courage
Full House
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PGI Ceramics vs. Game On Ceramics (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter jbutler
- Start date
CdnBeerLover
Full House
^^^ This.
I also have spent a good bit of time shuffling the Nine Dragon sample, and they have smoothed out a bit. They are my favorite ceramics to shuffle.
This does not bode well for my wallet...
Best aligned edges I've seen in person were produced by ABC. Square edges and sharp print quality, too. Not to take anything away from PGI or GOCC, but you may want to expand your comparison table, Jack.
i never liked the blanks from ABC. much slicker feeling to me than Chipco (and now the Chipco-like chips here). i was also never nearly as impressed with their print quality as everyone else seems to be.
that isn't to smear ABC - many, many people prefer their chips above anyone else's - but they're not to my taste.
Chicken Rob
Full House
I agree. I was a little disappointed in ABC compared to Chipco (and now GOCC and PGI). I didn't think their edges were that great to my tastes either, as well as the issues Butler mentioned. The slippery feel was the biggest issue for me though. I think the Chipco style blank feels better. For me. Probably going PGI, as I don't want 100 minimum per denom, and only want 600 chips. We'll see how I feel after seeing the 9 Dragons samples this weekend.
They will work with you on that. They did on the 9 dragons anyway.
Chicken Rob
Full House
Awesome. Thanks for that tommy.
SixSpeedFury
Full House
What about OWPS?
really, really like your set.
as to the Old West chips, to me they feel like sunfly blanks. which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but i prefer the gripper texture of the chipco style. also, i like a matte finish on the rolling edge and the OWPS chips rolling edges are a bit glossy for me.
the glossy rolling edge is kind of a deal breaker on ceramics imo. i just can't deal with the difference in texture from the face of the chip. if i could, i'd have already ordered a set on the hybrid sunfly blank that CPC sells.
Mental Nomad
Full House
Since we're learning and comparing, I do notice a couple of my Gold Dragons not in perfect alignment - and in an unexpected way.
I though rotational alignment would be the issue, but in this case, the edges seem fine, and the problem is that the faces are slightly off-center, causing the mis-alignment to the edges.
Here's a scan of a gold dragon which is off-centered on the face:
The image is just slightly low and to the left (not unlike myself.) You might not even notice, just looking at the face, but the size of the yellow border is thinner on the left/bottom than on the top/right.
But if you look at the alignment versus the edge in that bottom left corner:
The top side of the same chip looks great; here it is, rotated 180 degrees:
Most colors are fine, but most of my golds are off-center like this. For some of the gold chips, it's not enough to matter, but for a few, it shows up like on this one - which is, I think, the worst chip in my entire set. I the plant 25 or so blanks between two printed sheets to put on the hot press to sublimate the printed dye into the chips - so if their chip jig is even slightly out of alignment, all of the chips in a print set will be slightly off. (Or if one of the sheets is off.) This would explain why all of my golds are slightly off-center... but only a few show an edge problem.
My purple dragons are also off-center - but the off-center is only on the vertical; the image is slightly low. The left/right centering is perfect. This means that the vertical ribbon art still matches up perfectly to the edges.
This is not a big enough deal to complain about - I'd MUCH rather have these, than to have chips that don't have the edge aligned at all (given this kind of design)... if I were to make any criticism of the set, it would be that the gold color is a little too "lemon" yellow as opposed to gold... but this definitely gives me a new appreciation for the precision and attention needed to pull it off - the edge-printing and face-printing are two separate passes, and not only does the edge have to be lined up to the face, but the face also has to be dead-center to avoid issues.
I though rotational alignment would be the issue, but in this case, the edges seem fine, and the problem is that the faces are slightly off-center, causing the mis-alignment to the edges.
Here's a scan of a gold dragon which is off-centered on the face:
The image is just slightly low and to the left (not unlike myself.) You might not even notice, just looking at the face, but the size of the yellow border is thinner on the left/bottom than on the top/right.
But if you look at the alignment versus the edge in that bottom left corner:
The top side of the same chip looks great; here it is, rotated 180 degrees:
Most colors are fine, but most of my golds are off-center like this. For some of the gold chips, it's not enough to matter, but for a few, it shows up like on this one - which is, I think, the worst chip in my entire set. I the plant 25 or so blanks between two printed sheets to put on the hot press to sublimate the printed dye into the chips - so if their chip jig is even slightly out of alignment, all of the chips in a print set will be slightly off. (Or if one of the sheets is off.) This would explain why all of my golds are slightly off-center... but only a few show an edge problem.
My purple dragons are also off-center - but the off-center is only on the vertical; the image is slightly low. The left/right centering is perfect. This means that the vertical ribbon art still matches up perfectly to the edges.
This is not a big enough deal to complain about - I'd MUCH rather have these, than to have chips that don't have the edge aligned at all (given this kind of design)... if I were to make any criticism of the set, it would be that the gold color is a little too "lemon" yellow as opposed to gold... but this definitely gives me a new appreciation for the precision and attention needed to pull it off - the edge-printing and face-printing are two separate passes, and not only does the edge have to be lined up to the face, but the face also has to be dead-center to avoid issues.
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Chicken Rob
Full House
You seem to have all the same taste quirks that I do about ceramics. Glossy edges are the kiss of death for me. I'm really psyched to see the GOCC chips Saturday since you like them so much. And excited to learn they might do a 600 chip set for me with <100 per denom. This may be a win.
Psypher1000
Straight Flush
This.
Psypher1000
Straight Flush
This problem plagues every ceramic chip I've seen to the point where I consider it a given that images won't be perfectly centered. Nevada Jacks, Laurel Crowns, Niles, Scrolls, casino chips, multiple custom sets from multiple manufacturers...I have yet to see a set where every image was perfectly centered.
GameOnChipCompany
Pair
Thanks Tommy, It is a 50 per denomination minimum with a 250 piece minimum order.
palmgaming
Sitting Out
churlbut18
Full House
Fairly new member... spending time going back through older threads like this one (which is fantastic)...
this thread starts out by comparing PGI vs. GOCC, and then adds in CPC (using Sun-Fly), Old West Poker Supplies, and ABC...
but no mention of Sidepot (buypokerchips.com)... any thoughts on them? i really like their website (although I don't think they're a sponsor here). i have samples of their stock ceramics in both the Venerati and more expensive Archetype... they have custom samples available and seem to have a good custom process... this vendor seems to have one of the better customer facing websites but doesn't seem to get a lot of exposure on this forum... just curious as to why and what the thoughts are on their custom ceramics compared to the others in this thread...
this thread starts out by comparing PGI vs. GOCC, and then adds in CPC (using Sun-Fly), Old West Poker Supplies, and ABC...
but no mention of Sidepot (buypokerchips.com)... any thoughts on them? i really like their website (although I don't think they're a sponsor here). i have samples of their stock ceramics in both the Venerati and more expensive Archetype... they have custom samples available and seem to have a good custom process... this vendor seems to have one of the better customer facing websites but doesn't seem to get a lot of exposure on this forum... just curious as to why and what the thoughts are on their custom ceramics compared to the others in this thread...
detroitdad
Royal Flush
I only have experience with Venerati from them. I love them. I'm not a huge ceramics fan. If I was to own another ceramic set it would probably be these.
Psypher1000
Straight Flush
The level of exposure a vendor receives on this site is frequently proportional to the level that vendor is engaged with this site. Sidepot hasn't paid to be a sponsor here, so they tend not to get a lot of love. No hate either, mind you...just not a lot of love lately. Also, since BCC went out they no longer have InPlays' to offer, and since GPI doesn't offer home market chips any longer they can no longer sell Noir's. That pretty much just leaves ceramics, and OWPS, GOCC, PGI, et. al. have us well taken care of on that front.
Some people love the Venerati's. I can't stand them - particularly the $1's. If you have acquired samples of them, though and enjoy them, it's probably the best value ceramic chip out there. For the price, I'd generally prefer the Scrolls over the Veneratis, but that's just personal preference.
I've received a number of custom samples from Sidepot and I generally don't care for their production quality. For customs, I greatly prefer GOCC or OWPS. PGI puts out some nice product, too.
Sidepot was definitely in the forefront of everyone's mind, but since BCC closed down and, therefore, production of Sidepot's clay chips through BCC ceased, they're less discussed.
The Veneratis suffer badly in my eyes from the same problem lots of ceramics have: glossy rolling edges. They just don't look of a piece with the rest of the chip to me. I believe Sidepot's Archetypes were produced by Chipco. I don't know anything about the production of the Veneratis. The faces felt decent, but the rolling edge takes it entirely out of contention for me personally.
Also worth mentioning in this thread that according to @manamongkids, PGI has sold the equipment it acquired from Chipco after Chipco's dissolution and therefore can no longer produce Chipco-type ceramics.
In my mind that leaves GOCC as far and away the best ceramic available and one of the best values in custom chips at .85 each for 1-1999 chips and .60 each for any order of 2000+.
Trying to talk one of my local underground games into buying a set of GOCCs, but of course they don't see the point when they can just buy 3000 chips for $400. Maybe one day after someone buys a bunch of greens and comes and cashes them in at the game they'll see things differently...
In my mind that leaves GOCC as far and away the best ceramic available and one of the best values in custom chips at .85 each for 1-1999 chips and .60 each for any order of 2000+.
Trying to talk one of my local underground games into buying a set of GOCCs, but of course they don't see the point when they can just buy 3000 chips for $400. Maybe one day after someone buys a bunch of greens and comes and cashes them in at the game they'll see things differently...
manamongkids
Full House
not sure if that includes all their equipment, could have jsut been equipment related to the Royal Yak blanks. Not 100% sure. I think Tommy had his PCF tourney chips done from PGI.
@Tommy confirm?
Yup, PGI did those.
When were those done, Tommy?
Psypher1000
Straight Flush
PGI did my Extra Life tournament chips in October of last year.
Mr Tree
Straight Flush
Everything I've seen out of GOCC is top notch. They are doing my Paymaster set when I have it put together.
The first order was good. No issues. The second order which was 3 separate orders, I had a few issues. It took a while and many emails but Joe did make it right in the end.
churlbut18
Full House
The problem I'm having with GOCC at the moment when compared to Sidepot, OWPS, brpropoker, PGI, and CPC is there website. It was mentioned earlier in this thread and it doesn't look like any improvements have been made. No pricing? No store/shopping cart? No way to initiate the process? I literally need to send an email to start?
And not to hijack this thread, but it's an hold thread anyways, I saw that @Tommy threw the Sun-Fly cards mold into the mix for discussion but there weren't any bites. I was doing some research and from purely looking at the site (no samples), the polychrom and polyclay seem very legit. What is even more interesting is that it appears CPC uses the Sun-Fly blanks for their custom process which is great (this may have been called out earlier). At .60 and .70 per, this also seems to be a fantastic value and I know CPC is thought of in very high regards on this site, particularly from they real clay perspective. Thoughts on the Sun-Fly / CPC polychrom ad polyclay (cards and diamonds molds) compared to GOCC given GOCC seems to be your front runner?
Psypher1000
Straight Flush
Keep in mind that GOCC is first and foremost a casino supplier. That's why you don't see pricing on their website, nor do you see pricing on GPI's website. Prices would be negotiated with each of their clients.
They don't maintain a consumer website or storefront.
To order, you need to email them at pcf@gameoncc.com identifying yourself as a PCF member (include your forum name) and Erica or one of their other staff members will assist you.
Yeah pretty much every website by every company you'd want to buy chips from sucks. Sidepot's is fine, but honestly I don't see a single thing on it I'd want to buy. Of those I actually patronize, CPC's is the best and you can't even order anything directly.
Anyway, it's easy enough to just email them, tell them what you want, and get a quote. I agree it's not optimal, but it's not exactly a giant pain in the ass.
Anyway, it's easy enough to just email them, tell them what you want, and get a quote. I agree it's not optimal, but it's not exactly a giant pain in the ass.
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