Higher Tournament Denoms (2 Viewers)

[jdparrish21]

Why is it that most tourney sets include steps from 25 - 100 - 500 - 1,000 - 5,000 - 10,000 ? In particular the step from 500 to 1000 is only double whereas the jump for most other steps is 4:1 or 5:1. Why not this: 25 - 100 - 500 - 2,000 - 5,000 - 10,000 ? That way the progression from each step as only a little less of a multiple from previous as you go up. Would make chip set breakdowns easier and get more use of each chip, imho.

Please talk me out of doing a custom relabel set this way before I make a big mistake

 

[Highli99]

It normally goes T5k, T25K, T100k

Don't really see T10k chips.

The point about T500 and T1k is valid and there are a few custom sets with T2k denominations. I've never used them but I agree with the efficiency.

 

[pltrgyst]

25/100/500/2500/10000 and 25/100/500/2000/10000 are simpler, and have been done before.

 

[Senzrock]

Yeah you only need T25, T100, T500, T1k, T5k for most tournaments. I like a barrel or two of T25k just for emergencies but the truth is that generally these either don't come into play, or if they do come into play, they weren't really needed. All depends on your particular setup though.

Either way - do not use 10ks.

 

[jdparrish21]

Yeah you only need T25, T100, T500, T1k, T5k for most tournaments. I like a barrel or two of T25k just for emergencies but the truth is that generally these either don't come into play, or if they do come into play, they weren't really needed. All depends on your particular setup though.

Either way - do not use 10ks.

For my size tournaments and starting blinds, T25 - T5k range is all I need. My main point/concern was over the T1k. Seems silly going from T500 to T1k (2x) when all the other jumps in the set are 4x or 5x previous denom. Like a couple others mentioned, I think I will substitute the T1k for a T2k or even T2.5k instead.

And you are all right, T10k should've been T25k in my OP note.

 

[Senzrock]

For my size tournaments and starting blinds, T25 - T5k range is all I need. My main point/concern was over the T1k. Seems silly going from T500 to T1k (2x) when all the other jumps in the set are 4x or 5x previous denom. Like a couple others mentioned, I think I will substitute the T1k for a T2k or even T2.5k instead.

And you are all right, T10k should've been T25k in my OP note.

I hear you that it seems a bit weird but one thing to keep in mind is that these are the standard tournament denominations, so if you want to mimic the casino experience at all, I would stick with the T1ks. Part of all of this is just so you can get cool chips in different colors in your starting stacks, sometimes you have to step away from the practical side of things

 

[Pippa]

I play 300K
You can see the denomination

 

[allforcharity]

500-1000 jump is traditional. There is no reason you have to follow tradition for your own customs. Plenty of member examples of 500-2000-10000 progressions in chips and plaques.

 

[grantc54]

I tried 5-25-100-500-2000-10000 for a set that ended at T500. In general people disliked it and it slowed down play. I will likely try one more time then convert the set to standard denoms.

Maybe if I used the set for every game but I have a 5 set tournament rotation so they'd only get used 2-4x a year or so.

 

[upNdown]

Either way - do not use 10ks.

It depends on what you want to do. I used to play in a cardroom that ran a base T25, 30K. I think the 10k made a lot of sense there - one of those in each starting stack, along with two 5ks. It wasnt necessary in the beginning, but it helped later on, as this tournament would get 60-120 runners.

I’d agree that the vast majority of home tournaments don’t need anything beyond a T5k. If you’re running a base T25 and you own T25ks, I think in most cases you’re out of your mind. And even if your base is T100, I Can’t imagine how many tables and rebuys you’d need to justify a T25k.

 

[BPTDirector]

I think the best explanation for 1k is it makes it very easy to vary your starting stack size anywhere from 6k to 10k, a sweet spot for home games.

 

[mipevi]

If you want efficiency, you could do 1-5-25-100-500. Or add a bunch of zeroes to them for that high roller feel.

Also, 10k is the nutz! (In some rare cases.)

 

[upNdown]

500-1000 jump is traditional. There is no reason you have to follow tradition for your own customs. Plenty of member examples of 500-2000-10000 progressions in chips and plaques.

Absolutely - people should do what they want, especially with tournament chips, because you can make just about anything work.
Personally, I think the T2k or T2.5K is a little bit, almost pretentious. It's like saying, I can do it better than everybody else. They don't use these at the WSOP, but I do, because I'm smarter. And maybe the T2k is smarter. I'm a grumpy old poop who likes what he's used to - T25s are negotiable, but for me, the rest have to be T100, T500, T1K, T5K, and then whatever, if necessary.

 

[ChipTalker]

While like others I agree there is an efficiency gain however do players really care about denom efficiency while playing?
I stick with what casinos do as that is what my players like and are used to. Same goes for $20 cash chips, the common person (at least in my area) just wants a $25. I tried a $20 chip once and it was universally hated. They prefer the casino-like experience (and I don't disagree with them) so that is what I provide.

 

[jdparrish21]

While like others I agree there is an efficiency gain however do players really care about denom efficiency while playing?
I stick with what casinos do as that is what my players like and are used to. Same goes for $20 cash chips, the common person (at least in my area) just wants a $25. I tried a $20 chip once and it was universally hated. They prefer the casino-like experience (and I don't disagree with them) so that is what I provide.

I totally get that argument for cash games. Most poker players play casino cash games and are very familiar with those denoms. Maybe we play in very different home game tournament pools, but most of the people I play with don't play many tournaments at casinos. Especially when you get above T100, most of the people I play with don't know what "typical" denominations are. Like me, they want the chip ups to make sense and not have several types that are too similar too each other.

I that get different groups and people will have preferences. What I was really asking is if there is some reason for the T denominations other than "that's what the casinos have always used"? Is there some reason behind why they made the next step from T500 to be T1k instead of a larger amount, for example?

 

[ChipTalker]

Many of my players have played tourneys in a casino but I am going to make an assumption that even ones who have not still have seen the denoms on TV for WSOP or WPT or whatever else that got them into the game to begin with.

"is if there is some reason for the T denominations other than"
For me personally no other reason other than that is what casino's use so why not go with that.
I would guess they had some historical correlation with old school USD denoms that went 500 1K 5K 10K 100K ... the $25 and 25K always seem to be outliers from the USD system though so not really sure.

 

[Mr Winberg]

Why is it that most tourney sets include steps from 25 - 100 - 500 - 1,000 - 5,000 - 10,000 ? In particular the step from 500 to 1000 is only double whereas the jump for most other steps is 4:1 or 5:1. Why not this: 25 - 100 - 500 - 2,000 - 5,000 - 10,000 ? That way the progression from each step as only a little less of a multiple from previous as you go up. Would make chip set breakdowns easier and get more use of each chip, imho.

Please talk me out of doing a custom relabel set this way before I make a big mistake

Here's some reading for you: https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/arguments-against-t25-t100-t500-t2000-t10000-sets.38197/

Fwiw, I've played a few tournaments using T2000 but I still prefer T1000. It's more natural to me.

 

[Easylife]

It's something I used to wonder about as well but I would say it makes sense to have the 500 and 1000 for a T25 base tourney early on for the betting patterns as less change has to be made for the mid range bets, makes pots easier to count and also probably helps with the colour ups.

 

[jdparrish21]

Here's some reading for you: https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/arguments-against-t25-t100-t500-t2000-t10000-sets.38197/

Fwiw, I've played a few tournaments using T2000 but I still prefer T1000. It's more natural to me.

Thanks for that link, @Mr Winberg ! Even more insight from people.

So to clarify my reason for wanting the T2k chip in MY set is that I already have a relatively high number of T500 chips, which I love those chips. If I was starting from total scratch, I could see still using a smaller amount of T500 and a large amount of T1k. But with what I have, it seems to make more sense to go with a number of T2k that is about 40% of the number of T500 chips I already have.

And honestly, most of the players I have been playing with as host still often ask "what are the value of the these green chips again"? :/ I don't think introducing a T2k chip with shock their system..

 

[Frogzilla]

The T500 is barely a chip. Most start stacks give you just 2, and it runs fine. No one bets with a stack of 500. No one can seem to count down 500s for the all in…they do it two at a time instead of 4 or 5.

So yes while 2k will make your chips all useful, people have to learn the 2k, but also a little bit of learning the 500. I have it for my tournament set and, for what it’s worth, I regret it. Detracts from the game.

 

[Ben8257]

I like a mix of both T1k sets and T2k sets. Change things up and make people think a bit more. The Silver Tounged Devils design by the Master Digital Artist @quicksilver75 is T2k. We have run it quite a few times with zero issues even with new players

I don't really give teo craps about efficiency, all about more chips in play. But I do like to change it up with denoms and make players think a little more. If I only had one tourney set... I would probably want it 25/100/500/1000/5000 but again one of those cool little aspects you can change to make your collection custom/ personal. Like incorporating plaques of different sized chips. No right or wrong answer, do what works for you. I do suggest keeping it fun and changing things up for your players. I know many owners want nothing but 39mm chips through the entire progression... but I can tell you almost everyone loves when a larger chip/plaque/octagon goes into play. Even veterans get giddy and excited to see something different.

Example was last weekend for a meet up in Ohio, our CDIs I had custom Octagons made for my T5k and T25k. It is always a crowd pleaser when those hit the felt!

Shown in the back there as I am building rebuy stacks

Our Victor's for the day! They cost like $1.25 each while the chips cost much more. Just something to think about when building the top end!

 

[philhut]

tourney breakdowns that I have and can use with my sets, along with starting stack breakdowns, I prefer moderate-more chips than just the minimum. The T1000 breakdown really only works with a dedicated dealer and change rack or the making of change becomes a problem, substitute 7x100 instead of the 500 if playing a player dealt game.

starting blind 5/10 stack T1000-T5000
5-25-100-500-1000-5000*
* (unlikely to ever need more than 1000, i just happen to have 5k plaques for a HSI set that can be a tourney set with either 5's or 25's as the lowest denom)

T1000	T1500	T3000	T5000
5- 5	10- 5	10- 5	10- 5
7- 25	10- 25	10- 25	10- 25
3- 100	7- 100	7- 100	7- 100
1- 500	1- 500	4- 500	4- 500
			2- 1000

starting blind 25/50
25-100-500-1000-5000 -*
*(~20x10,000 or ~10x25000 could be added but unlikely ever needed unless playing equal to or more than 3 tables or regular 20k's)

T3000	T5000	T10000	T20000 or	T20000
12- 25	12- 25	12- 25	8- 25	8- 25
12-100	12- 100	12-100	8-100	8-100
3- 500	3- 500	7- 500	4-500	6-500
	2- 1000	2- 1000	7-1000	6-1000
			2-5000	2-5000

Of these breakdowns the T1500 or T3000 with 5's or T3000 or T5000 are the most popular with T5000 without 5's being my favorite as a sit&go or rebuy tourney

 

[buffalojim]

Its a shame sometimes when using actual casino chips for T25 tournaments because the $500 chip is often one of the coolest chips IMO, but often the most maligned. Also, you get so few when starting with a standard 12-12-5-6 10k stack.

 

[Pinesol13]

I that get different groups and people will have preferences. What I was really asking is if there is some reason for the T denominations other than "that's what the casinos have always used"? Is there some reason behind why they made the next step from T500 to be T1k instead of a larger amount, for example?

No, I think you can chalk the T1K chip down to "that's just how it's always been done". My guess is that a 1K chip "feels" normal, and that a 2K chip does not to most people.

It's like US currency, we have a $50 bill, why don't we have a $200 bill instead of $100?

 

[philhut]

Its a shame sometimes when using actual casino chips for T25 tournaments because the $500 chip is often one of the coolest chips IMO, but often the most maligned. Also, you get so few when starting with a standard 12-12-5-6 10k stack.

Sometimes you have more 500's than 1000's so you focus on games that play 500's more for particular sets if used for tourney's

Here is a 5k starting stack using my HSI primaries this allows up to a 2 table game

This same set can cover 7 tables of 70! players

TOURNAMENT
Players	70
Denoms* (populated from Column B)	Chips PP	Chips in play	Bank
5	10	700	100
25	6	420	0
100	3	210	40
500	2	140	10
1,000	0	0	40
5,000	0	0	20
	PP	Bank used	Bank left over
Total	$1,500	$105,000	149,500
Chips used	21	1470

 

[PlaidDragon]

Why is it that most tourney sets include steps from 25 - 100 - 500 - 1,000 - 5,000 - 10,000 ? In particular the step from 500 to 1000 is only double whereas the jump for most other steps is 4:1 or 5:1. Why not this: 25 - 100 - 500 - 2,000 - 5,000 - 10,000 ? That way the progression from each step as only a little less of a multiple from previous as you go up. Would make chip set breakdowns easier and get more use of each chip, imho.

Please talk me out of doing a custom relabel set this way before I make a big mistake

If you’re considering a T2000, then don’t do a T5000. I have one set of non-conventional denom tournies:

Go right to 10k rather than 5k.

 

[jdparrish21]

OK OK. You guys talked me into it. I'll stick with "traditional" sizes for my set Maybe sell off (or re-purpose) some of my excess T500s though.

 

[allforcharity]

Its a shame sometimes when using actual casino chips for T25 tournaments because the $500 chip is often one of the coolest chips IMO, but often the most maligned. Also, you get so few when starting with a standard 12-12-5-6 10k stack.

Sometimes you have to use what's available. I have more $500 than what many would consider 'ideal' for a T10k stack in my CDI98 tourney set, but that's because the $1000 is much rarer and harder to acquire. I'm actually surprised we haven't seen much more custom 1k and 2k plaques for this set due to this relative deficit.

 

[Mr Winberg]

MY set is that I already have a relatively high number of T500 chips, which I love those chips

Sometimes I run T10k freezouts with 20/20/15 stacks. That way the T500 gets to shine instead of just being the T1000's sidekick. If you don't have enough you could do 12/12/7 for 5K stacks and cut the blinds in half, i.e. do 25/25, 25/50 etc instead of 25/50, 50/100 etc. That way you'll still start with 200 BBs.

No one can seem to count down 500s for the all in…they do it two at a time instead of 4 or 5.

 

[BGinGA]

Two reasonable choices for large T25-base tourney sets are:
25/100/500/1000/5000/25000, and
25/100/500/2000/10000.

The former is more 'standard', while the latter is arguably more efficient for events with large fields and/or starting stacks. Also noteworthy that neither the T25k or T10k chips are needed for most sets that cover just one or two tables.

That said, some true chippers will build a multi-purpose set (or sets) that includes all of those denominations (and more), capable of covering a wide range of events with different field sizes and starting stacks:
T25
T100
T500
T1000
T2000
T5000
T10000
T25000
T50000
T100000
T500000

Then the problem morphs into being capable of creating ten distinctive stellar chip designs that work well together. Not as easy as one might suspect.....