slisk250
Straight Flush
No way I'm checking here. 20 bucks
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KQs in the blinds (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter DrStrange
- Start date
MacGrad
3 of a Kind
I'm agreeing with @tripleflatbarrel -- check/raise seems to be a logical move here.
What info do we get from any of the villains from betting? I don't think we're getting any folds here and, based on OP's player profiles, everyone will call and we will still have no idea where we are. I'm also wary of the two players (Cougar / Hawk) who will call and trap with powerhouses -- and AhQx and AXh seem like potential hands out there.
Check, and see if original raiser bets out. There's a chance, based on the reactions from the other two, we'll know where we stand... and a check/raise should narrow the range as well.
What info do we get from any of the villains from betting? I don't think we're getting any folds here and, based on OP's player profiles, everyone will call and we will still have no idea where we are. I'm also wary of the two players (Cougar / Hawk) who will call and trap with powerhouses -- and AhQx and AXh seem like potential hands out there.
Check, and see if original raiser bets out. There's a chance, based on the reactions from the other two, we'll know where we stand... and a check/raise should narrow the range as well.
tripleflatbarrel
Pair
Couple thoughts:
We're blocking the world here by holding both the
& 
on this board. This makes it difficult for UCS to hold 
xh. Is he really opening 
/
? I know you said he's playing a bit more aggressively, but we have to heavily discount making our flush v the main V being a bad thing here since we're blocking & . We're also obviously blocking QQ and KK, reducing the combos of hands v has in his EP open range that have us crushed (QQ) or only slightly behind (like 45% v KK/AA).I'm not very concerned about what Cougar at only 75BB holds. Say we lead for 20BB, UCS calls, and Cougar ships. At that point Cougars SPR is approaching 1 and we're getting a great price to call. There are plenty of Qx, SC that picked up SD/ pair + bd draws and mid-PP combos for a short stack to shove on this board, all of which we are dominating save the sets.
I'm more concerned about BTN here. He has 88, 66, AQo, and I'm assuming most of the
xh combos in his range and is deep enough to concern us about RIO. I like a big check raise here if UCS has a very high CBet %; I think it's the only way we can expect to give BTN a bad price to chase if he is chasing the nut flush. If we lead for 20 and UCS and Cougar call, Hawk is getting a great price.Likewise, if we or UCS leads and Hawk raises, I'll be proceeding with caution.
DrStrange
4 of a Kind
**** So here is the plan ****
Hero checks, planning on a check raise.
I didn't do justice to the description of the UCS - last spring his opening raise range was AA maybe KK. This game it is AK, QQ+ with some small chance he takes a flier on JJ-.
UCS bets $12 into the $25 pot. The Cougar folds. Hawk min raises to $24. Keep in mind he is tricky trappy, so this raise is likely either a slow played preflop monster or perhaps a blocking raise with a drawing hand or Qx hand. Hawk doesn't normally min raise so this is off color enough to make me scratch my head.
Action on Hero. Call $24, follow through with the check raise or fold?
Hero checks, planning on a check raise.
I didn't do justice to the description of the UCS - last spring his opening raise range was AA maybe KK. This game it is AK, QQ+ with some small chance he takes a flier on JJ-.
UCS bets $12 into the $25 pot. The Cougar folds. Hawk min raises to $24. Keep in mind he is tricky trappy, so this raise is likely either a slow played preflop monster or perhaps a blocking raise with a drawing hand or Qx hand. Hawk doesn't normally min raise so this is off color enough to make me scratch my head.
Action on Hero. Call $24, follow through with the check raise or fold?
Kain8
Flush
Your checkraise now has to be in the range of about $60 - $70. If you do checkraise and Hawk shoves, you're priced in to call even if he has the dreaded set. With the two biggest stacks making the bet and the min raise, I'd just call and see what UCS does.
tripleflatbarrel
Pair
When I said I'd proceed with caution if BTN raised the cbet, I wasn't expecting such small sizing. I'm still just calling here, though, and revaluating turn.
This feels pretty fishy.
This feels pretty fishy.
Gary Vroman
Pair
I am putting Hawk on 9h10h. You said he likes to bet his draws and this is cheeseburger steaks so he is double gutted with a flush draw. he mini's to $12 to make it a double cheeseburger.
I am going to bump it to $75 this way you find out where UCS is. I say UCS folds his Ah Qx.
If Hawk has what I think he pushes and I call. Time to run it....
I am going to bump it to $75 this way you find out where UCS is. I say UCS folds his Ah Qx.
If Hawk has what I think he pushes and I call. Time to run it....
MacGrad
3 of a Kind
I'm not liking the reraise by Hawk. This feels like he's trying to sweeten the pot -- a min-raise likely won't drive out UCS (especially since he c-bet), and he probably feels he already has you beat. If he wanted you 100% out, he would have reraised more... so I don't believe he's afraid of you drawing.
The min-raise is out of character... how badly do I want to go to war with him?
I'm calling, and feeling better if a King appears.
The min-raise is out of character... how badly do I want to go to war with him?
I'm calling, and feeling better if a King appears.
I'm calling, and feeling better if an
FYP
MacGrad
3 of a Kind
Lol --if that appears, I'm dancing inside.
However, I'd be ok with a K... two pair, with the flush draw still outstanding... we're not behind anything we weren't losing to already, and we've now passed any AQ. That also further discounts KK as a holding by one of the villains.
Adam Crowley
Two Pair
Pre, always calling here. Hand plays great multi-way and you are deep.
Flop, Donking is a legitimate option, but it depends on what your perceived range would be. If I am playing with people that would assume I am donking with a weak hand, given that the players are calling stations, I think this is the best play. If players tend to cbet too much, I would check and evaluate. If the cbet gets called twice I am c/r here a lot, I would do this with AThh 2 pair hands and sets as well as the super nut hands like KQhh and AQhh. Given that the players are calling stations and the fact that my range is wider than just the nuts here, this is also a great option to consider.
The min raise throws me off a little, I can't come up with a range that really makes sense. If he has Axhh, I would expect him to raise more, if he has a set I would expect him to raise more, he should be aware that his raise does not get many (if any) folds. I can't think of any hands where this move makes a lot of sense and we still have really good equity vs his range. I would flat and evaluate the turn better. The other thing working for us is that if a heart peels on the turn, he is more likely to fire another barrel.
Flop, Donking is a legitimate option, but it depends on what your perceived range would be. If I am playing with people that would assume I am donking with a weak hand, given that the players are calling stations, I think this is the best play. If players tend to cbet too much, I would check and evaluate. If the cbet gets called twice I am c/r here a lot, I would do this with AThh 2 pair hands and sets as well as the super nut hands like KQhh and AQhh. Given that the players are calling stations and the fact that my range is wider than just the nuts here, this is also a great option to consider.
The min raise throws me off a little, I can't come up with a range that really makes sense. If he has Axhh, I would expect him to raise more, if he has a set I would expect him to raise more, he should be aware that his raise does not get many (if any) folds. I can't think of any hands where this move makes a lot of sense and we still have really good equity vs his range. I would flat and evaluate the turn better. The other thing working for us is that if a heart peels on the turn, he is more likely to fire another barrel.
PhilLaFond
Straight
Spidey senses tingling. Call and proceed with caution
DrStrange
4 of a Kind
*** On to the turn ***
Hero calls $24. UCS calls $12. Three way action, $97 in the pot. USC has $245 left, Hawk has $120 left. Hero holds
Turn is <
> 
Action on Hero - bet or check? If betting how much?
Hero calls $24. UCS calls $12. Three way action, $97 in the pot. USC has $245 left, Hawk has $120 left. Hero holds
Turn is <
> Action on Hero - bet or check? If betting how much?
Kain8
Flush
Check call mode for this turn. But only if the bet is on the smaller end, around $30 - $40. Any larger than that, I think you can pack it in and fold up shop.
Agree with the check-call on the flop. Also agree with check-call on the turn to any reasonable bet.
L
L
MacGrad
3 of a Kind
I'm checking, with an eye towards Hawk...
Now that I reread OP, 97 looks like it might be in Hawk's playable range to call $7 preflop, and his min-raise on the turn could have been to fatten the pot enough so he'd be priced in to call with a draw.
One other thing is now bugging me: could OP clarify how much Hawk bought in for? If he was down a bit in the session, he might have opened his range in order to get back into the positive.
Now that I reread OP, 97 looks like it might be in Hawk's playable range to call $7 preflop, and his min-raise on the turn could have been to fatten the pot enough so he'd be priced in to call with a draw.
One other thing is now bugging me: could OP clarify how much Hawk bought in for? If he was down a bit in the session, he might have opened his range in order to get back into the positive.
DrStrange
4 of a Kind
Hawk is having a losing session but not a disaster. He is in for $300, so stuck for $150 at the time of this hand.
Hawk is very well off. $150 is pocket lint to him. There are days he carries in excess of $100,000 in cash. It isn't the money that gets to him, it is losing the game.
Hawk is very well off. $150 is pocket lint to him. There are days he carries in excess of $100,000 in cash. It isn't the money that gets to him, it is losing the game.
ugly nothing card...
geez what to do. whatever you do ends in hope. Bet and hope. check and hope. to me there is no right answer here. there are just many sub optimal choices. Whatever you do here will either be an absolute stroke of genius or an utter disaster. but whatever happens here if you play on the result is now in the hands of the gods.
Im a tournament player so I'd suggest checking. Betting out at this point to me is sub optimal. Anyone chasing is so invested they will most likely call since the pot is now pretty big. Anyone with a made hand (2 pr or better) will flat call you to keep you in the hand and there is a small chance you might get a fold.
So if you were going to stop chasers typically three quarters of the pot will never offer the right odds for your opponents to call. But say you do that and you do get a call? What then? You're down another 60 or so and you're up to your neck in it without the nuts. AND on the river you still may well have the second best hand since only the ace of hearts can give you the nuts.
To me that's all sorts of ugly. Check and hope no one bets. and if opponent bets you have a dilemma. if you're getting the right odds to cal then go ahead. if not there is no shame in folding here to a big bet. Youre not holding a monster here. and that's a very scary board now.
Beware SPOILER ALERT do not read on if you want the answer.
after reading many of these posts by the Dr, they always seem to end well.
geez what to do. whatever you do ends in hope. Bet and hope. check and hope. to me there is no right answer here. there are just many sub optimal choices. Whatever you do here will either be an absolute stroke of genius or an utter disaster. but whatever happens here if you play on the result is now in the hands of the gods.
Im a tournament player so I'd suggest checking. Betting out at this point to me is sub optimal. Anyone chasing is so invested they will most likely call since the pot is now pretty big. Anyone with a made hand (2 pr or better) will flat call you to keep you in the hand and there is a small chance you might get a fold.
So if you were going to stop chasers typically three quarters of the pot will never offer the right odds for your opponents to call. But say you do that and you do get a call? What then? You're down another 60 or so and you're up to your neck in it without the nuts. AND on the river you still may well have the second best hand since only the ace of hearts can give you the nuts.
To me that's all sorts of ugly. Check and hope no one bets. and if opponent bets you have a dilemma. if you're getting the right odds to cal then go ahead. if not there is no shame in folding here to a big bet. Youre not holding a monster here. and that's a very scary board now.
Beware SPOILER ALERT do not read on if you want the answer.
after reading many of these posts by the Dr, they always seem to end well.
MacGrad
3 of a Kind
It's the min-raise that's getting to me... why do that, unless he's trying to build the pot? If he woke up with a straight draw on the flop, it's not out of character for him to bet / raise in that situation. The 10 gets him there... and this is his opportunity to get back to a "winning" session.
I'm checking and expecting a bet from Hawk... depending on the size, I'm calling or folding because I think a flush is the only way I'm back in this hand.
Gary Vroman
Pair
Hero Check, UCS bets $65, Hawk calls with his mid pair, flush, and double gut draw. Hero then calls.
DrStrange
4 of a Kind
*** And now the river ***
Hero checks as do both villains. Three way action, $97 in the pot. USC has $245 left, Hawk has $120 left. Hero holds
River is < > 
Action on Hero - bet or check? If betting how much and why?
Hero checks as do both villains. Three way action, $97 in the pot. USC has $245 left, Hawk has $120 left. Hero holds
River is <
> Action on Hero - bet or check? If betting how much and why?
Kain8
Flush
Your hand is basically a bluff catcher now. Check call up to a half pot bet if UCS bets and Hawk folds.
Last edited:
DrStrange
4 of a Kind
Cougar is long gone from this hand.
The Ultimate Calling Station was the preflop raiser and made the $12 c-bet.
Hawk made the flop min-raise
The Ultimate Calling Station was the preflop raiser and made the $12 c-bet.
Hawk made the flop min-raise
Kain8
Flush
Edited, my bad! 
detroitdad
Royal Flush
Sounds good
tripleflatbarrel
Pair
Check call.
Hard to believe he'd check behind turn with a flopped set or turned straight.
Wouldn't be too surprised if he has AQ.
Hard to believe he'd check behind turn with a flopped set or turned straight.
Wouldn't be too surprised if he has AQ.
Gary Vroman
Pair
Check call up to $90. I'd call his all in if I had a read on him but if no read then only call up to $90. Sometimes I can get a read on people just on how they bet and there mannerisms.
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