Ok thanks for the advise, I found tonight on my tourney I put more 1K chips on the table for rebuys and it made play much smoother in higher blind levels. I might just end up getting more 1K chips anyway due to this. Plus some 25k of course!
Tourney 12/12/5/6 vs 8/8/8/5 (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Squidge
- Start date
Decided to change course a bit and go down to T20k starting stack… I feel like I’m wasting money on chips I’ll never use… but ya never know.
One question I had… I was considering to do 12/12/5/11/x .. this is lot more 1k chips needed, but I feel gameplay has a positive impact. I can save money if I simply go with 5 less 1k chips and do the typical 12/12/5/6/x and make up the slack with the 5k chips.
Does anyone here do 12/12/5/11/x and do you like it? Are the extra 1k chips necessary or should I save money on less 1K?
Thanks again for all the assistance.
One question I had… I was considering to do 12/12/5/11/x .. this is lot more 1k chips needed, but I feel gameplay has a positive impact. I can save money if I simply go with 5 less 1k chips and do the typical 12/12/5/6/x and make up the slack with the 5k chips.
Does anyone here do 12/12/5/11/x and do you like it? Are the extra 1k chips necessary or should I save money on less 1K?
Thanks again for all the assistance.
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Kid_Eastwood
4 of a Kind
I used play a lot with T20,000 and starting stack as 12/12/7/10/1.
Using T1000 to color up the T25 and T100.
Using T5000 to color up the T500.
12/12/5/6/2 would work but would create more change.
Now, I switched to T30,000 with 10/6/11/3.
I use T1000 to color up the 100 and T5000 for the T500.
I would not want to have less T1000.
Don't skimp on the T1000 chips. They will become the workhorse chip for a large portion of your tournament. If you want to reduce chip count, then drop your T25 and T100 down to 8/8. These chips will soon be gone from the game entirely. Skimp there instead.
JustinInMN
4 of a Kind
Okay so if you are doing 30 players and base T25 you only need a quantity of T25/100/500/1000 to cover their starting stacks, we will consider all rebuys and color ups with T5000 Chips.
Option 1 - T10K with 8/8/4/7 stacks.
You already have enough to do 8/8/4 of T25/100/500 for everyone comfortably. The ideal setup for 30 players using 8/8/4/7 would be 250/250/125/225/50 for 900 total chips. You have a surplus of T500 and T5000 and are short about 75 T1000. 30 T5000 chips will cover your planned re-entries with 20 chips to spare, some you would use for color ups. So really 75*T1000 is all you would HAVE to order to accomplish what you need for T10K.
Option 2 - T20K with 8/8/4/7/2 stacks
Now to switch to T20K, I would think it would be okay to just add 2 T5000 chips to each starting stack, so that's 60 right there, plus you now have to consider a rebuy now takes four T5K chips instead of two. If planning for 15 re-entries, that's 60 more. So you will need to order 75*T1000 as above and 50*T5000 for a total of 125 new chips.
Option 3 - T10K with 12/12/5/6 stacks
So back to T10K but doing larger quantity stacks. To do 12/12/5/6 for 30 players the ideal quantities (in multiples of 25) would be 375/375/150/200. Your existing 75 T5000 chips would still cover your rebuy requirement. So you will need to order 125*T25, 125*T100, 50*T1000, a total of 300 new chips.
Option 4 - T20K with 12/12/5/6/2 stacks
Now to switch to 20K, again, you would be adding 2 T5000 chips to each starting stack, so that's 60 right there, and again now have to consider a rebuy now takes four T5K chips instead of 2. So you will be ordering an additional 50*T5000 chips to cover the stack expansion, plus the same additional need of 125*T25, 125*T100, 50*T1000 from the T10K option, a total of 350 new chips.
(*LATE EDIT, realized current set has 75 T5000 chips, not 50, made adjustments to options 2 and 4)
So personally, I would suggest option 2 for you if your really want to do T20K tournaments with your setup. Otherwise I think option 1 takes your set to where it needs to be for T10K tournaments just fine.
I will point out if you do option 2. You can still build 20 starting stacks of 12/12/5/11/1 at T20K if that's your usual crowd, and only use the 8/8/4/7/2 stacks when you have 3 tables planned. (You could even do 2 "spare parts" stacks of 4/4/7/1/3 with the extras.)
If you really want to get T25K for the set, you COULD swap out 25 of the T5K recommendations for T25K chips. This would put you way above your minimum need in terms of chip value, but it would ensure there would be enough T5K chips in play to make change if you do decide to put T25K in toward the end. (if you go that route, I wouldn't introduce those until removing the T500 chips, personally and when you think about it, how many events would you be doing where this would happen?)
So I hope this points out what your usage would be for options buying as few as 75 chips or as many as 375 chips. Good luck.
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I appreciate your in depth response, I was planning already exactly option 2 you laid out, plus an extra barrel of 25K chips for good measure.
Even though I’m likely never to surpass 20 players with 12/12/7/10/2 or 12/12/5/11/2 (at least right now I can’t see it happening) I will have enough in reserve for 3 tables should I need it with 8/8/4/7/2, and it would be terrible if I decided to save a few bucks and I didn’t have enough chips for some extra players.
JustinInMN
4 of a Kind
Excellent, and to address your other concern, if you had gone with option 4, you would be buying about 300 extra chips you wouldn't often use. (Not like that's a big PCF sin or anything, but I get storage is a thing and this is expense that can be saved for other future projects.) Personally, If you really want T25K chips, I would reduce the T5Ks
So you would buy 75*T1000, 50*T5000, and 25*T25000. You can also safely pack away 25*T500 and this would bring your tournament set to an even 1000 chips
. 250 * T25, 250 * T100, 125 * T500, 225 * T1000, 125 * T5000, and 25 * T25,000. You still have sufficient T5000 to cover 30 T20K stacks and 15 re-entries. (I miscounted above, will make edits.)
ChipMonster
Straight
@BGinGA do you have a schedule for a T500 tournament, no rebuys with the 300k starting stack you mentioned in an earlier thread with 10/10/7/10 for 500/1k/5k/25k using 500/1,000 starting blinds? I’m taking your advice here and building a deep stack structure for 300bb with a rack of each denomination. I won’t have 100k chips so will only use the excess 5ks for coloring up 500 & 1k.
ChipMonster
Straight
I think this works but let me know if I'm missing anything in the blinds progression
Poker Zombie
Royal Flush
I'd prefer:
Level 7 @ 6000 / 12,000
Level 8 @ 8000 / 16,000
Also, your blind structure isn't close to long enough. If each player has T300,000, that's T3,000,000 on the table. Heads up, you are looking at 2 equal players sitting with 30 big blinds each at your final level.
Level 7 @ 6000 / 12,000
Level 8 @ 8000 / 16,000
Also, your blind structure isn't close to long enough. If each player has T300,000, that's T3,000,000 on the table. Heads up, you are looking at 2 equal players sitting with 30 big blinds each at your final level.
ChipMonster
Straight
Thanks for your feedback and looking this over! I’m going to take a closer look at the increases but I do like your thought. I noticed my earlier screenshot got clipped and I revamped the table to fit side by side. I’ll also probably cut down the blind levels to 15 min.
Poker Zombie
Royal Flush
You still have 5000/10000, 7000/14000 levels. I know you said you would take a closer look at the levels, so let me lay on this extra tidbit: it's not just about increasing the blinds, it's about the chips.
With a 8000/14,000 level you are using seven of the ten T1000s that you started with to play the blinds. Defending a small blind is 8x T1000 chips. This almost assures that you will be making change, and frequently. Even more if your players are unskilled, as unskilled players limp into far more hands and raise infrequently.
With a 8000/14,000 level you are using seven of the ten T1000s that you started with to play the blinds. Defending a small blind is 8x T1000 chips. This almost assures that you will be making change, and frequently. Even more if your players are unskilled, as unskilled players limp into far more hands and raise infrequently.
Mr Winberg
Full House
This is a good point. On that topic, I've moved away from the classic
4k/8k (or 400/800, same logic)
6k/12k
8k/16k
Color off T1k (or T100)
10k/20k
...
in favour of
4k/8k (or 400/800)
Color off T1k (or 100)
5k/10k
10k/15k
10k/20k
...
The benefit is that you are earlier removing chips that at that point are only worth a small fraction on the BB (and therefore becoming a bkt of a nuisance), thereby making play faster due to less chips to count and handle.
The drawback is that some folks feel that lopsided levels are weird. But in my opinion, it's worth the weirdness to speed up the game and get more hands per level.
My 2 öre...
Poker Zombie
Royal Flush
I think your English must be failing. This sentence makes no sense.
Well, since the T1k have all been coloured up to T5k, then we're back to just a few chips per blind, no?
Poker Zombie
Royal Flush
I don't hate it, but don't really love it either. It would depend also on where other color-ups land.
I like to give players a 12 minute break every hour. This isn't that far off of WPT or WSOP averages of giving one break every two hours, with a longer dinner break thrown in. Therefore, once an hour is ideal to color-up (if necessary).
For "fewer" chips, I do use a 7,000/15,000 (or 700/1500) level in a few of my structures, but primarily with sets that were stretched a little thin (not enough T100s or T1000s)
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