Circus Strategy: Scrotum8 (1 Viewer)

[MatB]

if the board had flopped different..

Lets say its K 4 2 and Villain pots. thats tough. Honestly i think i put them on the low hand and stacks probably getting in good.

But even there, once again i am ahead. and villain needs 1 outer.

Lets say flop is 2 J 8 villain pots.

I snap fold. basically anytime im not crushing the flop im walking away.

Only villain holding AAA without hitting the flop is ahead.

Any other holding for the high, villain needs to have connected with the flop in a big way.

My point is there are VERY few hands that beat me post flop on the board i connect with. And if i dont connect i fold.

 

[MatB]

I realize that lol. But are you folding your KK hand every time you flop a set with it? Playing to flop full houses is very tough!

If i flop top set and no boat... really, who knows. at the time maybe hes on the low, maybe hes got quads? on a rainbow board too, the odds of hitting quads or a boat are slim.

Fuggit JAM ! JAM ! JAM !

 

[Rhodeman77]

if the board had flopped different..

Lets say its K 4 2 and Villain pots. thats tough. Honestly i think i put them on the low hand and stacks probably getting in good.

But even there, once again i am ahead. and villain needs 1 outer.

Lets say flop is 2 J 8 villain pots.

I snap fold. basically anytime im not crushing the flop im walking away.

Only villain holding AAA without hitting the flop is ahead.

Any other holding for the high, villain needs to have connected with the flop in a big way.

My point is there are VERY few hands that beat me post flop on the board i connect with. And if i dont connect i fold.

On a K42 rainbow flop you feel you good with your chances to win against a hand that held 3 cards?!?

They could already have a low to already get 1/2 the pot. They could have also have a straight draw and also have 3 to a suite and only need one more of that suite to make a flush to beat your high.

Just guessing without doing any real math, I would bet your actual equity on a K42 rainbow board vs 3 low cards of one suite that has one on the board is less than 25%

 

[Schmendr1ck]

My point is there are VERY few hands that beat me post flop on the board i connect with. And if i dont connect i fold.

But also, some of the boards that make a strong holding in Holdem (like top set) can be crushed in Scrotum8 by an opponent holding 3 or 4 cards. When the pot gets big and they know you have two cards, they often show up with hands like nut low + a straight/flush draw, big trips, made straight, flush, full house or quads, or draws with huge equity against your set.

It's also easier for your opponent to play against you, as they know you are capped by board texture and they are not.

In this particular hand, you saw a cheap flop, smashed it, got your stack in good, and got one-outered on the turn. But in general, I fold pre if I don't have at least a strong three-card hand in this game.

 

[MatB]

On a K42 rainbow flop you feel you good with your chances to win against a hand that held 3 cards?!?

1/2 the deck gives them a low to already get 1/2 the pot which could also complete a straight. They could also have 3 to a suite and only need one more of that suite to make a flush to beat your high.

Just guessing without doing any real math, I would bet your actual equity on a K42 rainbow board vs 3 low cards of one suite that has I e in the board is less than 25%

Fugging number wizardry ! take your dark magic elsewhere !

It comes down to do i think hes hitting the low. I am probably not repotting but a call looks good on K42 flop.

 

[MatB]

But also, some of the boards that make a strong holding in Holdem (like top set) can be crushed in Scrotum8 by an opponent holding 3 or 4 cards. When the pot gets big and they know you have two cards, they often show up with hands like nut low + a straight/flush draw, big trips, a made full house/quads, or draws with huge equity against your set.

It's also easier for your opponent to play against you, as they know you are capped by board texture and they are not.

In this particular hand, you saw a cheap flop, smashed it, got your stack in good, and got one-outered on the turn. But in general, I fold pre if I don't have at least a strong three-card hand in this game.

this is true, but also a high hand is crippled by 3 cards sometimes.

making a set while holding 3 cards is hard for that hand to improve (assuming we dont know villain is holding a set)

Holding A 3 4 and AA4 flops you have a set. Unimprovable.

 

[CraigT78]

Let's talk about that jackass that pot, pot, pot, pot with trips 3's. He's the real donkey.

 

[MatB]

Let's talk about that jackass that pot, pot, pot, pot with trips 3's. He's the real donkey.

Yeah , i didn't name who the villain was, so as to protect their 'Tight player" image.

 

[Mr Tree]

if the board had flopped different..

Lets say its K 4 2 and Villain pots. thats tough. Honestly i think i put them on the low hand and stacks probably getting in good.

But even there, once again i am ahead. and villain needs 1 outer.

Lets say flop is 2 J 8 villain pots.

I snap fold. basically anytime im not crushing the flop im walking away.

Only villain holding AAA without hitting the flop is ahead.

Any other holding for the high, villain needs to have connected with the flop in a big way.

My point is there are VERY few hands that beat me post flop on the board i connect with. And if i dont connect i fold.

Most of the time someone feels comfortable putting away in Scrotum 8 post flop it’s some kind of low potentially with a draw to a high. The high can be so zany it is t often you find someone with a high that feels great about it.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

this is true, but also a high hand is crippled by 3 cards sometimes.

making a set while holding 3 cards is hard for that hand to improve (assuming we dont know villain is holding a set)

Holding A 3 4 and AA4 flops you have a set. Unimprovable.

Of course, but 3-4 cards can also be a well-disguised full house, straight, flush, quads, nut low, etc. That's the challenge of this game.

The problem as I see it is that an opponent can easily cap your hand strength if you're holding two cards. That gives them two powerful ways to win when they hold 3+ cards; make a well-disguised hand that beats you, or pound you into folding based on the maximum strength of your hand.

 

[MatB]

I concur

 

[DrStrange]

In my opinion, the best starting hands have sweeping potential. So that means all low cards after your discard, either suited or straighting <knowing that a straight rarely wins high if the bets get big > Wheel cards are better, never use an eight unless three+ to a flush in hand.

High only hands are playable, two pair and up. But size matters, I would not play two baby pairs. Nor would I be enthusiastic with a tiny set. Under-full is a disaster. Plus "high" hands that get made when low cards are on the board often end up chopping or getting freerolled.

Made high hands are often traps. I would fold a made straight unless it was also a seven low or better. Same thing with most flushes. Different if short stacked.

Made low hands can be nice, again with no 8-lows.

Big pairs can be played if cheap - big meaning KK or AA. Basically only playing to flop top set. Not middle set, for sure not bottom set. The deeper the better, hoping for exactly what happened here - over full vs under full

Position matters more because position also buys you a look at how everyone else is discarding.

In the hand posted, the guy with the baby set made a rookie mistake. Why are all the bets going in from the guy holding two cards? He either has to be an idiot and/or new to the game. Or he has KK / 66, crushing under-full threes.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

I concur

Great! Now if you'll give me my money back, we'll call it even. Sending mailing address via PM.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

He either has to be an idiot or new to the game.

Why not both?

 

[DoubleEagle]

In my opinion, the best starting hands have sweeping potential. So that means all low cards after your discard, either suited or straighting <knowing that a straight rarely wins high if the bets get big > Wheel cards are better, never use an eight unless three+ to a flush in hand.

High only hands are playable, two pair and up. But size matters, I would not play two baby pairs. Nor would I be enthusiastic with a tiny set. Under-full is a disaster. Plus "high" hands that get made when low cards are on the board often end up chopping or getting freerolled.

Made high hands are often traps. I would fold a made straight unless it was also a seven low or better. Same thing with most flushes. Different if short stacked.

Made low hands can be nice, again with no 8-lows.

Big pairs can be played if cheap - big meaning KK or AA. Basically only playing to flop top set. Not middle set, for sure not bottom set. The deeper the better, hoping for exactly what happened here - over full vs under full

Position matters more because position also buys you a look at how everyone else is discarding.

In the hand posted, the guy with the baby set made a rookie mistake. Why are all the bets going in from the guy holding two cards? He either has to be an idiot or new to the game. Or he has KK / 66, crushing under-full threes.

Sage advice in all split pot games.

I'm going to the Shootout, my first ever meet-up. These circus games will be a test for me.

 

[MatB]

Great! Now if you'll give me my money back, we'll call it even. Sending mailing address via PM.

 

[CraigT78]

In the hand posted, the guy with the baby set made a rookie mistake.

He either has to be an idiot or new to the game.

Option 3 - Drunk as a Skunk?

 

[Jonesey07]

Option 3 - Drunk as a Skunk?

I believe you meant hit his run good groove.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

View attachment 254296

 

[MatB]

So another reason this is in the strat thread,

There was talk.. from 'some' that i should (we all should) be playing our airs with another card. Perhaps to throw off the 2 'your opponent knows your range' problem.

I only half agree with that.

if i had an A or maybe a Q, at a stretch a J, i may have kept that going into the flop. holding KKA, then villain has no read on my holding.
But there is no way i would be keeping anything less than a J. I had nothing of high value to go with my KK so they were discarded.

 

[DrStrange]

folding is better than holding a pair plus dangling card. Throwing off the villain's table read is certainly worth while, but turning your hand into weak-sauce to fool the table is not the best plan.

I consider AKK garbage - not only does it make under-full but it puts a low card on the board.

QKK is a bit better than AKK, but still garbage.

Really - just play the naked kings or pitch them in the muck. Don't make fancy plays. The typical table is not that good or observant - give up t he read and play your best hand. Few people will notice.

 

[pltrgyst]

And now, the geriatric viewpoint:

Of course, the best strategy is to not play Scrotum8 at all. The game was invented to play high-only (as was Chowaha, aka 3-2-1; not to mention seven-card stud).

IMO, only thrill seekers with short attention spans, attention deficit disorders, or way too much money in their ATM-accessible accounts need to play everything high/low (or multi-board, for that matter).

Ymmv... and undoubtedly does.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Not going to beat it to death, but set-mining in this game like it's Hold'em is a mistake. You won this time because your opponent made an even worse play than you did. Now, maybe it's a mitigating factor if you know your opponent will often screw up that badly, but in general two-card hands are trash because they're weak and they live on the shit end of the board texture effect. Your opponent's preflop play was better; he was drawing to quads, which is like the Scrotum version of set-mining. His post-flop play was obviously horrible.

You generally need to be playing three- and four-card hands, always with low possibility except for the very strongest full house and bigger draws. Once in a blue moon, you'll catch a five-card hand that's worth keeping, but unless it's a made wheel or queens full or better, it's probably just going to make you waste money.