Gem Mint Rack of Cleveland $5 Chips (2 Viewers)

[Smiff]

As many of you know, I've been trying to put together a Gem Mint set of 1000 chips of each denomination the Horseshoe Cleveland offered. The hard part was there were no secondary or uncirculated $1's and $5's.

I'm just about there except for the $1 chips and it's been fairly evident how hard I'm chasing those. I still need 20

The secondaries are all mint, so no point in showing those, but I'm nearly there on 2 racks of $5's and 1 rack of $1's. I'll post "The perfect Cleveland Horseshoe Set" as soon as it's completed.

But here is one perfect rack of $5's. Most people sending me mint chips have sent those with a flea bite or two but you just have to still consider them mint, when there is no such thing as an uncirculated $5 Cleveland Horseshoe Chip.

But this rack.....absolutely gem mint, like out of the box perfect. Not a flea bit or flaw on a single chip. Very proud of this rack. It's hard to understand how, at $.59 per chip, this rack cost me $400, but it did.

Special thanks to @GoStumpy, @RainmanTrail, @TheChipRoom for this gorgeous rack, although many of you contributed.

Fun Fact - Between my own purchases and the findings from dozens of forum members, this rack was put together out of more than 9000 $5 chips. So yeah....about 1 in 100 were truly mint. Many more were a 9+ on a scale to 10, but not truly a 10. This rack is a perfect 10 (and I haven't even cleaned them yet!)

Steve
Dallas, TX

 

[ssanel54]

Hey Steve, congrats on putting together this set! They do look awesome and I can't wait to see the full group once you are done.

I would be slightly cautious of designating these as Mint however. In context of the Horseshoe Cle, I agree that these are probably the best you will find, the edges are sharp, and they will work great with the other uncirculated chips - calling them Mint is certainly reasonable. Big picture though, Mint is generally a much stronger designation for collectors. Just because there were no Uncirculated $5s or $1s it does not mean that the Very Best of the circulated chips should now be considered Mint.

I don't think you are trying to misrepresent your chips in any way, and its more a case of your excitement on being able to bring these all together. I hesitated in posting this, as I am probably coming across as a D-bag. But, As someone who has bought many chips that were advertised as Mint, and only to be disappointed in their true condition, I wanted to emphasize to some of the newer members that there is a difference.

Congrats again on a unique set!

 

[GoStumpy]

Ssanel54, trust me in saying that these ARE in fact MINT. I say this because there is zero way to get minter. They have sharp brand new edges, untouched faces, and stack 100% equal height to uncirculated chips.

Example:

 

[Smiff]

Hey Steve, congrats on putting together this set! They do look awesome and I can't wait to see the full group once you are done.

I would be slightly cautious of designating these as Mint however. In context of the Horseshoe Cle, I agree that these are probably the best you will find, the edges are sharp, and they will work great with the other uncirculated chips - calling them Mint is certainly reasonable. Big picture though, Mint is generally a much stronger designation for collectors. Just because there were no Uncirculated $5s or $1s it does not mean that the Very Best of the circulated chips should now be considered Mint.

I don't think you are trying to misrepresent your chips in any way, and its more a case of your excitement on being able to bring these all together. I hesitated in posting this, as I am probably coming across as a D-bag. But, As someone who has bought many chips that were advertised as Mint, and only to be disappointed in their true condition, I wanted to emphasize to some of the newer members that there is a difference.

Congrats again on a unique set!

Believe me when I tell you that "As someone who has bought many chips that were advertised as Mint, only to be disappointed in their true condition"....these are in fact Mint. I have about 600 other $5 chips that would be along the lines of your description that I paid Mint Price for and will have to sell at Junkyard prices.

100 chips out of 9000.....believe me (and Stumpy below)...these are MINT

 

[Psypher1000]

This rack is a perfect 10 (and I haven't even cleaned them yet!)

If they're mint, why would they need cleaning? And if you clean them, are they still mint?

 

[GoStumpy]

I also have 3 racks of 'VGC' chips, the ones I sold smiff were leaps and bounds better than the 300 I kept.

 

[GoStumpy]

If they're mint, why would they need cleaning? And if you clean them, are they still mint?

They don't need cleaning... maybe wipe the chalk off heh

 

[ssanel54]

Ssanel54, trust me in saying that these ARE in fact MINT. I say this because there is zero way to get minter. They have sharp brand new edges, untouched faces, and stack 100% equal height to uncirculated chips.

From the pics they look great! Some would argue that once they are in circulation, they are no longer Mint.

Just saw the stack pics - they do look better condition than the $25s :0

 

[GoStumpy]

From the pics they look great! Some would argue that once they are in circulation, they are no longer Mint.

The 3 barrels I sent smiff were never in circulation, they were merely thrown in with the rest of the $5's when they switched out the chips.

 

[Rhodeman77]

Crazy that they ended up costing 80% of face value.

They look soooo good!

 

[Smiff]

If they're mint, why would they need cleaning? And if you clean them, are they still mint?

If I need to wipe the bubble gum powder off of a '68 Topps Nolan Ryan Rookie that came straight out of the wax pack does that mean it's not mint?

 

[Mr. Cheese]

Great looking chips! Congrats on getting some beautiful 5's!

Speaking of mint chips I had a rather disappointing experience recently with some Terrible's I bought from someone on here. Advertised as mint but they were definitely played with. Yes sharp edges but about 1/4 of them were dirty/discolored and needed to be cleaned to be bright white again and match the others. Unfortunately the term mint isn't an actual term that CCGTCC uses. New is their "mint" condition essentially.

 

[ssanel54]

As many of you know, I've been trying to put together a Gem Mint set of 1000 chips of each denomination the Horseshoe Cleveland offered. The hard part was there were no secondary or uncirculated $1's and $5's.


But here is one perfect rack of $5's. Most people sending me mint chips have sent those with a flea bite or two but you just have to still consider them mint, when there is no such thing as an uncirculated $5 Cleveland Horseshoe Chip.

These were the statements, that made me think twice, but a picture is worth a thousand words.

I just didn't want people throwing around the term Mint for any chip that still has sharp edges and was cherry picked from a large lot

 

[Psypher1000]

If I need to wipe the bubble gum powder off of a '68 Topps Nolan Ryan Rookie that came straight out of the wax pack does that mean it's not mint?

And therein lies the crux of the discussion - we don't have a definition for "mint" that's recognized/accepted around the chipping hobby, and that's part of why I caution the use of the term "mint". Even the term "New" which is broadly used in chipping has very slight definitions meaning from guide to guide (some consider chips to be "New" only if they've never been played; others don't enforce that stipulation with the rest of the definition).

In any case, it's clear that the chips are as New as a reasonable person could discern w/o them truly being new-in-box, and I take no exception to your use of the term mint - your pictures illustrate your meaning quite clearly and accurately! I'm with the other Scott, though, in that I've seen quite the liberal use of the term mint & generally caution folks from using it. Because what is a mint chip? One that's never been touched by human hands? Never been out of the box? Never been used on the table? Been in the rack, but only been sold to a collector before actually having been used for a bet? Still has sharp edges but has been used for a bet or ten?

And what about the chips that come with a fleabite straight from the factory? Even though they may still be new-in-box, are those still mint? Are they mint if we clean them? What about if we take never-been-played, new-in-box chips, and oil them lightly with mineral oil? What if we only wipe the dust off with a damp rag?

 

[RainmanTrail]

If I need to wipe the bubble gum powder off of a '68 Topps Nolan Ryan Rookie that came straight out of the wax pack does that mean it's not mint?

I'll trade you some mint $5s for your 68 Topps Nolan Ryan!

 

[GoStumpy]

Kinda crapping on a pr0n thread?

 

[bentax1978]

I'll trade you some mint $5s for your 68 Topps Nolan Ryan!

With or without bubble gum powder?

 

[bentax1978]

Kinda crapping on a pr0n thread?

Pr0n will still be there, just with a little additional "plot".

 

[ssanel54]

Kinda crapping on a pr0n thread?

nah, everyone is complimenting the pron..and it least we aren't crapping a WTS thread

 

[RainmanTrail]

You guys are funny. Who cares about terms when we have pics? These are as mint as mint gets.

FWIW (some will certainly argue with me here) there is essentially no difference in resale value between "new", "mint", "played with a few times", "very near mint", and "near mint" chips. I actually ran an ANOVA model to prove this to myself. Not that anyone cares or even knows what that is lol.

 

[Rhodeman77]

I'll trade you some mint $5s for your 68 Topps Nolan Ryan!

I have a friend from HS that has 4 of them is a single sleeve! His dad collected every set and would put doubles behind the other cards. The entire wall of his room is binders of every Topps set. Crazy how much money is just sitting there!

Then there is the comic book collection in the attic...

 

[RainmanTrail]

With or without bubble gum powder?

With baseball cards, this might actually matter lol. Not with chips though

 

[Smiff]

Well....I am a baseball card collector too and so I have some thoughts on this. It may not necessarily translate to chipping, but it probably should. There absolutely are chips that could come straight off the compression mold, into a box, never touched by a human being and not "technically" be mint. Brand new baseball cards that have never been touched are very very rarely mint when graded. I would suspect that not a single $5 chip in that rack would be considered Mint to a grading company that would inspect it's every micrometer under a 10x loupe, give it a grade, seal it up and register it. They would find the label not perfectly centered, a color-dye transfer (however slight) or the bleeding of ink on the H of Horseshoe that didn't meet their perfect standard. I'm not aware of a chip grading company and this forum doesn't seem like the place that people are looking for the perfect un-cancelled Inverted Jenny Postage Stamp worth a couple million bucks. But rather, this seems to me to be the place where collections of chips are bought, sold, viewed and generally drooled on (which decreases their mint state significantly).

So if we're going to get into grading of things for re-sale value of individual chips, then we can discuss that. And if that's the case, then nobody has a mint set of anything, because there is no way possible that even 10 chips in a 1000, straight off the manufacturing line, would be "GRADED" mint.

So....now that nobody has any mint sets of anything, I'll put this rack up against any $5 rack out there.

And for the record, it's just me that enjoys their perfection and they'll never hit the market anywhere or a poker table for that matter. It's my first set to collect and I'm having a ball trying to find the highest quality chips that exist within it.

They aren't mint, per se...but then again, they really are.

 

[ssanel54]

You guys are funny. Who cares about terms when we have pics? These are as mint as mint gets.

FWIW (some will certainly argue with me here) there is essentially no difference in resale value between "new", "mint", "played with a few times", "very near mint", and "near mint" chips. I actually ran an ANOVA model to prove this to myself. Not that anyone cares or even knows what that is lol.

So will you be listing all of your For Sale Chips as "Played with a few Times" in the future?

 

[GoStumpy]

Exactly the reason I sold them to you, there's no way I could put those beautiful $5's into play alongside my "VGC" $5's, and not be tilted beyond all hope... so I let go of the *mint* ones and kept the VGC ones for myself to put into play

 

[DJ Mack]

Kinda crapping on a pr0n thread?

There's people who like crap in their porn. Just sayin'.

 

[Smiff]

I'll trade you some mint $5s for your 68 Topps Nolan Ryan!

You don't even know it's grade yet!!! But I do have one - Graded, as well as a 1969 and a 1970.

 

[Smiff]

I gotta tell ya....when I posted this (my first gallery or prOn post ever) I wondered how long it would take for a single person to even view it. You guys are crackin' me up. This is hilarious.

 

[MegaTon44]

Mint? Those things look like bicycle tires. I almost mistook them for Grand Vic primaries.

 

[ssanel54]

I gotta tell ya....when I posted this (my first gallery or prOn post ever) I wondered how long it would take for a single person to even view it. You guys are crackin' me up. This is hilarious.

Interstingly, I think the spot pattern you chose on the 4th barrel of chips in the photo makes them appear less minty to me than the others.