You are the villain with pocket twos (1 Viewer)

[DrStrange]

This time around the hand history will look at things from a villain's point of view. He has the most interesting and reasonable decisions in the hand.

Playing 1-1 live, eleven handed. (better to play with us all at the table for social reasons than split into two smaller tables). The table is exuberant. Everyone is having a good time. It is about as good a table mood as you might find.

This hand takes place shortly after other hand I posted from this session ( AK < K8 hand )

Cast of characters:

These aren't any different than our last hand but no details till later in the hand. Stacks range from $50 to $450.

SB = The Doc
BB = loose/wildcard
UTG = L/P (folded)
UTG+1 =L/P
UTG+2 =SL/AP
*** HERO *** MP1 = TAG playing $ 150
MP2 = passive rock
MP3 = Ultimate Calling Station
HJ = TAG
CO = Old man coffee
Button = LAGtard

Notes about Hero. (Keep in mind, it isn't me.) Hero is a semiserious player. Studies, practices and works on his game. Has greatly improved over the last ten years. Enough to become a winning player. Basic style is smash mouth TAG, highly fit-fold & vulnerable to big bluffs. Biggest weakness is a lack of self control when confronting adversity. Hero gets overwhelmed by his emotional state - when losing he enters a sort of "sad sack" funk where he sees monsters under the bed. He bets too big with winners, trying to drive away competition with over sized bets and becomes passive far too often. Hero is down $50 at the moment - not enough to crush his spirit.

The hand:

One fold and two limps bring us to Hero who holds . Limp, fold or raise? If raising, how much?

Hero's table image is such that a raise will be seen as a top 5% hand - say AJs+, AQo+, TT+, KQs. That doesn't mean people will fold lesser holdings, but they will take the raise seriously enough to hold off of 3-betting anything less than a premium hand.

 

[slisk250]

4 in the pot? Make it 10.

 

[detroitdad]

call

 

[Forty4]

Not sure I want to play a big pot with this hand out of position. How often does hero/villain limp? I'm probably just calling here to see what develops behind. Yes he doesn't risk getting raised behind but that's not to say he couldn't have a raise and re-raise behind him. Then he could get tricky and squeeze if it's the right situation where it would make him in position if one of the blind was the re-raise (guess that would be the BB because we know the Doc is too savvy to go crazy in the SB (y) :thumbsup. But even if there is a raise behind him he could go wild and pop it, as it might look like a monster with the limp then three bet. I think raising now will not shrink the field enough as too many player behind to call and it only takes one to make a few others come along.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

Limp jam obviously. Deuces never looses.

 

[bentax1978]

Is the hand above outside your jamming range in Omaha?



And just so I'm not 100% thread carping, I'll contribute to the OP. I'd limp with the 2's.

 

[kirchhausen]

limp. want to play this hand multi-way

 

[joker80]

limp (although I should be saying raise because you wouldn't post this thread if the flop wasn't juicy)

 

[Ben]

A blocking raise to something like $3 is a viable option here, if it is likely to stop the players behind from making a larger raise (but Hero cannot do this often, or it will be attacked mercilessly.) Otherwise, limp behind and re-evaluate if raised.

 

[courage]

I'm not limping. I complete from the SB.

 

[bentax1978]

I'm not limping. I complete from the SB.

Except Hero is in MP1

 

[courage]

Except Hero is in MP1

bollocks.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Limp. It's just 22 in a nothing-special kind of spot.

 

[stocky]

I vote for limp also. But if I'm feeling like mixing up my play I also don't mind a raise.

 

[bentax1978]

I vote for limp also. But if I'm feeling like mixing up my play I also don't mind a raise.

I like mixing up my play too, I just don't see any real advantage to getting too creative in this particular spot.

 

[DrStrange]

*** So Hero limps . . . ***

Hero limps

UTG+1 = L/P Limps
UTG+2 =SL/AP Limps
*** HERO *** MP1 = TAG playing $ 150 Limps
MP2 = passive rock FOLDS
MP3 = Ultimate Calling Station Limps
HJ = TAG FOLDS
CO = Old man coffee FOLDS
Button = LAGtard Limps

This brings us to DrStrange in the SB who raises to $3. The SB is kind of tricky with this type of raise. It has a wider range than expected, it is a pot sweeting raise. But the SB has been known to make this play with top 1% hands too waiting for over eager villains to 3-bet.

BB folds.
UTG+1 folds.
UTG+2 calls.

Action on Hero in MP1 holding Call, fold or raise? If raising, how much? If raising is that a 3-bet/fold? If raising, is Hero c-betting a dryish flop unimproved?

MP3, Ultimate Calling Station and Button, LAGtard yet to act.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

Nits (especially ones who know what they're doing) don't typically "sweeten the pot" out of position without premium hands. Either SB isn't as knowledgeable as his image implies or he has a monstah. That being said, hero should know that villains image if him is pretty damn tight as well, and the check back raise is a really strong move. Frown, sigh, and Make it $20 all day. Fold to a jam.

 

[Jimulacrum]

Call. Beautiful set-mining spot. We have a multi-way pot with position on the raiser, and the only person left to act doesn't use position effectively.

Frown, sigh, and Make it $20 all day. Fold to a jam.

I'd probably jam over your raise with a pair of Garbage Pail Kids.

An EP backraise from a nit with no limpers says, "I have aces (or maybe kings if I'm wasted) but am afraid that everyone will fold if I raise coming in," which is why it looks mega-strong.

This backraise from MP with two limpers says, "I truly wanted to limp, but now this looks like an opportunity to make a strong-looking play with a hand that doesn't have much preflop value. I'd love everyone to fold. Maybe I can scare them off and scoop the dead money with a backraise."

 

[stocky]

BB folds.
UTG+1 folds.
UTG+2 calls.

Action on Hero in MP1 holding Call, fold or raise?
Call>fold>raise IMO

If raising, how much?
If I'm raising here I'm taking an aggressive line. $15-$20

If raising is that a 3-bet/fold?
Yes, and is why I put raising behind folding

If raising, is Hero c-betting a dryish flop unimproved?
I think we are, also another reason I'm folding pre before raising.

 

[kirchhausen]

I'm probably calling & never folding here. Maybe 3-betting 5% of the time.

 

[DrStrange]

*** on to the flop ***

Hero calls the raise. So does the Ultimate Calling Station. Everyone else folds.

Four way action, $15 in the pot.

Villain reads:

SB is DrStrange playing $275. We just saw his first stomping where AK < K8. Mostly he has been tabling winners or taking down pots with bets.

UTG+2 is The Cougar playing $250. He is normally a tricky/trappy loose passive player but tonight he has an unexpected layer of aggression in his post flop game. Not that it matters because he is folding shortly

Hero sits MP1 with $150 playing

MP3 is the Ultimate Calling Station playing $450. His name is his game. Except as he gets ahead this guy will become more aggressive and more bluffy since he is playing with "other people's money". (which we all know is wrong, but some people see it that way.)

The Flop:



DrStrange bets $10. The Cougar folds. Action on Hero. Call, fold or raise? If raising, how much? What is the plan for the hand?

DrStrange

PS This hand would play out a lot differently had Hero taken an aggressive line preflop. As would most hands where we flop a set - if only I knew such things in advance.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

Flat I suppose. For all villain knows, hero has just a king, or maybe even a ten. Keep flatting until he stops betting, then either bet, or raise on the river if doesn't stop betting (barring a crazy runout like 2 broadway cards).

 

[bentax1978]

Flat I suppose. For all villain knows, hero has just a king, or maybe even a ten. Keep flatting until he stops betting, then either bet, or raise on the river if doesn't stop betting (barring a crazy runout like 2 broadway cards).

I agree, I'd flat here and wait to hit quads on the turn and then win a huge pot when it turns out Doc had KK.

Oh wait, that kind of stuff only happens when it's me against @Chippy McChiperson on pokerstars. Never mind, carry on.

 

[Chippy McChiperson]

Actually binked quad deuces earlier this year on the turn for a 2k pot, after getting it all in vs. KK and 88 on a T82 flop.

 

[moojersey]

I say re-raise Dr. Strange. Make it $30 to go. We have bottom set on a board that def hits his range! Open enders and gut shot straights are def possibilities. I want to give myself a chance to get it all in and play a big pot in this spot.

 

[moojersey]

If the evil Dr has 10,10 or KK oh well that's poker. I want to punish an open ended straight draw or gutter.

If Villain has K,10 he will not fold and we can expect to stack him most of the time.



He might just toss whatever he has and we scoop 25BB. That's fine too.

 

[Jimulacrum]

I'm with moojersey. Raise to $30.

Between a preflop raiser on the SB and a calling station upstream, someone's likely to give action, and we don't want to let it be cheap on a board with two Broadway cards.

If we're set-over-set, we're probably not getting away from it with a 150 BB stack and an SPR of not quite 10:1. Maybe if we raise, UCS reraises, and SB shoves. That's about the only time I'm folding this.

 

[moojersey]

Agree with Jim. There is some ugly hidden monsters sometimes that will outrun us on the board. But we're not laying this down mostly. Plan is to go down with the ship burning.

If there is re-raise and jam maybe consider it. But even then we could still be a favorite against 2 pair and straight draws.

 

[dickzapper]

The only way Doc has a better hand is if uncharacteristicly decided to switch to a trap-style. There is no way he raised only a dollar with TT and mostly unlikely he raised 1 with KK. His most likely holdings are Kx, KT, or straight draw. We have to assume trip 2s are best which would call for a value bet of say $16 on top.

 

[stocky]

I flat. Planning to raise turn. Our hand is disguised here. We raise now it narrows our range to TPGK or bottom set IMO.

Our perceived range excludes AK or KK and TT for lack of preflop raise. It might possibly include KT for two pair but I feel his range here would be KQ more often than KT. A raise is likely shutting Doc down

Edit to add. I don't know enough about UCS, but if I feel he'll call down all the way I could definitely advocate a raise to target his stack. But as he gets bluffy with "other people's money" I'm happy to flat still and raise turn. If he raises the flop we can then at least evaluate the Drs play before we act.