split spots on Diamond Square mold from CPC? (2 Viewers)

[detroitdad]

All I know is. If I wasn't given any warning of this potential problem and my order that could cost thousands of dollars came in all fucked up I would be pissed. By all fucked up I mean anything more than 10% (which I still think is too fucking high). I've ordered two full sets, and multiple add ons. This thread has me second guessing if I should place a 3rd full set order. I don't have 3k of play money to light on fire. Just saying

 

[beaver]

I love my CPC chips, but it is kind of insane to think about the amount of money they cost. Then we have to pay in full up front with not even a decent estimate of when we may receive the chips. Then after waiting for close to a year sometimes, they may show up with all these split spots.

 

[warma]

Fascinating. Looks like ~13 of 40 barrels. Trimoon, Lcrown

When I have a split, it’s almost always just one spot.

On DG Peacock only spot color was DG Tiger
On the DG Yellow, all but 3 were Black (Retro Green & Retro Lavender were the other colors).
On the Maroon, it was majority Bright White (DG Pink and DG Green the other colors).
On the white, it was just Butterscotch (Light Blue, Retro Blue the other).

I remember unboxing them and, upon seeing a “split” spot, thinking- oh, interesting... that’s how they make the spots. Never once bothered me. When I set them up like this- eh. So I’ll shuffle them up now.

Yes, I rather prefer the solid spot. But my next order will still be Trimoon.

EDIT: I got curious again... the Black, White, and Butterscotch spots are all the bottom spot. Maybe it’s the mechanics of the press?

 

[RichMahogany]

Wow. Looks like this thread saved me $3.5k.

Sorry for all those with so many split spots

 

[detroitdad]

Wow. Looks like this thread saved me $3.5k.

Sorry for all those with so many split spots

I'm thinking the same thing. Mine was only in the 2700 range

 

[krafticus]

Call me crazy, but they don’t bother me. Gives them that handmade vibe.

 

[Jasap47]

I have scrown order in, one of the chips is tri moon but with all weighted colors. Hope that minimizes this issue, i have another set already with 600 tri moons, never noticed but now imma go look lol. Could it be simply be human error? With the amount of orders in and lack of man power due to covid restrictions, perhaps pressure is on to pump chips out and mistakes are happening. Im a newbie here but i think i speak for everyone with current or future orders, most would rather wait a little longer than get inferior product. ty

 

[detroitdad]

Call me crazy, but they don’t bother me. Gives them that handmade vibe.

Awesome that it would work for you. If I'm paying for a specific product. I don't want to be surprised with what I get. Especially at these prices.

 

[krafticus]

Awesome that it would work for you. If I'm paying for a specific product. I don't want to be surprised with what I get. Especially at these prices.

You should specify that now on your next order

 

[Perthmike]

Personally I'm ok with some split spots and weird shaped spots. It does add character.

But for myself there's a limit to where I'd be ok with it.

I've ordered over 2000 chips with CPC across 4 orders and I am extremely happy with them.

 

[detroitdad]

You should specify that now on your next order

I shouldn't have to specify that I don't want any fucked up chips when I order. I should get what I'm paying for (which isn't cheap). I mean, if I want to order split spot, fucked up chips, then great. If I'm ordering a specific edge spot. Then that is what I should be getting. Not surprise, 25% of the chips that we made for you are different than what we list on the site?

 

[JMC9389]

Personally I'm ok with some split spots and weird shaped spots. It does add character.

But for myself there's a limit to where I'd be ok with it.

I've ordered over 2000 chips with CPC across 4 orders and I am extremely happy with them.

More or less sums up how I feel. A few gives the set character and a certain panache, but a significant portion of spots being split would annoy me a bit.

 

[detroitdad]

Personally I'm ok with some split spots and weird shaped spots. It does add character.

But for myself there's a limit to where I'd be ok with it.

I've ordered over 2000 chips with CPC across 4 orders and I am extremely happy with them.

I'm extremely happy with my chips. I ordered 1200 FDL mold "solid" chips and 600 ish quarter pie chips. I couldn't be happier. However, I have been contemplating a hot stamped set with an edge spot progression. I don't think I can do that with the possibility of getting 10 to 40% of my chips fucked up.

 

[monkeydog]

In the ASM days, the ones with the white circles were considered a defect. The ones in the red circle would have been acceptable.

IMHO - these are two different types of spots. Split spot and spike spot. Split spot (white circle) is when the base colour goes all the way through the spot and should be considered a defect. In my eyes it’s like when I try to wear my daisy dukes, the extra...materialhas to go somewhere and it ain’t usually flattering. I remember that one of the first sets on the hour glass mold was yellow with black spots. The member ended up colouring the spots in with Sharpie, but I believe they were still remade.

The spiked spot (red circle) is awesome and part of the beauty of a hand made product.

 

[mike32]

I'm extremely happy with my chips. I ordered 1200 FDL mold "solid" chips and 600 ish quarter pie chips. I couldn't be happier. However, I have been contemplating a hot stamped set with an edge spot progression. I don't think I can do that with the possibility of getting 10 to 40% of my chips fucked up.

I think that new Wild Turkey Rare Breed makes you a little ornery.

 

[warma]

It’s funny, when I was designing ceramics, the edge spot design intentionally had that spiked look to it.

I noticed the split spots, but never really thought about it until this thread. Can’t say if I ever would have picked up on to a point where I would consciously think about it.

I can see all points, and posted my chips so people could be aware and make decisions accordingly. It was roughly 11% of all spots- a lot better than the apparent 40%.

Too much? That’s for the customer to decide.

I remember earlier comments on the difficulty of producing the trimoon- curious if this is related.

I’m really fascinated on why it was almost exclusively the black on the DG Yellow (only weighted color?). And why it was just butterscotch on the white. So curious. The mechanics of chip production have always peaked my interest- I’d love to watch these chips being made.

I’m still working on my next order of trimoon large crowns.

 

[detroitdad]

I think that new Wild Turkey Rare Breed makes you a little ornery.

lol...........Come on Mike. Are you telling me you would be happy paying 2k or more and getting a random looking, error filled set? I simply would want what I'm paying for.

 

[Meddler2]

Could it be simply be human error?

I've always thought this was a bigger factor than acknowledged.

 

[Meddler2]

In the ASM days, the ones with the white circles were considered a defect. The ones in the red circle would have been acceptable.

IMHO - these are two different types of spots. Split spot and spike spot. Split spot (white circle) is when the base colour goes all the way through the spot and should be considered a defect. In my eyes it’s like when I try to wear my daisy dukes, the extra...materialhas to go somewhere and it ain’t usually flattering. I remember that one of the first sets on the hour glass mold was yellow with black spots. The member ended up colouring the spots in with Sharpie, but I believe they were still remade.

The spiked spot (red circle) is awesome and part of the beauty of a hand made product.

View attachment 629336

Deleted.

 

[liftapint]

Fascinating. Looks like ~13 of 40 barrels. Trimoon, Lcrown

When I have a split, it’s almost always just one spot.

On DG Peacock only spot color was DG Tiger
On the DG Yellow, all but 3 were Black (Retro Green & Retro Lavender were the other colors).
On the Maroon, it was majority Bright White (DG Pink and DG Green the other colors).
On the white, it was just Butterscotch (Light Blue, Retro Blue the other).

I remember unboxing them and, upon seeing a “split” spot, thinking- oh, interesting... that’s how they make the spots. Never once bothered me. When I set them up like this- eh. So I’ll shuffle them up now.

Yes, I rather prefer the solid spot. But my next order will still be Trimoon.
View attachment 629296

Take no offense, but this makes me want to cancel my HUGE order. This level of split spots is unacceptable to me.

edit: In the end, I will hope that CPC looks into this, and will take good care of me with my order. I have no indication that this won't be the case.

 

[cpac54]

Fascinating. Looks like ~13 of 40 barrels. Trimoon, Lcrown

When I have a split, it’s almost always just one spot.

On DG Peacock only spot color was DG Tiger
On the DG Yellow, all but 3 were Black (Retro Green & Retro Lavender were the other colors).
On the Maroon, it was majority Bright White (DG Pink and DG Green the other colors).
On the white, it was just Butterscotch (Light Blue, Retro Blue the other).

I remember unboxing them and, upon seeing a “split” spot, thinking- oh, interesting... that’s how they make the spots. Never once bothered me. When I set them up like this- eh. So I’ll shuffle them up now.

Yes, I rather prefer the solid spot. But my next order will still be Trimoon.
View attachment 629296

That's a hell of a lot of defective chips, the way I see it. More than two full racks of completely split spots out of 10 racks is just unacceptable imo.

 

[mike32]

lol...........Come on Mike. Are you telling me you would be happy paying 2k or more and getting a random looking, error filled set? I simply would want what I'm paying for.

I suspect part of the problem here is our tastes. We want brighter colors and CPC has worked to comply. I’ve never seen better pinks, oranges, blues and even yellows from them until recently, stunning chips really. And the tri moon spot because we wanted it. All the while they are using the same equipment that may not be ideal for all of our new requests. It may not be realistic to want it all and no split spots, unless customers are willing to pay for a possible 40% error rate, if these are even considered errors.

 

[slisk250]

I’ll check my last Rosie’s order, I did notice some splits.

 

[warma]

Take no offense, but this makes me want to cancel my HUGE order. This level of split spots is unacceptable to me.

No offense taken here.

 

[jja412]

This makes me VERY nervous, with one very large and 2 small CPC orders on the way. I *hate* split spots (you should have seen my battles with HoldemPoker about the Mardi Gras chips, back in the day).

Dibs!

 

[Pinball]

This shouldn't happen with CPC's, quality and prices have to match with each other.

Glad my sets are Matusi's

 

[timinater]

Most of the examples here are on tri-moon. I always thought they looked a bit shallower than TRK or Paulson tri-moons. I wonder if there is something to that having a greater likelihood of split spots? I wonder if they were deeper into the base colour that would help?

• is there less material and it's perhaps more susceptible to splitting/squeezing?
• Are they truly "split" or is it flash that has squeezed out and around that isn't fully ground off during finishing? Is it even possible to grind that much off?
  • @Rhodeman77 If you've got some replacements coming how do you feel about doing some science to test that out? Could file down the spot and see how deep into the spot does the split go?

As the only vendor making custom clay chips for the retail market, I think we should be careful what we wish for. We're a highly demanding and exacting bunch who put a lot of thought into these little clay discs. If they can't hit our expectations with colours/spots/molds I do see those combos potentially getting dropped, or going up significantly in price if the production methods can't hit the level of exactness we're after. If the error rate in production is high, that's expensive, re-doing just about anything in any production business is very expensive, and guess who those costs get passed down to?

 

[warma]

Science!

 

[madforpancakes]

That's a hell of a lot of defective chips, the way I see it. More than two full racks of completely split spots out of 10 racks is just unacceptable imo.

I don't know, I looked pretty closely at that picture and it seems like a lot of those are just squeezed spots. Squeezes shouldn't be included with splits, because that makes the problem look worse than it is.

None of these are split, and there's plenty more in this same pic that also aren't split.

 

[monkeydog]

As the only vendor making custom clay chips for the retail market, I think we should be careful what we wish for. We're a highly demanding and exacting bunch who put a lot of thought into these little clay discs. If they can't hit our expectations with colours/spots/molds I do see those combos potentially getting dropped, or going up significantly in price if the production methods can't hit the level of exactness we're after. If the error rate in production is high, that's expensive, re-doing just about anything in any production business is very expensive, and guess who those costs get passed down to?

I think the heart of the issue goes back to what @detroitdad was saying. There is bound to be some angry customers if there is no warning or clarity on a potential issue.

I don't think any chip manufacturer is without a "defect" of some type every now and then, but it sure would be good to have an indication of what the chance of the issue is so that the customer can make the decision on if they want to take the risk.

I haven't ordered from CPC, and likely won't due to all the minor issues that I see in their sets - same thing kept me from ordering from BCC when they were around, I am just too fussy to spend thousands of dollars and not be close to totally satisfied. This is not a shot at CPC, just an understanding that my expectations are potentially unrealistic.

I do have a couple thousand chips from ASM and there are definitely some issues with some of them - I have two racks of $0.50 chips that are a full chip higher in a barrel than any other colour. Do I use them? No, because it drives me nuts. Would any of the players in my game notice? Nope. By that definition, they sure are not a defect, but to my standards they are. If I was told that the chip had a 50% chance of being thicker, I wouldn't have ordered them.

Height variance has always been an issue and I remember a discussion with Jim B where it was said to mix all the chips together and they would average out to similar heights - that works within a colour, but doesn't within a set.

At the end of the day, I would just want to go into the deal with the manufacturer knowing what my expectations are and if their product is in line with them. Not saying my expectations are what the manufacturer has to meet, but a clear understanding of what I expect vs what they can make is key to a successful deal.

HPC had a disclaimer on their site in regards to the regular manufacturing issues with BCC - pics of all the potential issues and what was considered a defect, and what was considered acceptable. It was likely a result of people trying to return chips they weren't happy with but were totally fine in the eyes of BCC. End result of the pics was that you knew what you were buying and went in as a fully informed customer.