My thoughts on Tina’s and forum perspective (3 Viewers)

I’ve been on the forum for about a year and a half. Here’s my 2 cents for what it’s worth.

Initially sluggos was all I knew. Dice chips were upgraded to other sluggos with sticker inlays. I used those for about 10 years. I was finally ready for new chips. Searching online, the sluggos were all I was finding. Then I watched @Hobbyphilic on YouTube. He mentioned PCF several times but I never visited. Instead, I found the Nevada Jack chips from BR watching his YouTube channel and bought a set. BR got me in touch with @mattross1313 to create a custom tournament winner chip.

Then I visited PCF.

I sold the BR chips and purchased two Tina sets from the GB that were designed by @mattross1313. While waiting for those I bought a rack of HSI 1A for $100. Then I was pulled into the Paulson arena.

In the golden age of the chipping hobby, clay chips were $1 or so each. A WTHC 1000 piece set was $1000, now it’s $5000-$10000. I think pricing is the main reason for the shift. However, think about all the vendors besides Tina who benefit from the masses coming. Cards, buttons, 3D printed accessories, etc.

In the end, I have a Tina tournament set, Paulson cash set, and a BR limit set. I’ve been able to find all the accessories one could imagine and more. I’ve made some good friends on here, and blocked some people. :) It’s a small hobby. I think we should embrace all types of players and chips. Buy what makes you happy, and enjoy them. Personally, I wouldn’t buy a set that I wouldn’t use. What’s the point?
 
springbox said:
I don't have anything against Tina chips, and if I were the kind of person who wanted to own more than 3 sets I would consider having some. That being said, I have noticed some significant color wear on the shuffle stack I keep on my desk. Now obviously these are getting more action than most chips will and it doesn't reduce their functionality, but I would be a bit disappointed if I wanted a long term keeper set and it faded like this.

View attachment 1495486
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Was considering a 43mm web mold set…that color fading scares me though
 
ChipFinderSK said:
Was considering a 43mm web mold set…that color fading scares me though
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I would definitely check with other users to see what their experiences are. These are 39mm and sit at my desk where I work, so I wouldn't be surprised if they have 20+ hours of me mindlessly shuffling them.
 
springbox said:
I would definitely check with other users to see what their experiences are. These are 39mm and sit at my desk where I work, so I wouldn't be surprised if they have 10~20+ hours of me mindlessly shuffling them.
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Mindlessly shuffling chips is all I do while playing, and home games are usually 4-6 hours long, so that’s only like 3-4 sessions of wear right there.

Not completely out on the new hybrids yet, but I’m glad you posted that pic…most on PCF are either all-in or all-out on Tinas, so it’s hard to get an unbiased opinion on them. Ball pic don’t lie

I am completely out on cards molds, though (just feel cheap compared to Chipcos/BRPro ceramics)
 
ChipFinderSK said:
Mindlessly shuffling chips is all I do while playing, and home games are usually 4-6 hours long, so that’s only like 3-4 sessions of wear right there.

Not completely out on the new hybrids yet, but I’m glad you posted that pic…most on PCF are either all-in or all-out on Tinas, so it’s hard to get an unbiased opinion on them. Ball pic don’t lie

I am completely out on cards molds, though (just feel cheap compared to Chipcos/BRPro ceramics)
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Worth keeping in mind that you're likely not shuffling the exact same chips over all those games/hands.

But i have a dedicated shuffle stack of Tinas and don't see any real wear on them after 10 hours or so as a data point. Could definitely see it over more time though just given sublimination dyes will only hold up so long.
 
NotRealNameNoSir said:
personally I do not have a problem using the Flamingo logo on my murdered roulettes but I would have a problem selling them listed as a "Flamingos" set.
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I have a very large tourney set which consists 85% of Jack Detroits.

However it also includes one denom of Jack Cincys (because I liked the 25s color better) and three barrels of ultra-high-denoms which are murdered chips from non-Jack sets (25K/100Kdenoms which did not exist for the Jacks).

If I sold it, I would probably title the sale “Huge mixed Jack/faux Jack tourney set.”

And then be very specific about the origin of each denom.

Not sure why that would step on any toes. As long as there is transparency I don’t see an issue.
 
Great discussions. I'm here on PCF to enjoy 'chips'. Not necessarily Paulsons or TRKs, near unobainanium closed casino sets or literally cheap as chips Tinas.

I like purdy colours and clever inlay art and the general creative vibe that many here exhibit. I adore my ceramics, I'll love my Tina's when they arrive and I will cherish my first set of compressed clays.

I could give a rat's arse what anyone else owns when it comes to value or quality. I love poker and the chips that are associated with it.

Chip on!
 
quintooo said:
I just wish people were more creative with their tina designs. There's the whole chip to design, yet people attempt to emulate the limitations of clay chips

I want to see more Parks and Recs type sets. More DDLM type sets. Or imo, the ceramic grail: paymasters https://www.pokerchipforum.com/threads/paymaster-official-chip-pr0n-thread.12539/

there's no shortage of designers here on PCF, so I would've hoped by now we would've seen some truly great ceramic designs
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I see this comment more and more lately. It seems the thinking is that since ceramics have less limitations for design, those that chose not to are being less creative.
Just because ceramics are a different material and can afford the opportunity to design differently, that doesn’t mean that it a requirement.
The traditional image of a poker chip has edgespots and a center inlay. So it stands that when someone wants a new chip, they want it to look like that…regardless of its construction or potential.
 
Colquhoun said:
I see this comment more and more lately. It seems the thinking is that since ceramics have less limitations for design, those that chose not to are being less creative.
Just because ceramics are a different material and can afford the opportunity to design differently, that doesn’t mean that it a requirement.
The traditional image of a poker chip has edgespots and a center inlay. So it stands that when someone wants a new chip, they want it to look like that…regardless of its construction or potential.
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i still hold that they are being less creative though. because they are actively choosing to limit themselves to traditional clay patterns.

which i don't think is morally bad unless youre stealing designs. in fact theres literally nothing wrong with being less creative. plenty of CPC and even NAGB/real casino chips are not creative imo. doesnt even make them bad designs. plenty of simple, not creative chips that are still aesthetically pleasing

i'm just wishing that people who design tinas would be more creative

also you can absolutely have something that mimics the "classic chip" look; yet do something that is not possible in traditional clay... like dunes of arrakis set which i quite like
 
quintooo said:
Colquhoun said:
I see this comment more and more lately. It seems the thinking is that since ceramics have less limitations for design, those that chose not to are being less creative.
Just because ceramics are a different material and can afford the opportunity to design differently, that doesn’t mean that it a requirement.
The traditional image of a poker chip has edgespots and a center inlay. So it stands that when someone wants a new chip, they want it to look like that…regardless of its construction or potential.
Click to expand...

i still hold that they are being less creative though. because they are actively choosing to limit themselves to traditional clay patterns.
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I imagine a good example of Best of Both Worlds is the Lodge chips. They've got the edgespots and the inlay appearance, but not done in the traditional way.
 
Holy f*** did my snide (but not really, see below) comments really help to set off this firestorm of what value chips ought to be?

Crikey, all I said in reply to someone who was looking for 4x25 racks (instead of 5x20) was to "not buy chips that come in 25s because they are crap". What could I have possibly meant by this? Somehow some people saw this as a direct attack against Tina chips and those who would buy them which somehow meant that either the chips or the purchasers must be 'inferior' in some way. Let's just open up our minds, a little.

Initially, I was poking fun at the foible of looking for racks with barrel depths for 25 chips because only chips that were affordable happen to come in sleeves of 25. I was merely trying to hint in a possibly-too-subtle way that this is not the informed way to purchase chips or racks. Since these are items of utility, it is infinitely much more important to figure out, as has been said thousands of times, what you need to play your game. What type of game, how many players, stakes for cash, denoms for tournaments, total bank needed, how many rebuys, etc. What chips come in 25s and what chips don't is not yet relevant. You may find that your chip number needs have denominations that multiple easily into full racks of 100s, so how they come packed becomes moot. How you would jump to sourcing 4x25 racks without even defining what you need in chips is putting the pumpkin before the mice, so to speak.

Okay, then let's look at the "chips that come in 25s" quip. Lots of different types of chips come in 25s, but the vast majority of them are the very cheap injection molded slugged ABS stock design chips that you can find in any drug store on the Vegas Strip. Chips are not an investment vehicle in the grand scheme of things, but they are integral to a good game, and it might behoove someone to at least learn a little more about what options are out there, and their costs of acquisition. And yes, even Tina chips can be considered expensive (at almost 0.50 per chip shipped, now potentially exponentially more expensive due to the tariff war) compared to what else is on the market that's available, and most of them are in the sub 0.20 price category. But is there really anything of objectively great quality there? Probably not.

And in case anybody thinks I made a shot across the bow of ceramic owners, I have been a proud owner of custom ceramics since 2013, which I still use to this very day for my charity fundraising events. I have always been a proponent of ceramic chips for their quality and customization. I have never steered anybody away from Tina ceramics and have never failed to promote them as good quality options, alongside those of BR Pro and SunFly. However, I am constantly dismayed at the seeming need for all ceramic purchasers to mimic compression clay chip patterns instead of using them to their fullest customization potential. I am continually horrified by the development of ceramics with debossed molds that copy mold patterns that other people own and are still in production.

Spend what you like, play how you like, but be cool. And by being cool, I mean be unique, use your imagination, don't rip off others, and don't pretend to be something you're not, don't play the FOMO game. Great creations can come at almost all budgets.
 
Talk about striking a nerve. This is the most spirited debate I have seen since joining PCF. I feel like my limited journey here mirrors a number of the paths described by others. I came here because I wanted a set of custom chips and this is where google lead me. First I found out about relabeling and was content to buy blank Milanos and create the labels. Then someone told me I should check out the Tina group buy because I could get whatever chip layout I wanted as well as a custom inlay. I was already talking with Justin, when someone suggested that since I was replacing a genuine clay set, I would likely not be as happy with the Tina's and "you need CPC in your life." I both simultaneously love and hate that person. Since I was selling my original set to help pay for the CPC set, I needed an interim set so I bought a set of Royals from someone here that I have been using now and I like them a lot. Anyway, my set of CPC customs arrived a couple weeks ago and I am over the moon. But the process of designing those got me toying with the idea of a set based on Philadelphia sports teams. Now, I don't want to spend another $5k on another CPC set that won't see as much play, but I still like the idea so I am in the process of completing that design and plan to do a set of 43mm web mold Tinas. So, to borrow the drug metaphor from an earlier post, in a fairly short period of time, like 6 months, I have gone from skunk weed, to hash, to coke and back to good old adderall and enjoyed all of them. The point is we are all junkies. So enjoy your drug of choice, whatever you can afford and try not to let it become a problem.

I also managed to ruffle a lot of feathers and took a fair amount of grief when I stubbed my toe in how I handled my first sale here and could have easily gotten discouraged and walked away. But I am glad I didn't. In addition to my chip journey, I am with @Timmah in having found many other useful providers and folks willing to educate me. I have bought Broken Arrow cards from @justincarothers . I have custom cut cards coming from @Okku . I looked at a table topper group buy that ultimately lead me to find a vendor who could do a custom 60" round topper. I saw a thread on membership chips that lead me to design and purchase champions' coins for all my club's past champions. And I will be attending my first meetup in June. All of which is just to say, give the new guys a break. Give those that can't afford the high end chips a break. Foster their appreciation of poker chips at whatever entry point they happen to have.

Now, I may end up being sorry I asked, but I have a question for the ethicists among you. The inlays for my Philadelphia sports set mentioned above would pretty much be the actual team logs with the denomination tastefully worked into it. I get the problem with stealing someone else's inlay creations. I get the problem with stealing the proprietary molds of other chip companies. Where on the spectrum of IP theft do you feel using sports team logos on poker chips falls? Does this fall under, "Theft is theft." or does it fall under the heading of "Fuck 'em, sports teams make enough money and I'm not selling these things for a profit, so it's OK."?
 
GreatWhiteDope said:
Talk about striking a nerve. This is the most spirited debate I have seen since joining PCF. I feel like my limited journey here mirrors a number of the paths described by others. I came here because I wanted a set of custom chips and this is where google lead me. First I found out about relabeling and was content to buy blank Milanos and create the labels. Then someone told me I should check out the Tina group buy because I could get whatever chip layout I wanted as well as a custom inlay. I was already talking with Justin, when someone suggested that since I was replacing a genuine clay set, I would likely not be as happy with the Tina's and "you need CPC in your life." I both simultaneously love and hate that person. Since I was selling my original set to help pay for the CPC set, I needed an interim set so I bought a set of Royals from someone here that I have been using now and I like them a lot. Anyway, my set of CPC customs arrived a couple weeks ago and I am over the moon. But the process of designing those got me toying with the idea of a set based on Philadelphia sports teams. Now, I don't want to spend another $5k on another CPC set that won't see as much play, but I still like the idea so I am in the process of completing that design and plan to do a set of 43mm web mold Tinas. So, to borrow the drug metaphor from an earlier post, in a fairly short period of time, like 6 months, I have gone from skunk weed, to hash, to coke and back to good old adderall and enjoyed all of them. The point is we are all junkies. So enjoy your drug of choice, whatever you can afford and try not to let it become a problem.

I also managed to ruffle a lot of feathers and took a fair amount of grief when I stubbed my toe in how I handled my first sale here and could have easily gotten discouraged and walked away. But I am glad I didn't. In addition to my chip journey, I am with @Timmah in having found many other useful providers and folks willing to educate me. I have bought Broken Arrow cards from @justincarothers . I have custom cut cards coming from @Okku . I looked at a table topper group buy that ultimately lead me to find a vendor who could do a custom 60" round topper. I saw a thread on membership chips that lead me to design and purchase champions' coins for all my club's past champions. And I will be attending my first meetup in June. All of which is just to say, give the new guys a break. Give those that can't afford the high end chips a break. Foster their appreciation of poker chips at whatever entry point they happen to have.

Now, I may end up being sorry I asked, but I have a question for the ethicists among you. The inlays for my Philadelphia sports set mentioned above would pretty much be the actual team logs with the denomination tastefully worked into it. I get the problem with stealing someone else's inlay creations. I get the problem with stealing the proprietary molds of other chip companies. Where on the spectrum of IP theft do you feel using sports team logos on poker chips falls? Does this fall under, "Theft is theft." or does it fall under the heading of "Fuck 'em, sports teams make enough money and I'm not selling these things for a profit, so it's OK."?
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Unless you're planning on mass producing that set of shitty, I mean Philly sports teams, I wouldn't worry about it. :D
 
springbox said:
I don't have anything against Tina chips, and if I were the kind of person who wanted to own more than 3 sets I would consider having some. That being said, I have noticed some significant color wear on the shuffle stack I keep on my desk. Now obviously these are getting more action than most chips will and it doesn't reduce their functionality, but I would be a bit disappointed if I wanted a long term keeper set and it faded like this.

View attachment 1495486
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Wow that discolouration is quite significant!
 
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I guess I too fall into what some in the thread are talking about. I'm a recent member. I'm enjoying the forum, and laughed when I recognized several of the Michigan area usernames from a different forum I used to enjoy. Poker interest in general isn't nearly what it used to be, so I think any new members here would be a good thing. Even if only 1% of them stick around and get the bug that helps maintain the value of your chip collections.

I also currently have a 1,000 piece Tina tourney set with custom labels currently somewhere on the Pacific Ocean. I enjoyed designing the labels. I got some good advice on them from multiple senior members and Colquhoun was kind enough to help clean them up and format them with what Tina needs.

I play with a social group probably three weekends a month where the tourney buy-in is $20. I'm buying the Tina set to gift to the host where we play. We currently play with 20 year old dice chips. We try to keep out any where the edges have chipped so badly that you can see exposed metal slugs. But, believe it or not, nobody cares if those occasionally slip in because "social" is the important part of the group. Some of the group is going to be absolutely wasted by the end of the night. But everyone has a great time, and we get 10+ people almost every weekend.

I don't mind spending money on my hobbies. I have five figures into both guitars and guns. I could afford Tiger Palace chips. But a 1,000 piece Tiger Palace set would cost roughly as much as the total pot we play for, if you added up every tournament for the entire year. I realize with some time and effort I could probably put together a clay set for $3,000 that no one here would turn up their nose at. But the question isn't if Tina is "good enough", it's if your clay set is "too good". How many of you would take one of your nice sets to a random tourney at your local bar? Inevitably a few chips are going to disappear, or get chipped/broken, or they're going to get beer/Red Bull/Dr Pepper spilled on them. That's basically what you should expect at the home game where I'm donating the Tina set.

I will admit that the IP arguments here sometimes make me scratch my head. It's funny to me to see someone get outraged over someone copying edge spot patterns and colors while also congratulating people on how great their Sopranos/Godfather/Tangiers/Rounders/Aria/WSOP/Simpsons/Stardust/anything else you can think of labels look. That's not a criticism or call out to anyone, I think they look great too, but it's all IP that someone designed and someone owns. The fact that they'll probably never know or sue you over it doesn't really change that.
 
Gunnar said:
This is also a very good point. Chips are evolving based on our demands. I wonder if a Chinese company would start producing real clay chips what we would think.
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I'll give you a much more interesting hypothetical than that. What would we think if Paulson opened up their production to the public and would recreate any chip they'd ever made (that's not currently in casino use obviously) at current CPC prices?
 
Cratty said:
good for likely a long time
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IMG_4154.gif
 
To use an AI-esque paradigm, Tina’s became sentient when the hybrid versions were developed and released. They aren’t “good enough” - they are good. There is no going back now. Like AI, they’ll only get better.
 
upNdown said:
We were all pretty happy paying something like 65 cents apiece for Sunfly hybrids around 8 years ago, so that plus inflation seems like a good place to start.
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I still love my PGI 8V china clays which were significantly less than 65c Sunflys. And better, in my opinion. I would never sell them for the low price that I paid for them.
 
Gunnar said:
...some people look down on others who enjoy more affordable chips...
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If this is their opinion, their opinion does not matter. You do you, mang. Live your best life and don't look back.

TBH, maybe I'm not looking hard enough but I've not encountered this attitude here. We're all looking for a deal so I can't imagine anyone saying - "Oh look, I paid $XXXX over 'market value'! I'm a G and you're not!"
 
RadicusScout said:
If this is their opinion, their opinion does not matter. You do you, mang. Live your best life and don't look back.

TBH, maybe I'm not looking hard enough but I've not encountered this attitude here.
Click to expand...

I mean, there's literally a post in this thread that says that people who can only afford Tina chips shouldn't play poker.
 

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