Just to keep everyone in the picture, I talked to Mike Spinetti today and everything will get sorted (via me). Will keep anyone affected updated.
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Not Mine Aren't these someone's customs??? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Psypher1000
- Start date
Why would Mikko lose out? He is only an employee. He had nothing to do with the purchase either. There is a lot more to the story. Maybe in 24 hours time.
Why would Mikko lose out? He is only an employee. He had nothing to do with the purchase either. There is a lot more to the story. Maybe in 24 hours time.
Because brain farts. Don't know why I wrote Mikko instead of Mike.
Dale_Doback
Pair
Thanks David. Very much appreciated sir.
bivey
Full House
Just catching up with this. Glad it worked out for you Dale. David, thank you for doing this.
Quick summary of what happened.
Mike Spinetti bought 3 different lots of stuff from Michael and Red.
The first purchase, 4 years ago, was chip inventory that Jim had originally sold to them. This was all blanks or stock designs, like the ones you see he has listed on eBay.
The second, during ASM Vegas production, was chip cases, accessories etc., mainly also from Jim's original inventory.
The third, TWO WEEKS AFTER we bought ASM was remaining accessories and a few chips (samples, color samples, 'overruns')
He put the whole lot together in his warehouse and only recently did someone bother to start going through it.
Nothing from the first two purchases was of any concern.
The 100 chips of Mike's were the only custom chips in this last lot which were not odd ones and twos. All the odd ones and twos were damaged like rejects and were trashed.
Just in case something else showed up later I provided a list of all the custom orders (not many really) that Red fulfilled so they will keep an eye out.
Mike offered me anything I wanted/needed to take at his cost. I got Dale's chips back with a bit of other stuff I could use but declined the rest because it wouldn't be much use to me.
Anyone buying the racks of blanks/solids Mike has for sale has to beware that we could probably not match to any of them as they are either very old inventory or ASM colors which are probably wrong.
Mike Spinetti bought 3 different lots of stuff from Michael and Red.
The first purchase, 4 years ago, was chip inventory that Jim had originally sold to them. This was all blanks or stock designs, like the ones you see he has listed on eBay.
The second, during ASM Vegas production, was chip cases, accessories etc., mainly also from Jim's original inventory.
The third, TWO WEEKS AFTER we bought ASM was remaining accessories and a few chips (samples, color samples, 'overruns')
He put the whole lot together in his warehouse and only recently did someone bother to start going through it.
Nothing from the first two purchases was of any concern.
The 100 chips of Mike's were the only custom chips in this last lot which were not odd ones and twos. All the odd ones and twos were damaged like rejects and were trashed.
Just in case something else showed up later I provided a list of all the custom orders (not many really) that Red fulfilled so they will keep an eye out.
Mike offered me anything I wanted/needed to take at his cost. I got Dale's chips back with a bit of other stuff I could use but declined the rest because it wouldn't be much use to me.
Anyone buying the racks of blanks/solids Mike has for sale has to beware that we could probably not match to any of them as they are either very old inventory or ASM colors which are probably wrong.
Glad to hear everything worked out in the end and that you are being preemptive with your approach with them. I'm still hoping that none of my chips shows up anywhere especially since they would be $5 and $100 chips. I still can't believe years later that the fall out from red is still being dealt with. What a piece of work.
He is aware of yours. But who knows where he disposed of anything else. We got back property that should have come to us from 3 different places in the end not counting this.
That's my fear.
This, next to getting the customs pulled, is probably the best outcome from this. Really glad the folks at Spinettis are helping make things right (seems like a lot of that going on right now which is awesome!) and that you guys got some things back that belong to you.
On a related note thanks for everything you do for the community which involves answering emails with crazy ideas [emoji3]
Dale_Doback
Pair
Thanks again very much, David -- and appreciate the personal email follow-up. Please send my appreciation to Mike S as well.
-Mike
I just looked they arent for sale anymore
also isnt there a copyright issue here? Or is that the point.
also isnt there a copyright issue here? Or is that the point.
Ben
Full House
Pretty much. Whether or not Ott actually had the legal right to sell an individual's custom chips to Spinettis is a murky question (and if I had to bet I think it would be ruled in favor of Ott, if it somehow got before a judge) but it's certainly horrific business practice, so bad that years later a company that can only loosely be described as a successor company (CPC) feels the need to go to considerable effort to make things right (kudos to David!)
The really, truly sickening thing is that AFAIK there were only two people who actually, knowingly purchased a set of chips from that guy - MrTree and Dale Doback. He did some small add-ons and there were a few of us (myself included) who ordered chips from Michael Dambach with no knowledge of Ott's existence, and ended up getting chips from the chip demon. In that sense, the amount of damage done "per capita" is absolutely staggering. If you wrote it up as a fictional story, people would have laughed it off as being "too unrealistic."
maxim_666666
Flush
cool chips
and of course, unpleasant story.
and of course, unpleasant story.
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Dale_Doback
Pair
Home sweet home.
Thanks again @David Spragg & @Spinetti.
...and @Psypher1000 for bringing this to light.
Thanks again @David Spragg & @Spinetti.
...and @Psypher1000 for bringing this to light.
Attachments
Awesome to see a resolution to this and really, really wonderful to see such great work from David Spragg and Spinetti's to deal with a tough issue.
Here's the way I look at it...normally, I would trust the PCF/CT people I sold samples to, implicitly. And of that short list of people, not everyone comes. The risk of anyone passing a chip into play is nil. And, most people paid manufacturing cost, so you would only lose money on the $5, $20 and $100 chips. You know how many $100 chips you've given out. The $20s have never had too many in play, so the financial risk is nil. I'd be able to identify that there were too many chips redeemed.
On this general topic.... The commemorative chip at WCB was a version of my $1 chip with one side's inlay changed. They cost almost $3 each. I sold the chips for $1 instead of giving them out, and my thought was that it would be easy for people to forget or decide to play them and I didn't mind paying for the chip to be made, but I didn't want to have to pay an extra dollar to redeem the chip I paid to make and gave them. Plus the $1 paid for about 1/3 of the cost of making them.
maxim_666666
Flush
Congratulations
Hi guys, I was chip hunting on craigslist this morning and responded to this post: https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/tag/5905236899.html. The owner sent me a few pictures including these.
I quickly realized that I knew these chips and discovered that the owner is Red Ott. After some discussion I was able to negotiate a deal of $235 + $15 for the chips listed below. I was trying to get the best deal for @k9dr as I had already spoken to him immediately once I saw the Suicide Queens. He does not have a paypal and is requesting direct-deposit. I was not a chipper during the ASM Vegas days, but after reading the previous posts and this thread I am not so keen on dealing with him over the internet. I also now realize that those ASM chips may be property of @David Spragg and CPC.
Mark was wondering if any forum member currently in Vegas could pick up the chips? I believe Ott would take $125-150 for the Suicide Queens alone. I don't really want the A-mold chips....I was just using them to negotiate the suicide queens down - I was planning on re-selling them. Sorry to revive this not-so-appealing thread.
- 199 suicide queens
- 50 purple 312 w/ white spots, A-mold w/ eagle (cog inlay)
- 61 pink 312 w/ white spots, A-mold w/ eagle (sca inlay)
- 60 green 312 w/ white spots, A-mold w/ eagle (4 notch inlay)
- 50 blank grey A-molds
I quickly realized that I knew these chips and discovered that the owner is Red Ott. After some discussion I was able to negotiate a deal of $235 + $15 for the chips listed below. I was trying to get the best deal for @k9dr as I had already spoken to him immediately once I saw the Suicide Queens. He does not have a paypal and is requesting direct-deposit. I was not a chipper during the ASM Vegas days, but after reading the previous posts and this thread I am not so keen on dealing with him over the internet. I also now realize that those ASM chips may be property of @David Spragg and CPC.
Mark was wondering if any forum member currently in Vegas could pick up the chips? I believe Ott would take $125-150 for the Suicide Queens alone. I don't really want the A-mold chips....I was just using them to negotiate the suicide queens down - I was planning on re-selling them. Sorry to revive this not-so-appealing thread.
- 199 suicide queens
- 50 purple 312 w/ white spots, A-mold w/ eagle (cog inlay)
- 61 pink 312 w/ white spots, A-mold w/ eagle (sca inlay)
- 60 green 312 w/ white spots, A-mold w/ eagle (4 notch inlay)
- 50 blank grey A-molds
bivey
Full House
I think that's a smart idea. The monster is not to be trusted
They do belong to Red, but, a couple of warnings.
1. They were returned rejects
2. Even if someone in Vegas was to meet him face to face, prepare to be screwed and go armed.
Pass the message on to Mark that those were returned rejects. Don't waste your time.
bivey
Full House
Well, I was half right! Thanks David.
Burke PM'd me this morning and made me aware of these chips. He was nice enough to negotiate a deal, but I informed him that voldemott is not trustworthy. I had the idea of someone in Vegas picking them up in person, but I was not aware he is potentially violent. Although they are rejects, I would be willing to spend a few dollars just to get them off the market if it could be done safely and securely.
He is a nasty piece of work. He threatened us several times during the deal. I'd be very careful.
moose
4 of a Kind
I met Doc Ott in Vegas and bought a case from him. I don't think you have anything to worry about as long as you stick to the story of 'I like those Suicide chips. What is your best price?' and don't mention anything else.
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