, but I fear the "dude - what you did was f*cked up and I can't have it at my games" conversation.

Do I contact him and let him know he pissed people off? Do I just not invite him again and leave it alone? What's the best way to handle this mess I find myself in?

Thanks in advance.

Had this happen in our home game about a month ago. The villain is a nice guy. Plays pretty tight and usually isn’t involved in big hands often. Most know to get out of the way when he bets the turn.

Our game is .25/50 and most guys nurse their first buy-in for as long as possible. He does also. If he loses his buy-in he usually leaves. It’s okay. He’s spacey and we always have to wait on him. He bets weird bet sizes. He’s annoying. Mostly a losing player. But he fills a seat.

Game started at 9 and at 1015 he has about 3 buyins in front of him—quite the heater.
He stands up to leave.
“where you going?”

This doesn’t happen very often in our game.
I felt bad to speak up because as nice as he is, that money is leaving the table really early.
someone asked me if I thought he should have to stay.
yes.
then the host speaks up that it was mentioned to him that he said when he sat down he would be leaving early. the other 8 guys didn’t hear it.
our host is even nicer than the leaver—i still wonder if he just had his back.

so…
now in our game, if the entire table knows you’re leaving early, fine.
if you decide to leave early without saying it earlier, you have to give 30 min notice.

 

[BiGGyT]

A semi-friend of mine was sitting at a game with me and took down a large pot about 2 hours into a 8-10 hour game, announced he was leaving in 1 orbit "because there was a guy waiting to play". Needless to say, I got bitched at, he does not get an invite anymore, and Karma hit him as he lost those winnings at Harrah's Cherokee a few days later AND got a speeding ticket on the way home.

I always give a time I intend to leave, and then update when it is 1 hour, then 1 orbit. Hell, I feel bad leaving a limit table with out an orbit notice.

 

[ssanel54]

We don't really talk about the opposite situation, but it happened at our neighborhood game a few weeks ago. As I mentioned previously, we have an unwritten/but spoken rule that you should give at least an orbits notice before you cash out.

Anyway, we had a cousin of one of our regulars join us this evening. Good guy, and a few of us have played with him a few times before in a different game. after about 4 hours of play the guy that invited him to play cashes out, having given notice, and his cousin decides he wants to stay (they came separately). He's down a few buy ins at this point, but nothing crazy. Over the next hour or so he gets hot and builds his stack up to around $800. After winning a big hand he asks if he can cash out. The host, who knows him pretty well says "we typically announce our exit an orbit in advance" He says "thats fine, but Im not going to play another hand"

Next hand, He may have been a blind or limped or just forgot, but he ends up playing. I don't remember any of the board action, and it doesn't really matter. He ended up getting sucked into a mental game with the host, where he made a hero call on the River with A7 thinking the host was trying to push him around when he actually had KK. He dumped about $250 needlessly, and goes on tilt.

Very next hand he is Dealt AA and of course raises. I end up flopping a set and busto! He walked out with that 1000 yard stare, and no one heard from him for days.

 

[Mr. Cheese]

I've always just had a half hour notice rule. People generally know if they have someplace to be after poker so there is no reason (pending an actual emergency) that someone can't plan 30 minutes ahead for their desired cash out. Never had an issue doing it this way and leaves no hard feelings with the remaining players.

 

[DrStrange]

I preface my remarks that I am assuming the host isn't turning away players because all the seats are locked up. I have different advice if a player leaving early makes the game short handed and/or a full session player wanted the seat but got told no room was left.

The host makes a mistake if he lets this 'hit and run' situation into an issue. Losing players need to book a win from time to take. I have never known a winning player to make a practice of leaving early to lock in a win, only the losers. Not only doesn't the early departure bother me, I congratulate the winner as I walk him/her out the door. Let's not kid ourselves, making someone stay longer is a naked attempt to take their money before they leave. And knowing how much worse bad players play with a deeper stack, losing is much more likely than not. " better to shear the sheep many times than slughter the sheep once."

I encourage the host (and the winning players) to try and tamp down ill will. It is good for the game to let the bigger suckers walk away early with a big pay day. That money isn't going anywhere, the player is almost always coming back. The host should not fan the flames of discourse, nor should he use the invite list as a tool to push the early departure. (and if the player wasn't good for the game prior to "hit and running", why was he/she still on the invite list in the first place?)

Please do not make this an issue. "Hitting and running" is a wise decision by a player who helps fund the game. Let him have his occasional victory.

DrStrange

 

[detroitdad]

I preface my remarks that I am assuming the host isn't turning away players because all the seats are locked up. I have different advice if a player leaving early makes the game short handed and/or a full session player wanted the seat but got told no room was left.

The host makes a mistake if he lets this 'hit and run' situation into an issue. Losing players need to book a win from time to take. I have never known a winning player to make a practice of leaving early to lock in a win, only the losers. Not only doesn't the early departure bother me, I congratulate the winner as I walk him/her out the door. Let's not kid ourselves, making someone stay longer is a naked attempt to take their money before they leave. And knowing how much worse bad players play with a deeper stack, losing is much more likely than not. " better to shear the sheep many times than slughter the sheep once."

I encourage the host (and the winning players) to try and tamp down ill will. It is good for the game to let the bigger suckers walk away early with a big pay day. That money isn't going anywhere, the player is almost always coming back. The host should not fan the flames of discourse, nor should he use the invite list as a tool to push the early departure. (and if the player wasn't good for the game prior to "hit and running", why was he/she still on the invite list in the first place?)

Please do not make this an issue. "Hitting and running" is a wise decision by a player who helps fund the game. Let him have his occasional victory.

DrStrange

Hadn't thought of it like that. Again, its not an issue that I've had to deal with. If I do, I will adapt this.

I have had new guys ask about cashing out and if there is a rule. I tell them no. I do say that its generally polite to give at least a short notice.

Well said DrStrange.

 

[pltrgyst]

There was nothing rude about his actions, in a cash game you can get up and go which is why people like to play it....

In a casino, yes -- but not at my home games. Home games generally don't have "wait list" players hanging around to fill empty seats. If you sign up for a seat, it's from start time until midnight, minimum (the games usually run later). If you advise that you must leave at an earlier time when you request the seat, others take priority.

I make that clear to all my players -- it's in the printed house rules. One hit-and-run, and you're not invited back.

-- Larry

 

[Kyle]

I think only a losing player should be off the hook and allowed to take off to leave "early" in a home game. If they don't want to hang out and are light on funds, then that makes sense to leave. There isn't much to do when you are broke.

I think in a home game guests should be prepared to play for the night. Or the time frame you had posted.

The main reason is, is when one leaves, it makes the game smaller and nobody really likes to play the majority of the night short handed when you expected 8-9 players or whatever. In most cases it screws up the entire evening for everyone else. That is very selfish to me.

Then the night could be set up for distaster. If one gets up to leave after a big win, the next winner will want to get up and leave. Then everybody will get up! It will be anarchy!! Sorry I got carried away....Ha ha.

Most home games I play and or host generally start at night say 6:00 or 7:00 at night. When I commit to playing, I know that I will stay until midnight or so. That should be the norm for everyone in my opinion if you aren't a major loser.

Some circus home game group busts my balls when I want to leave before 2am. Quite honestly, I get tried after 12:00am. If the game isn't fun for me after that timeframe, I want to be able to go home without judgement win or lose. I think that is why I choose not to play there as much.

The real point is to be around friends and enjoy each other's company during that timeframe. If you set a timeframe, poker guests should plan on being there during that timeframe. If they give you notice before the game then that is ok. At least you can plan accordingly.

But to play for 1, 2, or 3 hours during a 6-8 hour timeframe after a big win and then they want to leave is bullshit in my opinion.

I would let that person know what the etiquette is ahead of time next time if he wants to become a regular in a your home game.

Just explain to him it ruins it for the rest of the group because of the short handed table.

My 2 cents.
Kyle

 

[derekdd23]

In a casino, yes -- but not at my home games. Home games generally don't have "wait list" players hanging around to fill empty seats. If you sign up for a seat, it's from start time until midnight, minimum (the games usually run later). If you advise that you must leave at an earlier time when you request the seat, others take priority.

I make that clear to all my players -- it's in the printed house rules. One hit-and-run, and you're not invited back.

-- Larry

I myself have never hit and run in a live game, but understand that weaker players will.

To me a home game is one with no rake and all relatively close friends. If someone gets up early, their friends will ridicule them and will almost always say something to them at the time. Also it is less likely to happen since all intentions are usually made ahead of time.

Once rake is involved, or the game is public for anyone to join I dont think it is ok to set rules on when people can or cannot leave. I also dont think it is ok to punish a person for doing so. In the games I play in, there is nearly always a waiting list unless it is really late. In these games people often make fun of the person who does this, even if they announced ahead of time they were leaving.

 

[bonesnjnts]

I preface my remarks that I am assuming the host isn't turning away players because all the seats are locked up. I have different advice if a player leaving early makes the game short handed and/or a full session player wanted the seat but got told no room was left.

The host makes a mistake if he lets this 'hit and run' situation into an issue. Losing players need to book a win from time to take. I have never known a winning player to make a practice of leaving early to lock in a win, only the losers. Not only doesn't the early departure bother me, I congratulate the winner as I walk him/her out the door. Let's not kid ourselves, making someone stay longer is a naked attempt to take their money before they leave. And knowing how much worse bad players play with a deeper stack, losing is much more likely than not. " better to shear the sheep many times than slughter the sheep once."

I encourage the host (and the winning players) to try and tamp down ill will. It is good for the game to let the bigger suckers walk away early with a big pay day. That money isn't going anywhere, the player is almost always coming back. The host should not fan the flames of discourse, nor should he use the invite list as a tool to push the early departure. (and if the player wasn't good for the game prior to "hit and running", why was he/she still on the invite list in the first place?)

Please do not make this an issue. "Hitting and running" is a wise decision by a player who helps fund the game. Let him have his occasional victory.

DrStrange

thanks for the calming comments.

i realized that it wasn't the money leaving that kinda tilted me, but that the game felt short handed when he stood to leave

either way---thanks

 

[abby99]

Short handed is relative. A couple of weeks ago we played 3-handed from 7pm until around 3:30-4:00 the next morning. Had one of us decided to leave early, THAT would have been a short-handed game.

 

[justsomedude]

Short handed is relative. A couple of weeks ago we played 3-handed from 7pm until around 3:30-4:00 the next morning. Had one of us decided to leave early, THAT would have been a short-handed game.

I usually end up doing this with a couple of the night owls from my regular game nights. We dig the three handed... or we're addicted to poker. One or the other.

 

[bergs]

Fuck me, wait a minute....you can fucking leave while you still have chips? Seriously?!?

 

[abby99]

I usually end up doing this with a couple of the night owls from my regular game nights. We dig the three handed... or we're addicted to poker. One or the other.

Or both . . . (y) :thumbsup:

 

[Mental Nomad]

+1 to the good Doctor's comments.

The people at the table who are complaining are just finding a target for the bitterness of their losses. Truth is, it's also possible that the big winner, if he stayed, if the tightened up a little, might just run them over with the big stack - they could just as easily lose even more, but all they can think about is their "chance to win it back."

If you congratulate the "winner" and encourage them to come back, they do... but they do so thinking they're a better player than they are, and playing for a repeat performance. It doesn't usually help their game.

Now, if you have the kind of game that tend to break up as soon as it gets a little short-handed, that's another story... and if someone is bad for the game for other reasons, well, they're bad for the game. But I don't hold by the "you won so you can't cash out" idea.

That said, most players who plan to leave before we close down do, in fact, declare it ahead of time. (Often as not, they declare it again, later... and then again, later...)

 

[Poker Zombie]

As most of you know (or could know from other threads), I'm a firefighter. I work 24 hour shifts, frequently with little more than catnaps during the nights I'm on shift. That means that if I'm playing poker the night after I came off shift, I've been awake for 41 hours. I'm turning into a pumpkin, and am probablly playing as such. I hate to be the one to leave and break the game, but c'mon man - I'm drooling on the table.

I always leave early when I have to work the next night as well (more likely I'll just decline the invite). I would occasionally encounter a co-worker who would chuckle at this because he wasn't afraid to stay up all night before shift.

He is no longer employed by our, or any other, fire department.

So winning or losing, sometimes you just have to accept that a player will cut out of a cash game early. Advance notice is probablly preferred (I usually announce 1 more hand, but after this thread I may announce 1 more orbit), but they may be holding on as long as possible.

Don't let it be an issue. We're not all night owls.

The people at the table who are complaining are just finding a target for the bitterness of their losses. Truth is, it's also possible that the big winner, if he stayed, if the tightened up a little, might just run them over with the big stack - they could just as easily lose even more, but all they can think about is their "chance to win it back."

...and that. Revenge shouldn't be a requirement in your game.

 

[bergs]

As most of you know (or could know from other threads), I'm a firefighter. I work 24 hour shifts, frequently with little more than catnaps during the nights I'm on shift. That means that if I'm playing poker the night after I came off shift, I've been awake for 41 hours. I'm turning into a pumpkin, and am probablly playing as such. I hate to be the one to leave and break the game, but c'mon man - I'm drooling on the table.

I always leave early when I have to work the next night as well (more likely I'll just decline the invite). I would occasionally encounter a co-worker who would chuckle at this because he wasn't afraid to stay up all night before shift.

He is no longer employed by our, or any other, fire department.

So winning or losing, sometimes you just have to accept that a player will cut out of a cash game early. Advance notice is probablly preferred (I usually announce 1 more hand, but after this thread I may announce 1 more orbit), but they may be holding on as long as possible.

Don't let it be an issue. We're not all night owls.
.

I think there is a big difference between you playing in a regular game and everyone knowing that it could be a short session for because of factors outside of poker and someone running when they score a big pot.

As a host, in your case I'd just be happy that you could play a few orbits with us. We have a member here that works for the State (technically, it's a Commonwealth, snark snark) and occasionally has to play a short session because of on-call work. I think I've probably bailed on a game after a few hours 2 or 3 times because of work too. Hey, it happens.

Staying as a host for a moment, I'm not happy if someone habitually hits and runs. It hasn't happened up here (we have the opposite problem where someone repeats "last orbit" for the 38th time, which is awesome, by the way)....but if it did happen I would be much less reluctant to invite that player back. You're trying to fill seats for the night and keep the game going and keep it fun as a host and it detracts from the table ambiance and health of the game when someone leaves immediately after getting some chips and takes them out of the game.

In a casino - I've never done it, but whatever....You're under no obligation to do anything except exactly what you want to do. Way different than a homegame.

 

[Poker Zombie]

Yeah, I guess I don't really know about hitting and running. I've had one winning cash game session out of... well, out of all the cash games I've played. I really didn't want to leave the night I was up, and had to have someone drive me home.

 

[SixSpeedFury]

When my friend hosts he states that everyone should give notice in advance when they're gonna cash out, usually 30 minutes or an orbit, whichever comes first.

 

[Dr Lecterr]

Home Game- let it be known that a 30min courtesy is expected

Raked home game- no courtesy required in my opinion

I'd mention it to him and let him redeem himself.

 

[rowlin]

Our game is primarily tournaments, but in its heyday we would often have enough people for a cash game afterward.

One of our younger/spazzier players took down a "huge pot" one night (maybe a couple hundred bucks, similar to OP) and announced he was going to stop playing.

So the rest of the table is like "ok that's lame, but allowed, so whatever - see ya man." He was a likable guy, kind of an airhead, and not the greatest player - even by our game's abysmally low standards. He donated a lot to the tournaments and was a friend of several people at the table, so I think folks were generally happy for him when he won rather than being bitter or angry about it.

When he came back to the table twenty minutes later and wanted to buy in for five bucks or some shit like that, I objected and remember having to put up a bit of an argument to justify his not being allowed to do so.

I think someone brought up the topic of "hey, please give a little heads-up before you leave" after that, but the game was as much of a social event than a serious thing in those days and we never really played enough cash games to put together a set of policies like a regular game should probably have.

 

[Mental Nomad]

One of our younger/spazzier players took down a "huge pot" one night (maybe a couple hundred bucks, similar to OP) and announced he was going to stop playing ... came back to the table twenty minutes later and wanted to buy in for five bucks or some shit like that

This is far, far, far more objectionable than the OP situation!