Cash Game Favorite Cash Game Buy-in Stack (1 Viewer)

[Mortalpawn]

I know all about how to calculate set size, buyins, etc... but I was wondering what your "favorite" starting stack size is for various cash games? What works best in terms of game balance - having plenty of chips on the table but not being awash in very small denominations?

Mainly interested in $25 (.10/.25 or 0.25/0.25), $50 (0.25/0.50), $100 (0.50/1) and perhaps $200(1/2) if you like.

For example for $25 (0.25/0.25) this seems to work well, though we often pull out the $5 chips for rebuys:
20 x $0.25
20 x $1

 

[RichMahogany]

Equal sized starting stacks are pointless and unnecessary for cash games.

 

[Eloe2000]

We have a friendly but competitive game.

.25/.25 (or .25/.50) $40 buy-in (easy to manage with two twenties)

Stacks:

20x $0.25
20x $1
3x $5

Rebuys are:

20x$1 + 4x$5
> 8x$5
> 4x$5 + 1x$20

…depending how deep we get.

We do cap buy-ins and rebuys, but we do certain things to like this to keep it a friendly weekly game. Plenty of casinos and other games around of people are feeling froggy.

 

[RichMahogany]

Example:

We typically play $1/$1 300 BB max. Let’s say for 8 players and everyone buys in for the max.

Give the first 5 players a barrel of $1s, 2 barrel of $5s, and 16 more $5s. The last 3 players to buy in all get 3 barrels of $5s. The $1s will redistribute through play.

All subsequent rebuys are done in barrels of $5s, then $20s/$25s

Edit: change is then always easily made from the big stacks at the table

 

[shorticus]

Question here. Do you all require everyone to buy in for the same amount or just a minimum? If there’s only a minimum, then you shouldn’t be concerned with starting stacks as they won’t match anyway.

Wouldn’t the concern be more geared toward the chipset breakdown as opposed to starting stack sizes in a cash game?

 

[Eloe2000]

Question here. Do you all require everyone to buy in for the same amount or just a minimum? If there’s only a minimum, then you shouldn’t be concerned with starting stacks as they won’t match anyway.

Wouldn’t the concern be more geared toward the chipset breakdown as opposed to starting stack sizes in a cash game?

We do set buy-ins and rebuys (cash). You can buy-in for less but that rarely happens except for those times when someone is 7 buy-ins deep and wants to try their luck with a short stack all-in.

 

[JustinInMN]

I like to target about 8-12 blind chips and 40 workhorse chips per player.

So for 0.10-0.25 and a 25 buy in. I would prefer to do mostly ones. So maybe something like 10/10/22 of 0.05/0.25/1 or maybe even just do blinds of 0.25-0.25 to skip nickels and do 12/22.

For a $50 buy in, I like 12/42/7 of 0.25/1/5.

 

[Mortalpawn]

Question here. Do you all require everyone to buy in for the same amount or just a minimum? If there’s only a minimum, then you shouldn’t be concerned with starting stacks as they won’t match anyway.

I personally do the initial buyin at 100 BB just so everyone has a nice stack to start, but we run a casual, low stakes game. Most of the people are not super serious poker players but just enjoy spending the evening playing for fun. For us, the rebuy tends to be the same dollar amount as the initial buyin though I will often work in higher denominations on the rebuys, as having too many small blind chips gets silly after a while.

Wouldn’t the concern be more geared toward the chipset breakdown as opposed to starting stack sizes in a cash game?

I didn't ask about chipset breakdown on purpose as that is easy to calculate based on stack size, number of players, estimated rebuys, etc... I was shooting at stack size specifically from a game balance perspective, assuming you have a large cash set of chips to draw from. Obviously if you put out a set of 400 small blind chips per person, things get really silly. Even 100 big blind chips is probably not really that practical for players. So what's the right balance?

 

[Joe Harris]

What works best in terms of game balance - having plenty of chips on the table but not being awash in very small denominations?

Don't think of it in terms of starting stack sizes, think in terms of what chip counts are required to provide a good 'denomination texture'. In other words, you want enough smaller chips to prevent overmuch change making, and not so many workhorse chips that they are in the way. You don't want to over do that, though - there should be enough chips on the table that players feel like their stack has some 'weight' even if they already made a few ill advised plays.

In general, for a cash game using fracs for blinds, the minimums seem to look like this:
frac ('blind' denom): 1/2 barrel per player
$1 ('bridge' denom): 1 barrel per player
$5 ('workhorse' denom): as needed
$25 ('value' denom): as needed

and the maximums are something like:
frac: 1 bpp
$1: 2 bpp
$5: 4 bpp
$25 as needed

I usually bring players into the game with a barrel of fracs each, until there are enough for the expected player count. The other denominations follow similarly. Rebuys are highly likely to receive $25s only.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

Example:

We typically play $1/$1 300 BB max. Let’s say for 8 players and everyone buys in for the max.

Give the first 5 players a barrel of $1s, 2 barrel of $5s, and 16 more $5s. The last 3 players to buy in all get 3 barrels of $5s. The $1s will redistribute through play.

All subsequent rebuys are done in barrels of $5s, then $20s/$25s

Edit: change is then always easily made from the big stacks at the table

This is the way.

For my .25/.50 $20 min $100 max game, I give the first half of the table a barrel of .25 and 1-2 barrels of $1, then top off with $5s. The second half of the table gets 1-2 barrels of $1s and topped off with $5s. Then nothing but $5s (then $25s as needed) for rebuys.

Barrels make the banker's job significantly easier, and my players are smart enough to make change with each other so that I don't have to do it for them.

 

[RichMahogany]

This is the way.

Literally rewatching The Mandalorian when writing my response. Almost finished my post with that^^^

 

[CrazyEddie]

Equal sized starting stacks are pointless and unnecessary for cash games.

However, having some idea of "the average number of chips per player on the table" is a helpful concept for someone trying to figure out how many chips to hand out when the game starts.

@Mortalpawn - You'll get a wide variety of answers. The low side is 8 of the small denom and low teens of the next two denoms, so about 30 chips. The high side is a barrel each of the first two denoms and two or three barrels of the third denom, so up to 100 chips. Add a few chips of the fourth or fifth denom if people buy in deep. Anywhere between these ranges will work just fine, and you'll soon figure out whether you prefer having fewer or more chips on the table.

However, like @RichMahogany says, there's no need to allocate these as "starting stacks" although you certainly can do so if it's convenient for the way your players like to buy in. A common recommendation is to give the first five players full barrels of the low denom (e.g. quarters) and then not hand out any more to the players who buy in later; 100 quarters is enough for anywhere from five to ten players, and the later players will pick up what they need by making change from the earlier players. Handing out full barrels of chips is easy and convenient for the host and the players; it's easy to handle, and easy to see how much you've been given.

 

[MrCatPants]

I'm really surprised by how many fracs people are giving. In my opinion these should be used on a very limited basis, and having stacks of them at the table makes it harder to bet and harder to calculate pots.

for my $0.25/$0.50 game ($40 starter)
8x $0.25
23x$1
3x$5

for my .50/.50 game
6x$0.50
22x$1
3x$5

 

[Schmendr1ck]

However, having some idea of "the average number of chips per player on the table" is a helpful concept for someone trying to figure out how many chips to hand out when the game starts.

This is important not only at the beginning of the night, but as the game goes on and players bust or cash out early.

Often after a couple players leave, there are just too many workhorse chips on the table (especially if you're generous with them early, like I usually am). If I notice this, I'll find the guy with a mountain of $1s and color up a few barrels.

It makes chip management and stack size estimation a lot easier for the table - especially when the alcohol has been flowing.

 

[Mortalpawn]

It makes chip management and stack size estimation a lot easier for the table - especially when the alcohol has been flowing.

That makes sense to me - having too many BB (for instance) chips on the table may look cool from a player stack perspective but certainly does make it hard to guess the pot size unless you are really paying attention to every bet and raise.

 

[RichMahogany]

This is important not only at the beginning of the night, but as the game goes on and players bust or cash out early.

Often after a couple players leave, there are just too many workhorse chips on the table (especially if you're generous with them early, like I usually am). If I notice this, I'll find the guy with a mountain of $1s and color up a few barrels.

It makes chip management and stack size estimation a lot easier for the table - especially when the alcohol has been flowing.

This guy cash games!

 

[CrazyEddie]

A related and perhaps more interesting question is: what is your preferred rebuy stack?

There's basically two answers:

• Something similar to the initial stack, i.e. a big handful of chips consisting of several denoms
• Something much smaller, i.e. a few chips of one or two high denoms, or even just one big chip

This corresponds to two different ideologies:

• The ideal number and breakdown of chips is [X, Y, Z] - any more than that and the table gets crowded and cluttered, any less than that and the gameplay gets awkward due to change-making. Accordingly, when rebuys add money to the table, that extra money shouldn't alter the breakdown of chips in circulation, and thus the rebuys should be made with the biggest chips available and the rebuying players can simply get change from the players that took all their money already.
• When there's more money on the table, it should look and feel like there's more money on the table! Twice as much money should mean twice as many chips. Besides, if Fred took all of Bob's money, Fred should get to keep it all rather than having to give it all back to Bob when Bob sits back down and asks Fred to make change for his one big chip. And anyway, who wants to make change just to bring a player back into play? Get the change from the bank and don't make the players futz around every time someone busts out.

Who is in which camp?

 

[Mortalpawn]

Who is in which camp?

I'm of the opinion that rebuys should generally eliminate the smallest chip (fractionals or SB) and be mainly BB and higher chips.

 

[upNdown]

We have a friendly but competitive game.

.25/.25 (or .25/.50) $40 buy-in (easy to manage with two twenties)

Stacks:

20x $0.25
20x $1
3x $5

Rebuys are:

20x$1 + 4x$5
> 8x$5
> 4x$5 + 1x$20

…depending how deep we get.

We do cap buy-ins and rebuys, but we do certain things to like this to keep it a friendly weekly game. Plenty of casinos and other games around of people are feeling froggy.

I have recently been convinced that this is THE WAY. I’ll probably never put more than a rack of quarters on the table, so people can make change once the quarters are out. But barrels. Hell yes. Less counting!

 

[detroitdad]

I know all about how to calculate set size, buyins, etc... but I was wondering what your "favorite" starting stack size is for various cash games? What works best in terms of game balance - having plenty of chips on the table but not being awash in very small denominations?

Mainly interested in $25 (.10/.25 or 0.25/0.25), $50 (0.25/0.50), $100 (0.50/1) and perhaps $200(1/2) if you like.

For example for $25 (0.25/0.25) this seems to work well, though we often pull out the $5 chips for rebuys:
20 x $0.25
20 x $1

.25/.50, $100 max buy in

12 x .25
17 x 1
16 x 5


Rebuys are done until the 5's are gone. Then I move on to the rebuy chips

 

[liftapint]

This thread would be so much better if people would answer with photos.

 

[detroitdad]

 

[detroitdad]

 

[CraigT78]

We play $1/$1 and my starting stack is $180 in red and $20 in white.

 

[shorticus]

We play $1/$1 and my starting stack is $180 in red and $20 in white.

Fixed Limit?

 

[MikesDad]

For 0.25 / 0.50 $100 max buy-in
I have a rack of fracs so these go to the first 5 players
20 x 0.25
20 x 1.00
15 x 5.00

After that $100 buy-in gets
20 x 1.00
16 x 5.00

Barrels are you friend when doing by-ins

Later buy-ins I try to get $25s in play just for fun even if not out of $5s

 

[Eriks]

Here are my 5/5 200bbs max starting stacks. Divide by 10 for $-value

 

[Eloe2000]

Here are my 5/5 200bbs max starting stacks. Divide by 10 for $-value

View attachment 947706

This looks like my 20/20/3 (.25/1/5) starting stacks.

 

[CraigT78]

Fixed Limit?

Pot limit

 

[Marius L]

We play $1/$1 and my starting stack is $180 in red and $20 in white.

We use 20/21/3 (1/5/25) for 100bb stack in 1/2. Will just add 5s or 25s for those wanting deeper stacks. Will try to get 2 racks of fives in play rather quickly, but don't mind if we get some 25s in there first. My players are actually more often than not even getting the hundreds in play sooner rather than later as well. Well before I get 2 racks of 25s in play.