Cash Game Cap in Pot-Limit Games? (4 Viewers)

[Santa123]

Are there experiences here with applying a cap to Pot-Limit if played mixed with fixed limit and no-limit in the same session? If so, how high is the cap and how is it handled? Does the cap apply per street or is it a cap for the pot?

The background of my question is that I enjoy mixed games/circus games alongside NLH. However, we usually play them as Fixed Limit, and I would like to play them as Big Bet Games too. I’m thinking of 5-Card Omaha variants, 2-7 Triple Draw, maybe even Scarney or Razz variants.

We typically play NLH 25c/25c. Fixed Limit is played with 1€/2€ small and big bet. I would intuitively play Pot-Limit with blinds 10c/10c with a cap of 100 Big Blinds/10€ per street to prevent pots from getting out of hand.
However, I have read on TwoPlusTwo or Reddit that smaller caps of 40 Big Blinds are also chosen if Pot-Limit is mixed with NLH an FL games in the same session.

I would appreciate it if someone could share their experiences, if any.
Thank you.

 

[Labrat]

Isn't that essentially spread limit?

 

[Santa123]

Isn't that essentially spread limit?

Never played spread limit. But as far as I unterstand you can bet or raise in spread limit a given range. But you can keep raising.

A capped game I had in mine would loook like this:

Example - Pot-Limit / 10c/10c blinds / cap is 10€
Lets say you have two players at the turn. Pot is 4€. Player A bets pot 4€. Player B has now the option to fold, call, min-raise to 8€ or raise up to 10€.
Lets say player B raises to 10€. Player A now has the option to fold or to call but not to raise as the cap is already reached.

 

[allforcharity]

Never played spread limit. But as far as I unterstand you can bet or raise in spread limit a given range. But you can keep raising.

A capped game I had in mine would loook like this:

Example - Pot-Limit / 10c/10c blinds / cap is 10€
Lets say you have two players at the turn. Pot is 4€. Player A bets pot 4€. Player B has now the option to fold, call, min-raise to 8€ or raise up to 10€.
Lets say player B raises to 10€. Player A now has the option to fold or to call but not to raise as the cap is already reached.

Yeah, that's spread limit. Each betting round is capped at pre-determined maximum.

 

[Santa123]

Yeah, that's spread limit. Each betting round is capped at pre-determined maximum.

Oh okay. I wasnt aware.

 

[doublebooyah85]

I’ve played capped pots in PLO when it’s a bomb pot or a mixed game limit game.

Example, bomb we play $1-$2 PLO. But the most a player can get in is $500. As you play the hand, you just always keep your money/chips in front of you that way the Dealer and everyone knows when you get to the $500. Never push all the chips in the middle.

I’ve also played mixed limit games where it’s round by round different limit games but one of the games is PLO again with a fixed max all-in. That was a $20-$40 limit game and the max you could lose was like $2k in PLO but I really can’t remember.

 

[Santa123]

Yeah, that's spread limit. Each betting round is capped at pre-determined maximum.

Pot-Limit with a cap is still different as spread limit. Lets say we play PLO $1/$2 with a cap of $200. That game would play very different than spread limit with blinds $1/$2 that would allow betting between $2 and $200 on every street.

I’ve also played mixed limit games where it’s round by round different limit games but one of the games is PLO again with a fixed max all-in. That was a $20-$40 limit game and the max you could lose was like $2k in PLO but I really can’t remember.

Very interesting. In your example $2k would be 50 Big Bets. If you say "fixed max all-in "do you mean that the money that goes in at that street is limited or the money in total, adding up all bets you made on each street, is limited?

 

[Labrat]

Pot-Limit with a cap is still different as spread limit. Lets say we play PLO $1/$2 with a cap of $200. That game would play very different than spread limit with blinds $1/$2 that would allow betting between $2 and $200 on every street.

Are you going to really bet into a $3 pot with $200, though?

The way I'm reading it, you're saying you want to cap bets at 100bb, but what's to stop people from continually raising the last 100bb with another 100bb which essentially makes it no limit, anyway? Unless you're capping the entire betting round of each street at 100bb?

It sounds like I'm missing something.

 

[inca911]

We’ve done this at several limit meetup tables @Jeff @Payback: PL 4/8 with a $100-200 per player hand cap. Live players simply keep their chips in front of them and no raises are allowed once the cap is reached. Money from folded players is pulled into the main pot. Definitely fun, and worth trying with your group!

 

[doublebooyah85]

Very interesting. In your example $2k would be 50 Big Bets. If you say "fixed max all-in "do you mean that the money that goes in at that street is limited or the money in total, adding up all bets you made on each street, is limited?

In total from all streets.

Spread limit is fun in theory but idk. Might as well play limit imho.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Are you going to really bet into a $3 pot with $200, though?

The way I'm reading it, you're saying you want to cap bets at 100bb, but what's to stop people from continually raising the last 100bb with another 100bb which essentially makes it no limit, anyway? Unless you're capping the entire betting round of each street at 100bb?

It sounds like I'm missing something.

No remember it’s pot limit with a total cap so you usually can’t get to 100b until the flop in a juicy game or mostly likely the turn.

Just protects players from losing too much.

It’s fairly common (for a reason) and I’m probably not the best at explaining why.

*Spread is a cap at each street. But say we play $2-$10 spread, and someone bets $6 Preflop, then $10 on the flop, it’s essentially limit now? Bc they’re gonna keeping betting $10 each street. Spread limit just increases the game and makes it a more expensive limit version and you still can’t buy pots or get people off hands. Maybe Preflop is all. Hence why spread limit is not common whatsoever.

 

[Labrat]

No remember it’s pot limit with a total cap so you usually can’t get to 100b until the flop in a juicy game or mostly likely the turn.

Just protects players from losing too much.

It’s fairly common (for a reason) and I’m probably not the best at explaining why.

*Spread is a cap at each street. But say we play $2-$10 spread, and someone bets $6 Preflop, then $10 on the flop, it’s essentially limit now? Bc they’re gonna keeping betting $10 each street. Spread limit just increases the game and makes it a more expensive limit version and you still can’t buy pots or get people off hands. Maybe Preflop is all. Hence why spread limit is not common whatsoever.

Yeah, I realize that, but I'm talking later streets. So is he talking once 100bb is in the pot, betting is capped? Or if you bet 100bb on the river, then I can raise 100bb?

 

[doublebooyah85]

Yeah, I realize that, but I'm talking later streets. So is he talking once 100bb is in the pot, betting is capped? Or if you bet 100bb on the river, then I can raise 100bb?

It’s capped per person.

So if you were able to “pot” and it was 100 bb, then you cannot bet anymore. Or call anymore.

The chips stay in front of you just a few inches into the pot the entire hand. So everyone can keep track how much they are in for.

 

[doublebooyah85]

It’s a good way to protect players but usually for a more well ran game w dealers and experienced played. I see it coming at high stakes for bomb pots and in fixed limit round by round games when they want to introduce PLO.

If your intention is to use this as a practice to protect low limit players, I would just cap the buying of the game entirely rather to protect the players because it can get kinda confusing splitting out pots for beginners.

 

[Labrat]

It’s capped per person.

So if you were able to “pot” and it was 100 bb, then you cannot bet anymore. Or call anymore.

The chips stay in front of you just a few inches into the pot the entire hand. So everyone can keep track how much they are in for.

Ok, lol. So let's explain it to me like I'm seven years old.

50bb in the pot on the river.
You raise 100bb.
Can I re-raise 100bb?
And, if so, can you re-raise me for 100bb?

 

[doublebooyah85]

How much have you put in.

The pot isn’t capped.

But what each individual can put in the middle.

 

[Labrat]

But what each individual can put in the middle.

So if I open the river betting with 100bb, nobody can raise me?

 

[doublebooyah85]

I don’t see how they could when their max allowed in the pot is 100b.

But I also don’t see how u could river bet 100b bc how did that pot get so big without you committing some of our chips already.

Most likely you only have 60 or so big blinds left. Because how could you bet a pot that large without already having chips committed

 

[allforcharity]

So if I open the river betting with 100bb, nobody can raise me?

If it's PL, there must be at least 100bb in the pot before you can open for 100bb.

 

[Santa123]

We’ve done this at several limit meetup tables @Jeff @Payback: PL 4/8 with a $100-200 per player hand cap. Live players simply keep their chips in front of them and no raises are allowed once the cap is reached. Money from folded players is pulled into the main pot. Definitely fun, and worth trying with your group!
View attachment 1410564
View attachment 1410565

Thanks for sharing and cool pics Always the Way to post massive stacks

So you too played as @doublebooyah85 also told from his experience that you cap the total amount a player can loose in a single hand. Very intresting.

"PL 4/8 with a $100-200 per player hand cap"
Thats only 12,5 to 25 Big Blinds in a hand. Is this correct? Wow. Thats a realy low cap. Isnt it? My initial thought was to compare with the maximum lost in a fixed-limit hand with adjusted Blinds/ Antes.

Lets say you play Pot-Limit and Fixed-Limit alternately with PL 4/8 (small blind/big blind) and FL with 50/100(?) (small bet/ big bet).
In FL with a game of 4 streets you can loose max. 4sb+4sb+4bB+4bB = 12 big bets => 1200$

 

[Labrat]

If it's PL, there must be at least 100bb in the pot before you can open for 100bb.

Good point. So if there's 100bb in the pot when the river card is dealt....

 

[Labrat]

I don’t see how they could when their max allowed in the pot is 100b.

But I also don’t see how u could river bet 100b bc how did that pot get so big without you committing some of our chips already.

Most likely you only have 60 or so big blinds left. Because how could you bet a pot that large without already having chips committed

Well, I'm thinking the pot could be at 100bb after the turn's round of betting, no?

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

So if I open the river betting with 100bb, nobody can raise me?

I bet 20 BB preflop, you call. 40 BB pot.
On the flop, I bet 80 BB, meeting the cap. you call. 200 BB pot.

Even if we have 1000 BB behind, there can be no more betting, since each player has put in 100 BB. Its as if we're all-in. That's the cap. Doesn't matter the street, its just max loss per player in the hand.

Ignore pot size, its per player. If its $1/2, I can wager a maximum of $200 on this hand no matter what street if its a 100BB cap.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Well, I'm thinking it could be 100bb after the turn's round of betting, no?

If the pot is 100b by the turn, how many chips have you committed in already?

Not being a smartass but have you played pot limit before?

 

[Labrat]

If the pot is 100b by the turn, how many chips have you committed in already?

Not being a smartass but have you played pot limit before?

I'm not sure how that's pertinent? If there's 8 people staying in up to the turn, which is pretty reasonable seeing we're talking about .10/.10 stakes like the OP states, it could climb pretty quickly, right?

Just seems to me spread limit would be easier to manage.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Blinds are $5-$10
PLO $1000 cap

UTG has $5k effective stack. Raises to $30.

Button reraises to $100.

Utg calls. Heads up. Pot is $225. Each player has $100 in front of them.

Flop comes. UTG player bets $200. Button calls $200.

Pot is $625. Each player has $300 in front of them.

Turn.

UTG bets $625. He now has $925 in front of him. Button calls. Also has $925 in front of him representing his amt in the pot. Pot is well over $1800+++

At the river they both can only call or raise $75. Bc they have each put $925 into the pot.

 

[doublebooyah85]

I'm not sure how that's pertinent? If there's 8 people staying in up to the turn, which is pretty reasonable seeing we're talking about .10/.10 stakes like the OP states, it could climb pretty quickly, right?

Just seems to me spread limit would be easier to manage.

Yes spread would be easier to manage. But there’s a reason spread is not that popular and high limit players play capped games. It’s the better version. Also requires a dealer usually and everyone knows how to play PLO well.

 

[doublebooyah85]

I'm not sure how that's pertinent? If there's 8 people staying in up to the turn, which is pretty reasonable seeing we're talking about .10/.10 stakes like the OP states, it could climb pretty quickly, right?

Just seems to me spread limit would be easier to manage.

It’s pertinent bc you must have already put chips in the pot. Say 20bb, so ur only allowed to put 80bb more in. It’s capped per player. Not capped pot. Not capped by street. Capped by per player following PLO betting structure.

 

[Labrat]

This started out with the OP saying it would be a .10/.10 game. I was going on that info with all this.

At any rate, I get it with the caps.

 

[doublebooyah85]

This started out with the OP saying it would be a .10/.10 game. I was going on that info with all this.

At any rate, I get it with the caps.

BOOYAH!

Sorry my example was 100x lol. But same exact thing.