Credit Discussion Thread (1 Viewer)

[pltrgyst]

For my next card, I am deciding between one of the Chase Sapphire cards - Reserve or Preferred....

I had the Preferred and upgraded last year to the Reserve. The Reserve is $450/year, but you get an annual $300 credit for travel charges, so it's really only $55/year more than the Preferred.

One of the things I love about credit reporting agencies: When I upgraded, Chase pulled a credit report. So upgrading from Preferred to Reserve with the same bank dropped my credit ratings by ~10 points. Go figure...I'd have thought the upgrade was an indicator of credit worthiness, rather than a ding.

 

[tommythecat]

I had the Preferred and upgraded last year to the Reserve. The Reserve is $450/year, but you get an annual $300 credit for travel charges, so it's really only $55/year more than the Preferred.

One of the things I love about credit reporting agencies: When I upgraded, Chase pulled a credit report. So upgrading from Preferred to Reserve with the same bank dropped my credit ratings by ~10 points. Go figure...I'd have thought the upgrade was an indicator of credit worthiness, rather than a ding.

The biggest drops in my credit report recently were when I paid stuff off. I paid off 3 cards last month with a combined balance of ~$3500 and my score dropped 22 points for one of the bureaus. Makes no sense...

 

[David O]

The biggest drops in my credit report recently were when I paid stuff off. I paid off 3 cards last month with a combined balance of ~$3500 and my score dropped 22 points for one of the bureaus. Makes no sense...

Should not have hit you too much unless you closed the accounts.

 

[tommythecat]

Should not have hit you too much unless you closed the accounts.

No closing...not the first time it has happened either. I actually have a couple of card accounts I want to close but it would significantly lower the average age of my accounts and hurt my score even more.

 

[pltrgyst]

I get a kick out of Credit Karma / Equifax. They provide a list of things helping and hurting your scores. The things hurting my scores (825-835) are:

1. Oldest account not old enough. (It's 20+ years old, That's not old enough?)
2. Highest credit limit is too small (It's $33K. That's too small?)
3. Credit used is too great compared to credit limits. (It's never reached 10%, and I pay my cards off every month. I haven't carried a balance on any card for over 20 years.)

I just got dinged a few points because I'm changing cell phone carriers, and the new company did a credit check.

Credit rating is definitely a black art.

 

[tommythecat]

I get a kick out of Credit Karma / Equifax. They provide a list of things helping and hurting your scores. The things hurting my scores (825-835) are:

1. Oldest account not old enough. (It's 20+ years old, That's not old enough?)
2. Highest credit limit is too small (It's $33K. That's too small?)
3. Credit used is too great compared to credit limits. (It's never reached 10%, and I pay my cards off every month. I haven't carried a balance on any card for over 20 years.)

I just got dinged a few points because I'm changing cell phone carriers, and the new company did a credit check.

Credit rating is definitely a black art.

Same info across all three on myfico.com for 'things hurting score' category. Info is even contradictory sometimes. I've had it say the age of accounts is helping my score, and then check and see that age of accounts is hurting my score also.

Definitely a black art.

 

[MatB]

I had the Preferred and upgraded last year to the Reserve. The Reserve is $450/year, but you get an annual $300 credit for travel charges, so it's really only $55/year more than the Preferred.

One of the things I love about credit reporting agencies: When I upgraded, Chase pulled a credit report. So upgrading from Preferred to Reserve with the same bank dropped my credit ratings by ~10 points. Go figure...I'd have thought the upgrade was an indicator of credit worthiness, rather than a ding.

I did the same.
But still using the Preferred for a lot of household stuff which my wife uses too. Using the Reserve for Just my business expenses.
I like that i can move the points over from the Preferred to the Reserve when i want to book travel stuff. to get 1.5x points.

 

[DJ Mack]

When your score is that high the things bringing your score down are so minor that they seem silly, but they're almost always things that could always be better. Only using 10% of your credit? Well, 9% is better, and 8% is better yet. Credit file's 20 years old? 25 would be even better... IMO there's no value in providing reasons once your score is above about the 90th percentile. They just piss people off and generally have no meaningful impact on one's ability to get credit.

FICO scores aren't everything. Every lender uses the data differently and some don't pay attention to the score at all. It's not uncommon for FICO and the bank's algorithms to find themselves at cross-purposes. Back in my fraud investigation days the strangest I ever saw was someone with an 825 getting denied for a credit card. Everything was perfect. In fact, it was too perfect. The identity had 15 years of history and $50,000 in revolving credit. Problem was, it was almost never used. FICO says "oh yeah, look at this guy. Awesome, his credit utilization is way low." Our underwriters looked at it and said yeah, that's because the accounts never get used. He's just one bust out away from going from $0 utilization to $50k utilization and stiffing us. If he has all that credit and never uses it, why does he need more?" That and a few other flags that FICO doesn't consider set the internal credit score to about 550.

Personally I really think the only reason scores exist is so the bureaus can group people together and sell their information to prospective creditors for marketing purposes. I've never come across a lender that takes the score at face value other than for stupid stuff like cell service.

 

[Payback]

It's that time of my churning hobby again to reevaluate how I was going to reacquire the Southwest companion pass for 2019/2020 as it expires at the end of the year. I'm currently working on an article for the blog I write for and have already totaled up that it gave us over $5,000 in free flights (and I'm not done totaling) during 2017/2018. Therefore, I figured I would post up my plan in case someone else could benefit from it.

In order for this to work you will need a credit score above 700 to be safe (if your not sure check with the link provided in OP). You also can't have opened more than 5 new credit lines within the last 24 months. If you meet that criteria, follow steps below.

1) Apply for the Chase Southwest Business Card. It has a 60,000 point offer for 3k in spending. If you don't have an actual business you can use your personal SSN and count your chip buying/selling as a business. We get the business card first as though you have to be under 5/24 to qualify it doesn't count towards new cards. This is important if you are at 5/24 as you will still be able to make this work, but ONLY if you apply for this card first. To be safe, don't spend anything on the card till Jan. 1, or if you know 100% you can track the spending get the card to 2kish then after Jan. 1 spend the remaining balance. FYI, some people have gotten to $299x and then had something like a fraudulent charge push them over, hence the recommendation of waiting. Please don't be one of the "I f'd this up by spending too much too quickly." This is important as you want the signup bonus to post in 2019.

If you want more points/can clear minimum spending fast:
2a) Apply for any of the Southwest personal card via public offer (any one of the 3 would work right now) that will also give you 60,000 points with 40,000 points coming after 1k spending within 3 months. Then you would get 20k more after 12k spend over 12 months. To earn the companion pass you will need to spend a minimum of 7k on this card (110k total points needed: 60k +3k spend from business and 40k+7k spend on personal). Again, do not complete the 1k spend on the card until after Jan 1st.

If you want a faster clear/lower minimum spend.
2b) Apply for a Southwest personal card via an airport/flight link. This will give you 50,000 points, but only requires a 2k spend. Same thing regarding spending.

3) After Jan. 1st, meet the minimum spending requirements as designated above.

4) Name your companion (which you can change 3 times) and enjoying have a stockpile of 135k (a route) or 115k (b route) points to spend for yourself or others. Use those to book your flights for $5.60 domestically each way and then bring your companion with you for $5.60 as well.

If you end up signing up and would like to use one of my referral links for 1 or 2a feel free to PM me as I'd appreciate it. If not, that's cool too, but please use someones otherwise your leaving free points on the table. The link I have for 2b is not mine and is supposed to only be good on Southwest flights so it could disappear/not work at any point.

 

[DoubleEagle]

It's that time of my churning hobby again to reevaluate how I was going to reacquire the Southwest companion pass for 2019/2020 as it expires at the end of the year. I'm currently working on an article for the blog I write for and have already totaled up that it gave us over $5,000 in free flights (and I'm not done totaling) during 2017/2018. Therefore, I figured I would post up my plan in case someone else could benefit from it.

In order for this to work you will need a credit score above 700 to be safe (if your not sure check with the link provided in OP). You also can't have opened more than 5 new credit lines within the last 24 months. If you meet that criteria, follow steps below.

1) Apply for the Chase Southwest Business Card. It has a 60,000 point offer for 3k in spending. If you don't have an actual business you can use your personal SSN and count your chip buying/selling as a business. We get the business card first as though you have to be under 5/24 to qualify it doesn't count towards new cards. This is important if you are at 5/24 as you will still be able to make this work, but ONLY if you apply for this card first. To be safe, don't spend anything on the card till Jan. 1, or if you know 100% you can track the spending get the card to 2kish then after Jan. 1 spend the remaining balance. FYI, some people have gotten to $299x and then had something like a fraudulent charge push them over, hence the recommendation of waiting. Please don't be one of the "I f'd this up by spending too much too quickly." This is important as you want the signup bonus to post in 2019.

If you want more points/can clear minimum spending fast:
2a) Apply for any of the Southwest personal card via public offer (any one of the 3 would work right now) that will also give you 60,000 points with 40,000 points coming after 1k spending within 3 months. Then you would get 20k more after 12k spend over 12 months. To earn the companion pass you will need to spend a minimum of 7k on this card (110k total points needed: 60k +3k spend from business and 40k+7k spend on personal). Again, do not complete the 1k spend on the card until after Jan 1st.

If you want a faster clear/lower minimum spend.
2b) Apply for a Southwest personal card via an airport/flight link. This will give you 50,000 points, but only requires a 2k spend. Same thing regarding spending.

3) After Jan. 1st, meet the minimum spending requirements as designated above.

4) Name your companion (which you can change 3 times) and enjoying have a stockpile of 135k (a route) or 115k (b route) points to spend for yourself or others. Use those to book your flights for $5.60 domestically each way and then bring your companion with you for $5.60 as well.

If you end up signing up and would like to use one of my referral links for 1 or 2a feel free to PM me as I'd appreciate it. If not, that's cool too, but please use someones otherwise your leaving free points on the table. The link I have for 2b is not mine and is supposed to only be good on Southwest flights so it could disappear/not work at any point.

I do the same thing. My companion pass is expiring at the end of the year. For the next two years, going to use my spouse to apply for cards. Just got the business card for her. She is a yoga instructor. Will do the $3000 spend to post in January and then get her a personal card with a $1000 spend. It is the best deal going.

 

[David O]

It's that time of my churning hobby again to reevaluate how I was going to reacquire the Southwest companion pass for 2019/2020 as it expires at the end of the year. I'm currently working on an article for the blog I write for and have already totaled up that it gave us over $5,000 in free flights (and I'm not done totaling) during 2017/2018. Therefore, I figured I would post up my plan in case someone else could benefit from it.

In order for this to work you will need a credit score above 700 to be safe (if your not sure check with the link provided in OP). You also can't have opened more than 5 new credit lines within the last 24 months. If you meet that criteria, follow steps below.

1) Apply for the Chase Southwest Business Card. It has a 60,000 point offer for 3k in spending. If you don't have an actual business you can use your personal SSN and count your chip buying/selling as a business. We get the business card first as though you have to be under 5/24 to qualify it doesn't count towards new cards. This is important if you are at 5/24 as you will still be able to make this work, but ONLY if you apply for this card first. To be safe, don't spend anything on the card till Jan. 1, or if you know 100% you can track the spending get the card to 2kish then after Jan. 1 spend the remaining balance. FYI, some people have gotten to $299x and then had something like a fraudulent charge push them over, hence the recommendation of waiting. Please don't be one of the "I f'd this up by spending too much too quickly." This is important as you want the signup bonus to post in 2019.

If you want more points/can clear minimum spending fast:
2a) Apply for any of the Southwest personal card via public offer (any one of the 3 would work right now) that will also give you 60,000 points with 40,000 points coming after 1k spending within 3 months. Then you would get 20k more after 12k spend over 12 months. To earn the companion pass you will need to spend a minimum of 7k on this card (110k total points needed: 60k +3k spend from business and 40k+7k spend on personal). Again, do not complete the 1k spend on the card until after Jan 1st.

If you want a faster clear/lower minimum spend.
2b) Apply for a Southwest personal card via an airport/flight link. This will give you 50,000 points, but only requires a 2k spend. Same thing regarding spending.

3) After Jan. 1st, meet the minimum spending requirements as designated above.

4) Name your companion (which you can change 3 times) and enjoying have a stockpile of 135k (a route) or 115k (b route) points to spend for yourself or others. Use those to book your flights for $5.60 domestically each way and then bring your companion with you for $5.60 as well.

If you end up signing up and would like to use one of my referral links for 1 or 2a feel free to PM me as I'd appreciate it. If not, that's cool too, but please use someones otherwise your leaving free points on the table. The link I have for 2b is not mine and is supposed to only be good on Southwest flights so it could disappear/not work at any point.

I had applied and they turned me down. First time I have ever been turned down. My FICO score is in the mid 840s and not a 5/24. I called and the lady told me that I had a delinquent Chase loan. I looked and I have nothing on my credit and I have not had a loan or anything with them. I basically owe no one money other than my mortgage! I do haver a Visa with Chase that I will leave open but not use. I have bank accounts with them and all of those are pretty well funded. The lady got snooty with me so I will probably be taking all my money to another bank very soon. I opted to stay with my new Metal AMEX gold with the new 4x points for restaurants and 3x points for Airline purchases.

David O

 

[DoubleEagle]

My FICO score is in the mid 840s and not a 5/24.

That makes no sense at all. Did you order a copy of your credit report? Got to be an error somewhere!

 

[David O]

That makes no sense at all. Did you order a copy of your credit report? Got to be an error somewhere!

No, it was a mistake with whoever at Chase ran my credit for the card. I was livid by the time the call was over. Chase said they could not find anything on their end. The lady got snooty with me and acted like she was doing me a favor by offering to reconsider me. I told her to keep her card and would be losing all of my banking business.

 

[DoubleEagle]

No, it was a mistake with whoever at Chase ran my credit for the card. I was livid by the time the call was over. Chase said they could not find anything on their end. The lady got snooty with me and acted like she was doing me a favor by offering to reconsider me. I told her to keep her card and would be losing all of my banking business.

I can understand. But to me, the Case Sapphire Reserve and Chase Southwest cards are just too valuable not to have.

 

[David O]

I can understand. But to me, the Case Sapphire Reserve and Chase Southwest cards are just too valuable not to have.

To me service outweighs any points they would give me. I am at the point that I can do without their points and deal with someone who values my business. I do pretty well with AMEX points since they raised the points they award for Restaurants and airfare. I figure Chase lost about $5,000 to $7,000 a month of charges. With the new points structure with AMEX gold they add up quickly.

 

[Payback]

I do the same thing. My companion pass is expiring at the end of the year. For the next two years, going to use my spouse to apply for cards. Just got the business card for her. She is a yoga instructor. Will do the $3000 spend to post in January and then get her a personal card with a $1000 spend. It is the best deal going.

I've been in one player mode for the last two years prepping this move. For myself, I'll probably hit a few business cards next year and try to get from LOL/24 to back under 5 so I can do this again (if I'm able to) for 2021/2022.

To me service outweighs any points they would give me. I am at the point that I can do without their points and deal with someone who values my business. I do pretty well with AMEX points since they raised the points they award for Restaurants and airfare. I figure Chase lost about $5,000 to $7,000 a month of charges. With the new points structure with AMEX gold they add up quickly.

Honestly, I still don't know what happened in your case with Chase. Did you ever do a pull of your credit report and see what was going on? If it's over 7 years old it shouldn't show up anyways. Either way I've always had really good luck with their reconsideration people as they usually are stateside/have more pull, while the first level employees are first level call center representatives.

As far as the new gold card I love it! I actually just dumped my AMEX platinum card in favor of it and wrote a big article on it. The cards 4x at restaurants and supermarkets is just insane value. Not to mention acquiring another 50k MR points for another signup bonus was also a nice addition.

 

[David O]

Honestly, I still don't know what happened in your case with Chase. Did you ever do a pull of your credit report and see what was going on? If it's over 7 years old it shouldn't show up anyways. Either way I've always had really good luck with their reconsideration people as they usually are stateside/have more pull, while the first level employees are first level call center representatives.

As far as the new gold card I love it! I actually just dumped my AMEX platinum card in favor of it and wrote a big article on it. The cards 4x at restaurants and supermarkets is just insane value. Not to mention acquiring another 50k MR points for another signup bonus was also a nice addition.

Funny thing is I have squeaky clean credit. No bad marks or late pays in over 20 years. Just a fluke I guess and people do make mistakes. Only thing that got me was the snootiness of the reconsideration agent.

Yes I do love the Gold card and I actually passed on the Platinum for the same reason. The points awarded are way less. Love the 4 times on restaurants! 4 times more reasons to take customers out! :

 

[saleen121212]

I really need to look more into this. Mainly for the cash back as we just had a baby and won't be traveling much via plane for a while. I use an Amex for almost every purchase and pay it off every month. It earns me decent cash back, helps me budget, and builds my credit. My score is in the 820 range but I should possibly be taking advantage of the sign up cash back promotions. How does one deal with annual fees? Get the promotion and cancel or deal with a ton of different fees every year?

 

[Payback]

I really need to look more into this. Mainly for the cash back as we just had a baby and won't be traveling much via plane for a while. I use an Amex for almost every purchase and pay it off every month. It earns me decent cash back, helps me budget, and builds my credit. My score is in the 820 range but I should possibly be taking advantage of the sign up cash back promotions. How does one deal with annual fees? Get the promotion and cancel or deal with a ton of different fees every year?

Sometimes you need to pay the fee upfront, like the Gold card. However, you usually get something back in return for the fee. For AMEX it comes as an antiquated travel credit with a lot of limitations, with a Chase Sapphire Reserve ($450 fee) you get $300 annually back in travel credit. I've had stuff like uber eats, tolls, airline gift cards, baggage fees all trigger it, so I usually burned that $300 off by February. Even if you are just redeeming for cash back, by doing it through signup bonuses vs. normal spending you are going to come out way ahead.

As far as annual fees year to year, it depends on the cards. My hotel cards, like Marriott and Hyatt I spend $69 or $89 or whatever the fee is and in exchange they give you a free night credit so I'm happy to eat the fees on those and factor them into the travel budget. Typically I can redeem them for $200-$300 rooms, so I'm essentially buying a night at a deep discount. Other cards like my British Airways card, whose annual fee hit me last week, are not worth keeping as I get 0 value out of it. This morning I actually card and instead of closing the card, and damaging my credit report, was able to request a product change. They gave me another British Avios card that offers 1 point per every 2 dollars instead of 1 point per dollar that was on my annual fee card. This lets me keep that credit line open thereby decreasing utilization and extending my account history.

 

[saleen121212]

Sometimes you need to pay the fee upfront, like the Gold card. However, you usually get something back in return for the fee. For AMEX it comes as an antiquated travel credit with a lot of limitations, with a Chase Sapphire Reserve ($450 fee) you get $300 annually back in travel credit. I've had stuff like uber eats, tolls, airline gift cards, baggage fees all trigger it, so I usually burned that $300 off by February. Even if you are just redeeming for cash back, by doing it through signup bonuses vs. normal spending you are going to come out way ahead.

As far as annual fees year to year, it depends on the cards. My hotel cards, like Marriott and Hyatt I spend $69 or $89 or whatever the fee is and in exchange they give you a free night credit so I'm happy to eat the fees on those and factor them into the travel budget. Typically I can redeem them for $200-$300 rooms, so I'm essentially buying a night at a deep discount. Other cards like my British Airways card, whose annual fee hit me last week, are not worth keeping as I get 0 value out of it. This morning I actually card and instead of closing the card, and damaging my credit report, was able to request a product change. They gave me another British Avios card that offers 1 point per every 2 dollars instead of 1 point per dollar that was on my annual fee card. This lets me keep that credit line open thereby decreasing utilization and extending my account history.

Solid info here, I was just thinking about the cash back bonuses and how most of the cards typically have annual fees right? Like my Amex is 100 a year or something. I'd hate to have 20 cards open at 100 a year or have to cancel 19 a year to avoid it. Wasn't sure how that works or how to skirt the system. I assume some free cards still have good benefits?

 

[Payback]

Solid info here, I was just thinking about the cash back bonuses and how most of the cards typically have annual fees right? Like my Amex is 100 a year or something. I'd hate to have 20 cards open at 100 a year or have to cancel 19 a year to avoid it. Wasn't sure how that works or how to skirt the system. I assume some free cards still have good benefits?

Not as good as the annual fees card, but you can still get decent value. Most people aren't churning 20 cards a year as eventually you will start getting rejections for too many new accounts which is why you want to get the most you can out of the beginning applications.

 

[saleen121212]

Not as good as the annual fees card, but you can still get decent value. Most people aren't churning 20 cards a year as eventually you will start getting rejections for too many new accounts which is why you want to get the most you can out of the beginning applications.

So what do you do with annual fee cards? Open them get the reward and cancel? Or have 20 cards at 100 per year for life?

 

[Payback]

So what do you do with annual fee cards? Open them get the reward and cancel? Or have 20 cards at 100 per year for life?

I cancel some, I downgrade others if I'm able to, but at the very least I'll keep the card for the entire first year. Also some cards will give retention bonuses or waive annual fees if you ask so it's not quite as black and white.

 

[DoubleEagle]

Not to mention acquiring another 50k MR points for another signup bonus was also a nice addition.

Amex said no bonus points for me since I previously had a gold card. Surprised me since I never got bonus miles for the gold card.

 

[Payback]

Amex said no bonus points for me since I previously had a gold card. Surprised me since I never got bonus miles for the gold card.

Just wait 7 years which is considered a "lifetime" I've had the gold card before and claimed the bonus, but that was around 9 years ago, so it doesn't show up on the AMEX report anymore.

 

[k9dr]

Great opportunity

 

[DoubleEagle]

Great opportunity

View attachment 235009

Been doing this for years. Alternate two year periods with my wife. Mine justed ended in Dec. Just completed earning the bonuses and companion pass on wife’s account for the next to years. This the best deal out there.

 

[Payback]

The downside of this one is that this pass is only good for through the end of this year.

 

[k9dr]

The downside of this one is that this pass is only good for through the end of this year.

Yes, but the spend required is much less - 4K vs 110K

 

[DoubleEagle]

The downside of this one is that this pass is only good for through the end of this year.

Not true. Vaild for remainder of 2019 and all of 2020.

To qualify, simply fly 100 qualifying one-way flights or earn 110,000 qualifying points in a calendar year, and you’ll earn Companion Pass for the following full calendar year, plus the remainder of the year in which you earned it.

Edit: I did not realize this was a new promotion by SWA with a limited benefit companion pass. I did mine under their regular requirements of 110,000 miles. You need to get two cards to do this. A business card and a personal card.