Tourney How do you rule this (1 Viewer)

[Frogzilla]

Casino MTT without a betting line. A player goes all in. It folds to the big blind. He picks up his big blind and puts together a call in his hand. He then puts the rest of the call in his stack and drops his big blind back, and then announces fold.

Do you rule this as a one chip = call?

 

[harrysallout]

Objectively I guess I would let the fold stand. He didn’t add any additional chips into the “pot” but I could see this as angle to get additional info.

 

[ArielVer18]

That's normally a call, but what does the house rule say? You can be nice and give the big blind player a warning that picking up chips is an angle to gauge a reaction.



Edit to add: if the casino follows TDA, it's a call with no ambiguity. Rule 46b: If facing a raise, clearly pulling back a prior bet chip binds a player to call or raise; he or she may not put the chip(s) back out and fold.

 

[upNdown]

I’m inclined to say there’s not enough information here, and that house rules matter.

But I’m trying to think of a situation where picking up your blind could be ruled as anything other than a raise or a call. I’m having a hard time imagining one. But I can’t remember ever seeing that.

 

[bergs]

Casino MTT without a betting line. A player goes all in. It folds to the big blind. He picks up his big blind and puts together a call in his hand. He then puts the rest of the call in his stack and drops his big blind back, and then announces fold.

Do you rule this as a one chip = call?

Did he put the blind chip in his stack behind the line, or did he move his chips out over the line and scoop up the blind chip? Former is a fold, later is floor dependent but will often be judged a call.

 

[chippitydoodah]

100% angling unless he's just very inexperienced, was going to call (only reason to be pulling back his blind) and changed his mind.

 

[springbox]

According to TDA, it's a call.

 

[Machine]

According to TDA, it's a call.

View attachment 1376627

Get this man a mic drop emoji!

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

Casino MTT without a betting line. A player goes all in. It folds to the big blind. He picks up his big blind and puts together a call in his hand. He then puts the rest of the call in his stack and drops his big blind back, and then announces fold.

Do you rule this as a one chip = call?

yes, ruled as a call for our game. Announcing after dropping the blind is so bad lol. I play with beginners so hopefully id catch them picking up the blind and ask if they were calling, but as described that would be a call for us.

 

[upNdown]

Casino MTT without a betting line. A player goes all in. It folds to the big blind. He picks up his big blind and puts together a call in his hand. He then puts the rest of the call in his stack and drops his big blind back, and then announces fold.

Do you rule this as a one chip = call?

Did you witness this? What was the ruling?

 

[Frogzilla]

Did you witness this? What was the ruling?

Yes the floor ruled it a “I’m pretty sure it’s a call” which I was a little surprised and I think I’d have gotten wrong

Didn’t realize the TDA was so clear

And also sounds from that ruling like he was binding as soon as he picked his blind chip up…that’s a ruling that frankly I’d be shocked to see. If he picked up his blind and then announced fold without replacing the blind, that’s a tough ruling to make a call but looks like it’s consistent with the rule wording

 

[Danhr]

If he dropped the chip and said fold at the same time, I’d say it’s a fold. If there was a pause, I’d say it’s a call.

 

[upNdown]

If he picked up his blind and then announced fold without replacing the blind, that’s a tough ruling to make a call but looks like it’s consistent with the rule wording

It makes sense though. When you already have chips out there, the only reason you would touch them is to either toss them in, or pull them back to make a raise or a call.

 

[Kentucky]

I learned rule 46b tonight too Seems pretty clear cut.

Are y’all saying it’s an angle because BB can somehow read the raiser’s face to see if he wants a call? Big Blind was last to act in this configuration, right? So It’s not like he can angle a third player into pre-folding by looking like he’s going to rejam or whatever, which seems like the main opportunity for abuse…

Not really the point, just a random thought.

 

[glynn]

It makes sense though. When you already have chips out there, the only reason you would touch them is to either toss them in, or pull them back to make a raise or a call.

A common angle before Rule 46 was for the angler to claim he decided he wanted change from a larger chip lol. As with many rules, this one was created to protect us from those scumbags. It is good, the TDA are good.

 

[JustinInMN]

But I’m trying to think of a situation where picking up your blind could be ruled as anything other than a raise or a call. I’m having a hard time imagining one. But I can’t remember ever seeing that.

Yeah, unless you want to construe a reason to apply a "gross misunderstanding of the action" exception, I agree there is no such situation where picking up your blind and folding is acceptable. And based on the original description of the circumstances, there is no way the BB misunderstood the action, he was shooting an angle.

Rule 46 clearly applies as @ArielVer18 and @springbox have already pointed out.