Spot on.First congratulations, you have a beautiful family.
I have cognitive dissidence on this thread, I can see how it appears to be begging, and personally I think the community should hamper it. I think there is a lot of bullshit in society and I'll not make it political, but life is hard, pity is killing us - simply put 'The needs of the many out weight the needs of the few'
For those that would be outspoken that this is begging, I would ask that with the newly given information you reconsider your position, let me explain.
I would not ask you to donate, but I would ask that you refrain from discouraging VMR from seeking help.
I would wager that none of you have ever had to deal with the U.S. gov in the same way that VMR and his family have.
If you don't know when you come into the country the correct way, you're not allowed to work for at least a year, then you have to request that your ability to work is updated every few years, and normally that takes a few months up to 3 normally. With the current administration it has been pushed out even further. If you're caught working you may be deported, but even if not you'll likely never be given citizenship.
Most organizations if they do afford sponsorship, they treat employees like shit, and only sponsor them for as long as they work for them.
The smallest things like traffic infractions can cause you to be denied approval for citizenship, and the burden can be heavy, waiting for years can also add to that.
I don't want to get too personal or ask VMR, but typically if you're getting a green card by marriage, the gov asked stupid shit of you and invades your privacy to degrees that most of us born in the US would say 'go fukc you're self' to. They expect you to have photos of family events with extended family and share them with the gov, they interrogate you separately from your spouse and give you third degree constantly. I understand the due diligence here but again most Americans would be pissed about the way they invade your personal life.
This should belay any concerns of the op having a double standard.
Proud of our ancestors, proud to be an American, proud to be a member of this community, and grateful to be lucky enough to win a birth right of citizenship.
This is the thread to post:
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Our family needs your help. (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter VMR911
- Start date
- Status
Yeah. That's not me....
OP
OP
Man, you touched on so many things we went through, I appreciate you sharing your insight and thoughts. Even now "Our case decision" was supposed to be done "2 months ago" from January but we're still waiting and we cannot even submit an inquiry or "outside processing time" until the end of June.
As someone who made the conscious decision to move to America, and start a family here, I share your admiration. I'm proud to have married a natural born citizen of America and I'm so happy to have both of my daughters born here. The world seems to be falling apart and I believe America will be at the forefront of another great revolution.
Thank you again for your message.
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jpietrella
4 of a Kind
Cool, see ya.
I generally don't weigh in on this kind of stuff, but I tend to agree in spirit with Max here. We've given tens (hundreds?) of thousands over the years to various causes: medical costs, job loss, charities, vehicle accidents, funeral costs, kids mauled by dogs, etc.
- Is questionable planning around income stability/risk, especially with a new family member, a reason to ask for money on a poker chip site? Maybe
- Is it a less noble cause than others that have popped over the years? Maybe
- Should expensive clay discs be sold first to cover other expenses? Maybe
@VMR911 - wishing you and your family the best.
I already know, but the only way you get an update to your status is this website, how often do you check it?
Daily, he checks it daily for months on end, and this is just the approval
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NotRealNameNoSir
4 of a Kind
Majority of this forum has won the lottery being born with the opportunities and privileges we've had, BUT I'm not unblocking the politics forum so I'll stop that thought there lol.
This keeps bringing me back to highschool: wrestling team was canning (collecting money in front of Shoprite/intersections) for Relay For Life, an event associated with the American Cancer Society. Many of us know cancer isn't fair, it's fucking horrible and expensive. These canning mornings are usually just excuses to wake up early and collect some money for a good cause, we didn't take it too seriously because all we cared about were girls and making weight.
A small older man walked by us and just stared at the sign for a bit, then went inside. No big deal, most people don't donate and that's okay. On the way out, he let loose on us, he'd clearly been stewing whiling he shopped. Berated us about how dare we collect money because he beat cancer without help, he didn't need handouts, he did it, why the hell shouldn't others? Why should he have to suffer through it alone and not them? And he tries to shove me after reaching that lil crescendo, the man was going through something. None of us were in any danger, there was 8+ of us and the man was over 60, the whole thing was just incredibly sad. We grab him after the lunge, let him go, and he just heads to his truck. Only time I was really spooked was after he backed out of his parking space, realized the unhinged man was now operating a few tons of steel, but he headed out.
Completely messed us up and I still think about it sometimes. A lot of people suffer, then feel others should because they did. I try not to project my experience on others and I know this'll be met with a sarcastic comment, but that's life. Best of luck, having a kid is scary and expensive especially in the United States, glad everyone's healthy.
This keeps bringing me back to highschool: wrestling team was canning (collecting money in front of Shoprite/intersections) for Relay For Life, an event associated with the American Cancer Society. Many of us know cancer isn't fair, it's fucking horrible and expensive. These canning mornings are usually just excuses to wake up early and collect some money for a good cause, we didn't take it too seriously because all we cared about were girls and making weight.
A small older man walked by us and just stared at the sign for a bit, then went inside. No big deal, most people don't donate and that's okay. On the way out, he let loose on us, he'd clearly been stewing whiling he shopped. Berated us about how dare we collect money because he beat cancer without help, he didn't need handouts, he did it, why the hell shouldn't others? Why should he have to suffer through it alone and not them? And he tries to shove me after reaching that lil crescendo, the man was going through something. None of us were in any danger, there was 8+ of us and the man was over 60, the whole thing was just incredibly sad. We grab him after the lunge, let him go, and he just heads to his truck. Only time I was really spooked was after he backed out of his parking space, realized the unhinged man was now operating a few tons of steel, but he headed out.
Completely messed us up and I still think about it sometimes. A lot of people suffer, then feel others should because they did. I try not to project my experience on others and I know this'll be met with a sarcastic comment, but that's life. Best of luck, having a kid is scary and expensive especially in the United States, glad everyone's healthy.
GreekRedEye
Flush
First, congratulations on the baby!
I do not know your particulars, but I can empathize. An unexpected medical condition bankrupted my family as a child. We would have been out on the street had we not had family nearby to take us in. My father soldiered through what would have broken many men. As a child I learned from his example: a father does what he needs to, to support his family, including asking his community for help. I also saw people with half the integrity of my father and twice as much good luck heap judgment upon him.
I was also laid off unexpectedly for 6 months while we were expecting our first child. The shame (even though I did nothing wrong) was intense. Despite my best efforts to find work (hundreds of applications) and extreme cost cutting we saw our savings dwindle and our debts rise. Panic would catch me unexpectedly, rising up from my chest to my throat. We got through it and I am grateful for those who understood and showed compassion.
You are doing the right thing, asking for help when you need it. You are a good father, doing what you can. You will come through this. And I am sure you will pay forward whatever help you get now, when you are able.
I am sorry some members of this community have chosen to judge. Maybe they have been blessed to never experience the precarity that you are experiencing.
To everyone who has responded to this thread with judgment or mockery: knock it off.
When someone in your community asks for help, you either help or you express sympathy if you cannot help. At the very least, you can say nothing. If you want to troll, there are plenty of other threads. I have posted plenty of dumb stuff worth mocking, so go ahead and start there.
I do not know your particulars, but I can empathize. An unexpected medical condition bankrupted my family as a child. We would have been out on the street had we not had family nearby to take us in. My father soldiered through what would have broken many men. As a child I learned from his example: a father does what he needs to, to support his family, including asking his community for help. I also saw people with half the integrity of my father and twice as much good luck heap judgment upon him.
I was also laid off unexpectedly for 6 months while we were expecting our first child. The shame (even though I did nothing wrong) was intense. Despite my best efforts to find work (hundreds of applications) and extreme cost cutting we saw our savings dwindle and our debts rise. Panic would catch me unexpectedly, rising up from my chest to my throat. We got through it and I am grateful for those who understood and showed compassion.
You are doing the right thing, asking for help when you need it. You are a good father, doing what you can. You will come through this. And I am sure you will pay forward whatever help you get now, when you are able.
I am sorry some members of this community have chosen to judge. Maybe they have been blessed to never experience the precarity that you are experiencing.
To everyone who has responded to this thread with judgment or mockery: knock it off.
When someone in your community asks for help, you either help or you express sympathy if you cannot help. At the very least, you can say nothing. If you want to troll, there are plenty of other threads. I have posted plenty of dumb stuff worth mocking, so go ahead and start there.
This is his MO to a T. I’ve watched him do it not only here, but elsewhere as well. He goes over to the CB after never posting there, and then starts lecturing the old crew on what they should or shouldn’t post. Fully in line with what we see from a certain segment. Scream “tolerance” at someone…until their viewpoint is different than ours. Then, we silence them. Despicable.
Or, maybe they have experienced it and went about things a completely different way. So, I guess we don’t tolerate their perspective.
Are you reading what you’re writing? Where is this coming from from you? I have watched you shout down people that have done almost the same thing, but now it’s “intolerance” and some kind of superiority complex if one doesn’t agree? Are you serious?
iLogik
Flush
“Berated us about how dare we collect money because he beat cancer without help, he didn't need handouts, he did it, why the hell shouldn't others? Why should he have to suffer through it alone and not them?”
What the f*ck PCF...happy to see some brothers having the decency to have some understanding and compassion.
But also
Can someone not understand how hard it is to post what OP posted ?
Particularly within a community with plenty of people with a lot of disposable income and success.
We have seen our fair share of donation thread and many times PCF showed their good side.
And now we at random slay someone for opening up being in a tough spot ?
F*ck that...we have all been in a difficult spot one time or another and if not...consider yourself very lucky...
Stop the judgemental stuff and refrain from posting if you don't have anything nice to post.
Congrats on the addition to your family @VMR911
But also
Can someone not understand how hard it is to post what OP posted ?
Particularly within a community with plenty of people with a lot of disposable income and success.
We have seen our fair share of donation thread and many times PCF showed their good side.
And now we at random slay someone for opening up being in a tough spot ?
F*ck that...we have all been in a difficult spot one time or another and if not...consider yourself very lucky...
Stop the judgemental stuff and refrain from posting if you don't have anything nice to post.
Congrats on the addition to your family @VMR911
I love you, Thomas, but what is wrong with some questioning? It seems more and more prevalent for people to stick their hand out on this forum. It could just as easily be said to just blindly throw as much money as possible at those be…asking for money. Give, give, give, and ignore those of “haters” and just let us scream at clouds.What the f*ck PCF...happy to see some brothers having the decency to have some understanding and compassion.
But also
Can someone not understand how hard it is to post what OP posted ?
Particularly within a community with plenty of people with a lot of disposable income and success.
We have seen our fair share of donation thread and many times PCF showed their good side.
And now we at random slay someone for opening up being in a tough spot ?
F*ck that...we have all been in a difficult spot one time or another and if not...consider yourself very lucky...
Stop the judgemental stuff and refrain from posting if you don't have anything nice to post.
Congrats on the addition to your family @VMR911
NotRealNameNoSir
4 of a Kind
Anyone ever seen 12 Angry Men?
I don't think this is the case....
And while I don't have any issues with constructive questions (even without donating) some posts are just a kick in the nuts or jump the bandwagon
I have seen and witnessed some shamefull stuff regarding corporate companies and/or government administration that broke the back of honnest and wellwilling individuals and small companies more then once.
This is one of those cases imho...
It's not like he has been kicking it and expecting us to cover...it's a genuine example how people get in trouble due to external factors
And there's the rub...for the type of person who would post the OP, it's not hard at all.
The relative affluence of the community is irrelevant.
The majority (if not all) of the other donation threads are based on things that were out of the persons control - a dog attack, cancer, car accident, etc.
This is not that.
This is a classic "oh look, it's the consequences of my actions".
OP chose to leave a country with "free" health care.
OP chose to move to country that won't let him work.
OP chose to have a child.
Could he have foreseen the consequences? Likely yes, given enough thought and planning. He chose to roll the dice and crapped out.
And yes, we have all been in a difficult spot...likely much more difficult than OP. How many came to PCF to beg? Not many.
And finally - f*uck you, don't tell me what I can and can't post. We need more people calling out the bulllshit on here - whether it's overpriced chips, misleading posts on chip condition, or the validity of people walking around with their hand out.
Yes Sir...you are the real voice of PCF
Good on you
I tried it on the postive side with you and tried to understand.
My conclusion now is that
iLogik
Flush
@monkeydog I’m sorry for what your going through, hope you find peace, god, or what ever will help u <3
It’s weird to me that you quoted his last paragraph to go along with your diatribe. I’m not here to shame OP (even if I disagree with his approach.) But along the lines of this being a community, yeah I 100% agree with the idea that we can and should call each other out on perceived bullshit. We don’t need to be nasty and we don’t need to pile on, but we definitely don’t need to suppress the questioning or the dissenting opinions.
Politics aside (hard to do for me as well, believe me), part of what this comes down to is your conception of what it means to live in a society. Some people literally don't feel like they need to help those around them, that it really is everyone for themselves and pull yourself up by your bootstraps and that anyone who needs help or asks for support is "begging" or "asking for a handout" and is really just "crap out of luck."
To me this is not a healthy way of looking at things. I would rather see myself as part of something larger than just myself or my family. If I am an active member of some kind of community (PCF in this case), and someone needs help, my first instinct is think (1) Am I in a position to help this person since they seem to be in need?, then if not (which is often the case), I ask (2) If I can't materially help, can I offer some support in some other way since they seem to be in a tough spot? ... I just don't know where we have gotten to when our first instinct is to scold those who ask for help. I understand explaining that sometimes a particular forum is not the best venue for certain things, but as others have pointed out, there have been many times folks have asked for help (and have been helped in incredible ways on here!), so this does not seem off-limits to me.
I know when people use the word "hand out" and "lazy" (get up off your ass!) what that is code for. We are all adults, we know what you are saying. But before you reach for the negative. Before you assume that everyone wants a free lunch but you, try to embody something that rises above this. That rises above blaming people for their own misfortune or kicking those that are down. I promise you, you will feel much better when you do. This kind of negativity will eat you from the inside out, so for purely selfish reasons I would suggest you consider a path that is more kind.
To those who think that I or others am "suppressing dissenting opinions" - I think this is a real reach. This thread started out with almost 100% negative comments, so that is what I was responding to. The seemingly endless pile on. I'm glad since then others have agreed with this perspective and have voiced there support for others. It's good to see.
To me this is not a healthy way of looking at things. I would rather see myself as part of something larger than just myself or my family. If I am an active member of some kind of community (PCF in this case), and someone needs help, my first instinct is think (1) Am I in a position to help this person since they seem to be in need?, then if not (which is often the case), I ask (2) If I can't materially help, can I offer some support in some other way since they seem to be in a tough spot? ... I just don't know where we have gotten to when our first instinct is to scold those who ask for help. I understand explaining that sometimes a particular forum is not the best venue for certain things, but as others have pointed out, there have been many times folks have asked for help (and have been helped in incredible ways on here!), so this does not seem off-limits to me.
I know when people use the word "hand out" and "lazy" (get up off your ass!) what that is code for. We are all adults, we know what you are saying. But before you reach for the negative. Before you assume that everyone wants a free lunch but you, try to embody something that rises above this. That rises above blaming people for their own misfortune or kicking those that are down. I promise you, you will feel much better when you do. This kind of negativity will eat you from the inside out, so for purely selfish reasons I would suggest you consider a path that is more kind.
To those who think that I or others am "suppressing dissenting opinions" - I think this is a real reach. This thread started out with almost 100% negative comments, so that is what I was responding to. The seemingly endless pile on. I'm glad since then others have agreed with this perspective and have voiced there support for others. It's good to see.
NotRealNameNoSir
4 of a Kind
Can we really characterize the below as questioning or simply dissenting? I agree with you, I'm fine with questioning or calling out, but this is vitriolic and not needed. We have not spent time in OP's shoes, and anyone with this much momentum about a call for help is not trying to protect a community from bullshit, they're projecting some serious issues.
I’ve found that almost everyone that has ever told others to ‘pull themselves up by their bootstraps’
are people that have been handed almost everything to them through luck of birth , nepotism, and social circumstance.
Or, they are the first in line to take advantage of government programs designed to help the less fortunate.
Ahhh yes. ‘Go out and get a job’
How loud that sound carries when yelled from an ivory tower.
For the OP. Congrats on your new family member. I hope things turn around for you financially.
Do I think this is this best way to raise funds? Probably not, but as others have said. It’s never easy to ask for help.
are people that have been handed almost everything to them through luck of birth , nepotism, and social circumstance.
Or, they are the first in line to take advantage of government programs designed to help the less fortunate.
Ahhh yes. ‘Go out and get a job’
How loud that sound carries when yelled from an ivory tower.
For the OP. Congrats on your new family member. I hope things turn around for you financially.
Do I think this is this best way to raise funds? Probably not, but as others have said. It’s never easy to ask for help.
Well said, thank you.
Actually this thread started out with crickets - no response for 27 hours. Then yeah, as soon as somebody broke the ice, there was some piling on - probably indicative of what the community thought. Then there were some comments that were more sympathetic - also indicative of what the community thinks. That’s kind of perfect - all the different perspectives in our little society are coming out. I think it’s nice that you’re being nice. Seriously. I’d hesitate to say “I don’t think this is the right approach” without some nice people saying nice things to soften the blow. Just like 12 angry men, we all have different perspectives. I think that’s good?
ekricket
Royal Flush
Sometimes tough love is what’s needed.
Telling a baby to “deal with it” just doesn’t seem like one of those times.
Telling a baby to “deal with it” just doesn’t seem like one of those times.
NotRealNameNoSir
4 of a Kind
Yes, but the movie's point was that many of those perspectives were used as weapons against an innocent man by creating false narratives: they were colored by previous experiences, using their own lives and biases to fill in holes in the situation they knew nothing about, they just expected it to be that way.
To the racist: the defendant must've been rageful, lazy, and prone to violence.
To the regretful father: the defendant must have been immature and nasty to his loved ones.
To the elitist: the man must not have worked very hard and he simply could not fathom thinking or acting like him and being innocent.
To the flippant sports fan: he probably wouldn't have posted in this thread lol, he'd roll his eyes.
The movie is one of my favorites, and its incredibly applicable. Those perspectives can all be heard, absolutely, but when we start discussing "people like OP" and "these types of people", that is at best colored by past experiences and grudges that have nothing to do with OP. When they walked into that room, the defendant's face morphed into whatever they needed it to be.
doctorchips
Pair
It's pretty funny how you extend the freedom to post whatever you want and however much emotional energy you want to spend telling someone exactly how they f*cked up.
Does the freedom to say and post what you want not also extend to OP or is that freedom exclusive to your complaints and criticisms here?
Maybe take an introspective look at “how” you say things, and how they come off.
You are absolutely welcome to your views, to share them, and act on them accordingly. I support that and would fight for your right to do so.
The second you start telling others how to think or act, and they are shameful based on your personal moral compass. You cross the proverbial line.
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