Have Chinese cards mold replica sets gone too far? (9 Viewers)

[QuailValley]

Since it's been a while since discussed and a lot more seta have gone out have there been any updates on longterm wear of the Tina chips?

Anyone with real world experience of sets that have seen regular play? How is wear? Do they become more slippery? How does this vary by mold/run?

I think that could be a big factor. Out of the box they may be a good substitute, but not if they are super slippery after 20 games.

I can say for certain the cards mold get slippery pretty quickly. I have a shuffle stack on my desk and there were spinners when I got them some wear to a degree right away and its gotten steadily worse. And I would imagine it would be the same on all the other non-textured ones.

That said the new hybrid chips are already significantly better than the older cards mold in terms of feel. They really do rival CPC and Paulson chips in that area. Additionally the hybrid molds have less material that will contact the next chip (as the center is indented with a label), and the chip itself is textured. I will imagine over time the texture will rub down with use/play, but how long that takes to make much of a difference IDK. Further the label may end up being a weak spot. As I use and handle mine I see more and more just slightly lifted labels or have some air bubbles where they weren't placed firmly down perfectly. Still great chips but could be an issue in terms of durability. Also they are just labels not something pushed directly into the chip itself.

With all of that in mind even clay chips wear down over time, so IDK how it will all shake out in the end.

I think there will still be a market for the Paulsons and CPCs. Especially the CPCs that are Rounders replicas. And of course people will always want to un-obtainable with paulsons.

 

[Budha]

While the Tina chips are a great value and certainly have their place in the market, not sure I make a direct connection to THC pricing.

I think THC (even RHC to a lesser extent) is in the luxury tier, whereas Tina’s are in the “value” tier. Not sure how directly one effects the others pricing (interesting topic actually). Luxury mkts “can” behave differently.

There will also always be the limited availability & qty associated with Paulson’s.

Could Tina’s hurt CPC’s business…? Yeah, I could see that happening, but hard to say to what degree.

 

[upNdown]

Although I really like them a lot, there is really no comparison to a true compression molded clay chip

Here’s my two cents - those 43mm Greek hybrids with the small recess/label feel better and any non compression clay chip I’ve ever felt.
Are they comparable? I’m not sure. They certainly don’t have the cache of real clay. But I can tell you I’d rather own them than casino used RHCs, for whatever that’s worth.

The hybrids are putting the cards molds out to pasture for sure - seems like people can’t sell them off quickly enough. But I’m not sure they’ll cut into the clay market.
Hybrids are what, like 50 cents a chip? Much cheaper than any decent compressed clay, but still not crazy cheap. I can’t figure out why they haven’t replaced China clays yet, but that might be the ultimate fate.

 

[Colquhoun]

I don’t see Tina chips impacting CPC sales at all. I don’t think any person considering custom chips in the $2-$4 per chip range is swayed to the .50 per chip category.

However, I do figure that Tina chips are very enticing to the customer considering BPPro ceramics, and I wonder if their sales have been recently impacted. Maybe not as much, considering only people from PCF would go with Tina chips over BRPro.

 

[ngmcs8203]

I don’t see Tina chips impacting CPC sales at all. I don’t think any person considering custom chips in the $2-$4 per chip range is swayed to the .50 per chip category.

However, I do figure that Tina chips are very enticing to the customer considering BPPro ceramics, and I wonder if their sales have been recently impacted.

100% agree. These are two different groups of buyers. That's like saying people interested in Ferrari's and Lamborghini's will be swayed by a sporty new Dodge.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

Since it's been a while since discussed and a lot more seta have gone out have there been any updates on longterm wear of the Tina chips?

Anyone with real world experience of sets that have seen regular play? How is wear? Do they become more slippery? How does this vary by mold/run?

I think that could be a big factor. Out of the box they may be a good substitute, but not if they are super slippery after 20 games.

Textured no molds have lots of spinners. My players who could care less about the chips (one didnt even see the denominations) mentioned how much better ChipCos felt.

 

[upNdown]

I don’t see Tina chips impacting CPC sales at all. I don’t think any person considering custom chips in the $2-$4 per chip range is swayed to the .50 per chip category.

Right.

I guess for the past handful of years, the cheaper path to “customs” was relabels. Buy Paulsons, relabel them, and if you have to sell, you’ll still get hurt less than you would reselling CPC customs.
So maybe we’ll see more hybrids than relabels in the future. And hell, you can still relabel hybrids. So gear wins either way! Hmm. Conspiracy?

 

[SeanGecko]

I like CPC but I was never going to purchase them. I can't deal with the price point. They are beautiful. I really like BRPro but they don't have labels. So I'm sticking with my wife and our pride & joy hybrids.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Before these hybrid Tina molds what was the second best custom option? Whatever it was…wasn’t close to CPC. And these are imho better than any other ceramic option and look like clays. Better colors and edge spots than even CPC. To the rookie or entry level person that’s significant. They previously may have entered the market, thinking they were spending a dollar/chip but then had to sacrifice and buy CPC for double+ more than their budget. . I could see that happening less since the improvement of Tina chips.

 

[Rieguy]

Has it been another year and a half already?


It does appear the conversation has now changed from their mere existence to what effect Tina's new molds have had on the market, so that is good at least. I will say, past entry-level chips such as China Clay's used to be the gateway drug to CPCs and RHCs. With Tina's current quality, price, and customization factor, many just either happily stick with that option or skip RHC/CPC and move straight to THC if or when they're ready to upgrade. Can't blame anyone due to prices and potential resell factor differences.

 

[DirtyTIVA]

100% agree. These are two different groups of buyers. That's like saying people interested in Ferrari's and Lamborghini's will be swayed by a sporty new Dodge.

That new Corvette ZR1 is pretty nice and is in fact drawing plenty of attention in the forums.

 

[QuailValley]

As much as I like the hybrid chips to the point I don't think I will ever seriously consider CPC chips.

I still think they will have a good market in the retail space since they are the Rounders chips. People will always want a piece of that. And while yes the Panda KGB (and other KGB clones) are very close and cool, having the real deal is a different kind of draw that the hybrid ceramics cant match. Having your buddies over and being able to say "yeah these are the same chips as in the movie" is a draw.

Also CPC still sells to Casinos so I dont think they are going out of business if this forum doesn't frequent them as much. Given their current lead time doesnt sound like they are hurting for business.

 

[ngmcs8203]

That new Corvette ZR1 is pretty nice and is in fact drawing plenty of attention in the forums.

Looks like

 

[DrunkleWade]

Jumping in on this debate far too late but hey, I like the topic. @aggie has a fair point in the OP. I liken this to the "homage" in the watch community. I'm a watch collector but I know I'm never going to afford a high end luxury Swiss watch, let alone get a call from the AD. My budget is more mid tier at best. And then along came AliExpress with their knockoff Rolexes and Omegas. AU$150 watches that for all intents and purposes look like the real things at AU$15-20k.

I bought dozens of watches last year and mainly to get a feel for how the real thing would look on my wrist. I know they aren't Rolexes and although they aren't fakes (i.e. branded as such) they are basically photocopies of the originals just with the [insert Chinese brand] name. Are they ripping off someone else's design; Yes. Am I getting a cheap deal; Yes. Do they compare in manufacture quality, feel and function; Nope.

They serve a purpose to perhaps placate your desire for something better but ultimately, if you're an enthusiast, the real thing is the only choice. I'll move up from plastic chips to ceramics or clay comps and they will suffice for a while. I won't be able to pass them off as the real thing as they won't feel or look the same but my mates won't mind. I won't be happy though, until I get my hands on the real thing.

I guess, it's a stepping stone and a way to get into the hobby without breaking the bank. I get what @aggie is saying in that it dilutes the hobby but as long as the community as a whole are somewhat accepting of the 'knockoffs' I don't think it will go away anytime soon. From what I've seen on this forum, the community is far less snobby when it comes to these replica chip sets as opposed to the watch community. Watch snobs are a real and ugly thing.

 

[ngmcs8203]

As much as I like the hybrid chips to the point I don't think I will ever seriously consider CPC chips.

I still think they will have a good market in the retail space since they are the Rounders chips. People will always want a piece of that. And while yes the Panda KGB (and other KGB clones) are very close and cool, having the real deal is a different kind of draw that the hybrid ceramics cant match.

Also CPC still sells to Casinos so I dont think they are going out of business if this forum doesn't frequent them as much. Given their current lead time doesnt sound like they are hurting for business.

Many casinos are switching to ceramics if they haven't already.

 

[doublebooyah85]

100% agree. These are two different groups of buyers. That's like saying people interested in Ferrari's and Lamborghini's will be swayed by a sporty new Dodge.

This analogy is flawed. Not even comparable. $500 vs $2000 transactions vs $25k and $100k makes no sense.

 

[ngmcs8203]

This analogy is flawed. Not even comparable. $500 vs $2000 transactions vs $25k and $100k makes no sense.

Your right, the cars are actually closer in price. A Ferarri Portofino is $215k and a Dodge Charger SRT Demon is $95k. Maybe compare a Dodge Charger SRT Demon against a Civic SI?

 

[QuailValley]

Many casinos are switching to ceramics if they haven't already.

That makes sense.

This analogy is flawed. Not even comparable. $500 vs $2000 transactions vs $25k and $100k makes no sense.

Eh I'm inclined to disagree. People with enough money, especially people with enough money in the hobby are going to push to be as exclusive as possible. They are going to want the un-obtainable that no one else has to wow the 'in crowd.' People outside the hobby would likely gawk at us spending $500 on 'budget chips' when a $100 set would 'work just fine.'

Its the same in jsut about every other hobby I've been apart of. Computers, people build these huge extravagant custom loop water cooled systems with top of the line everything jsut to post online. Would a system 1/4 cost play the same games the same way? Yep. Magic the Gathering, can you win with a cheaper ($20) deck, you betcha. But are people still lining up to build crazy decks with chase cards and spend thousands? Your damn right. Same with cars can the new Corvette ZR1 go around the track faster than a Lambo? Likely, but that wont stop people from lining up the have that bull on the hood.

I can go on and on with hobbies that have significantly higher ceilings and bigger in crowds than poker chips but it all boils down to its about the flex and impressing the 'in crowd'.

 

[chippitydoodah]

Jumping in on this debate far too late but hey, I like the topic. @aggie has a fair point in the OP. I liken this to the "homage" in the watch community. I'm a watch collector but I know I'm never going to afford a high end luxury Swiss watch, let alone get a call from the AD. My budget is more mid tier at best. And then along came AliExpress with their knockoff Rolexes and Omegas. AU$150 watches that for all intents and purposes look like the real things at AU$15-20k.

I bought dozens of watches last year and mainly to get a feel for how the real thing would look on my wrist. I know they aren't Rolexes and although they aren't fakes (i.e. branded as such) they are basically photocopies of the originals just with the [insert Chinese brand] name. Are they ripping off someone else's design; Yes. Am I getting a cheap deal; Yes. Do they compare in manufacture quality, feel and function; Nope.

They serve a purpose to perhaps placate your desire for something better but ultimately, if you're an enthusiast, the real thing is the only choice. I'll move up from plastic chips to ceramics or clay comps and they will suffice for a while. I won't be able to pass them off as the real thing as they won't feel or look the same but my mates won't mind. I won't be happy though, until I get my hands on the real thing.

I guess, it's a stepping stone and a way to get into the hobby without breaking the bank. I get what @aggie is saying in that it dilutes the hobby but as long as the community as a whole are somewhat accepting of the 'knockoffs' I don't think it will go away anytime soon. From what I've seen on this forum, the community is far less snobby when it comes to these replica chip sets as opposed to the watch community. Watch snobs are a real and ugly thing.

A great fake watch might need an expert to find the difference. ANYONE can tell the difference between a Tina replica and the real deal. There's like a "blurryness" to the printing and a "fade" to the colors. I have Cards Mold New China Club and No Mold Bellagio and neither set has a place in my heart.

 

[DirtyTIVA]

Jumping in on this debate far too late but hey, I like the topic. @aggie has a fair point in the OP. I liken this to the "homage" in the watch community. I'm a watch collector but I know I'm never going to afford a high end luxury Swiss watch, let alone get a call from the AD. My budget is more mid tier at best. And then along came AliExpress with their knockoff Rolexes and Omegas. AU$150 watches that for all intents and purposes look like the real things at AU$15-20k.

I bought dozens of watches last year and mainly to get a feel for how the real thing would look on my wrist. I know they aren't Rolexes and although they aren't fakes (i.e. branded as such) they are basically photocopies of the originals just with the [insert Chinese brand] name. Are they ripping off someone else's design; Yes. Am I getting a cheap deal; Yes. Do they compare in manufacture quality, feel and function; Nope.

They serve a purpose to perhaps placate your desire for something better but ultimately, if you're an enthusiast, the real thing is the only choice. I'll move up from plastic chips to ceramics or clay comps and they will suffice for a while. I won't be able to pass them off as the real thing as they won't feel or look the same but my mates won't mind. I won't be happy though, until I get my hands on the real thing.

I guess, it's a stepping stone and a way to get into the hobby without breaking the bank. I get what @aggie is saying in that it dilutes the hobby but as long as the community as a whole are somewhat accepting of the 'knockoffs' I don't think it will go away anytime soon. From what I've seen on this forum, the community is far less snobby when it comes to these replica chip sets as opposed to the watch community. Watch snobs are a real and ugly thing.

I am (allegedly) a watch snob and I can certainly appreciate a good Tina Rolex. Especially the new tungsten weighted versions.

I will be donating one as a prize to COTS V @Josh Kifer

Your right, the cars are actually closer in price. A Ferarri Portofino is $215k and a Dodge Charger SRT Demon is $95k. Maybe compare a Dodge Charger SRT Demon against a Civic SI?

Portofino is trash. The comparison happening over there is ZR1 to SF90. Undeniably beastly ICE. The lap times will be the final word. Design wise Ferrari needs to fire whoever has been doing it since they ditched Pininfarina.

 

[ngmcs8203]

I am (allegedly) a watch snob and I can certainly appreciate a good Tina Rolex. Especially the new tungsten weighted versions.

View attachment 1366794

I will be donating one as a prize to COTS V @Josh Kifer



Portofino is trash. The comparison happening over there is ZR1 to SF90. Undeniably beastly ICE. The lap times will be the final word. Design wise Ferrari needs to fire whoever has been doing it since they ditched Pininfarina.

I just want a Ferrari at 1/100 the cost, is that too much to ask?

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

A great fake watch might need an expert to find the difference. ANYONE can tell the difference between a Tina replica and the real deal. There's like a "blurryness" to the printing and a "fade" to the colors. I have Cards Mold New China Club and No Mold Bellagio and neither set has a place in my heart.

I would put both of those chipsets far below the hybrids that are now being created. Both are early cousins.

 

[chippitydoodah]

I would put both of those chipsets far below the hybrids that are now being created. Both are early cousins.

The only current Tina's I've seen in person are bpt's Excelsior 43mm Roman mold.

 

[DrunkleWade]

A great fake watch might need an expert to find the difference. ANYONE can tell the difference between a Tina replica and the real deal. There's like a "blurryness" to the printing and a "fade" to the colors. I have Cards Mold New China Club and No Mold Bellagio and neither set has a place in my heart.

Fake versus Homage are different though. I won't buy a 'fake' watch but I will buy a homage, or what I like to call a clomage. Tina's are obvious copies of the original Casino chips due to the mold pattern etc and, as you say, the printing and colours are easily identifiable. They aren't trying to pass themselves off as the real thing but is it ok to have them? Totally up to the individual on whether they are happy to table them I guess.

 

[allforcharity]

I don’t see Tina chips impacting CPC sales at all.

Unfortunately, it has happened. Some members have even posted that they canceled their plans to make Scrown orders from CPC because the "same" mold was available from Tina. The development of Tina's Frown mold was nothing less than a slap in the face to CPC and @David Spragg .

 

[DirtyTIVA]

I just want a Ferrari at 1/100 the cost, is that too much to ask?

This is 1/1000 cost

1/30000 cost

 

[ngmcs8203]

This is 1/1000 cost

View attachment 1366847

1/30000 cost

View attachment 1366848

Has @TheRealTeddyKGB seen that second one?

 

[DirtyTIVA]

Has @TheRealTeddyKGB seen that second one?

Too small for him. He built the SP3.

 

[TheRealTeddyKGB]

Has @TheRealTeddyKGB seen that second one?

Too small for him. He built the SP3.

Damn it that's what I was gonna say! (That & I get an email from Lego multiple times a week so yeah, I've seen it)

 

[DirtyTIVA]

Damn it that's what I was gonna say! (That & I get an email from Lego multiple times a week so yeah, I've seen it)

Post a pic of your SP3 and what fraction of the actual cost it is.