Oscar you went above and beyond in your retort. I don’t think there is anything anyone can do to make them see our view on building sets and putting them into play. Some context for those unfamiliar with the current exchange.
Oscar-
100 x $.50 (HS $2.50 Gear relabel)
200 x $1 (Casablanca $2 Gear relabel)
200 x $5
100 x $25
20 x $100
Not my idea again and I'm not trying to promote it if that's what you think I'm trying to do. I'm just trying to highlight what cool chips are out there in the world. If what I'm doing is making your collection worth less, then that's the total opposite of what I'm trying to do. I want to show the world and our hobby what great chips are out there. If it comes down to the point where I need to start pointing out fake and real chips in every video then I'll do that. If that's needed... I don't think it is, but seems like it. Again, I'm not trying to promote making fake chips. Take a look at these sets any you'll see that 70-80% of the chips are the real thing. They relabeled or overlabeled chips are there to make the set more fun, stand out and be more bright. They want to use edge spots and have "edge spot progressions" in these sets. Sure they could use a solid $1 like the Aruba Palm Beach had, but why not make the set more flashy with something that has edge spots. I'll leave it at that
Kaplan responds
By:Charles Kaplan, LM-115-148 <Show E-Mail>
Date: 4/4/23 5:44 am
In Response To: From my understanding... (Oscar Lappalainen)
I can tell which are definitely the FAKES because they don't look like any of the real casino issued chips. But, someone who isn't an avid Caribbean collector may not. And I am not perfect, I have been fooled by FAKES. And when I see these old casino chips from the 1980's, that should have a lot of table wear and yet look new, I have to suspect that they also might be FAKES. The problem is uncertainty, it is not easy to tell what is real or FAKE. The uncertainty is absolutely horrible for chip collectors, they will avoid anything that they are uncertain about. You see, all that set collectors care about is appearance. Chip collectors care more about history, they want to know that a chip was casino issued and was used on the tables. I doubt that there is anyway to stop set collectors from making FAKES, I think the only thing that chip collectors can do is to document all the FAKES so that we can remove as much uncertainty as possible.
Oscar, I understand that you and the rest of the set collectors are not trying to have a negative effect on chip collectors by making and selling FAKES, but that is exactly what is happening.
Oscar Responds
I don't get it at all...
By:Oscar Lappalainen <
Show E-Mail>
Date: 4/4/23 8:53 am
Not sure what I've done wrong or what I am continuously doing wrong that I have to have people constantly after me for making videos or posting about our hobby online. I'm literally just trying to have fun, promote our hobby and build my chip collection at the same time, but it seems like if I do something even slightly wrong or don't point something out then I'm the bad guy for making videos and doing what I've done. I remember it wasn't even 2 weeks into making videos and I was already getting emails talking about how I should do my videos and what needs to be in them. I made them the exact way that I would a college paper or something similar. I'm not someone who is going to go online, rip information off websites and then literally copy and paste that. If I'm going to use information, I'll use it, then make sure that credit is given in the description of the video. In every single video that I use any type of ChipGuide pictures, there is a ChipGuide link in the description. This is what I was told from the beginning, "
The problem with having the links in the description is that you can view the video without seeing the description. Also, you just have a link without an explanation. There should be an explanation that images in the video are from the ChipGuide along with the link. The link by itself is not good enough. The mention of where you got the images has to be in the video itself." Makes no sense to me because if you really wanted to look for more information you could either ask for it in the comments or open the description to find out that there are links there for you to look at. As much as people out there would love to just get handed information, that's not how the world works.
I work hard to find information and do research for these videos. Sometimes I can't find information so I try my best piecing together information found from multiple sources. I just don't get how having a link in the description isn't "good enough". I'm not the only one doing this online, I might be one of the only ones for our hobby. I know of a few other people that make videos about chips, but not as regularly as I do. I also get that there are tons of people on this board and online that have information about going to these older casinos and have the back stories that aren't online. So, if there is a mistake in one of my videos instead of saying "that was wrong" or "that's not true that never happened" maybe you could mention it in a different way that doesn't sound like you're trying to put me down.
I've gone up and down with emotions on this board when I think it should all be positive. It's a worldwide known forum board. TheChipBoard.com, says it right in the url. This is a board for casino chip talk, getting to learn about new information and more. PokerChipForum is the same way to me. There are TONS of people on there with information and a large number of them know about TheChipBoard and a large number of ChipBoard people know about PCF. I've seen more and more of you getting on there recently and it's great! You can follow me on there if you want, you can find the thread of where I have all my videos or you can do whatever you want. It's an online forum and I'm not going to police you around to make sure you're doing the right thing.
I don't have an issue with anyone in the hobby, don't have an issue with anyone online, but I do think that there needs to be respect across the board.
There's another thing that I don't get either. At the Casinorama show recently, Jay Sands asked if I could try to unite or bring together the "singles" collectors and "set" collectors. That's what I've been trying to do for so long now, but it seems like anytime I bring PCF into the question things aren't right. I understand that there have been a number of hoards found over the last two years especially. Sands TRKs, Diamond Jim's, Black Gold, Horseshoe Binion's, El Rancho Vegas and more just to name a few. (PCF isn't the reason for these hoards to come up either. They've popped up on
eBay and other sources as seen from the videos I make). Did you think it was going to never happen? I always know that there is going to be more chips coming out. It can't be something that's held under sheets forever. Think about it, there's a barrel of Zanzibar $5s on
eBay right now... A chip that would sell for at least $100 by itself. Now, there's 20 of them! Let's see what happens to the price of that chip after this. I saw someone comment about Diamond Jim's chips that other day about how the singles collectors aren't happy that the hoard was found. I wouldn't be either and I know there are people online that would make fun or jokes about those that bought chips before the hoard was found. I understand the feeling, but there isn't any reason to get negative against someone that you might not even know. It's a hobby for crying out loud! Have fun and do what you want!
Regarding murdering or relabeling of chips... I'm not promoting it like I mentioned in my last post on here. I know of people that regularly do it and buy starburst solid Paulsons just to mill them out and make their own custom labels to fit those chips into a set they are building. They aren't the only one that have done this though. I've seen fake or commemorative chips on
eBay that you can easily tell they aren't the real thing. I had a buddy of mine buy a Hacienda $5
TRK off
eBay thinking it was the real thing and I had to explain that it was a Kings Crown $500 or $1000 whatever it was now. He wasn't too happy either, but was happy that the chip didn't cost a fortune.
Not sure how the mention of Spinettis came into question either because Spinettis has nothing to do with the videos that I make. I went a LONG time without anyone knowing that I worked there, pretty impressive by me if you ask. I can tell you that Spinettis doesn't sell fake chips and never will. If you think that's going to happen, that's the last thing that will. If there are chips listed on the site that are relabeled or something along those lines they will clearly be described both in the title of the item and the description. If you think that I got the wrong teaching or am being taught wrong by those on PCF then you're wrong. I was lucky enough to be under Mike's wing before he passed away and I'll never forget getting to talk chips with him when I first got into the hobby. I went from knowing 0 to knowing quite a bit. Hence the reason why I've continued to strive forward trying to push the hobby and more. Pretty sure if Mike was still with us he'd be insanely proud of me. I just don't understand why or how Spinettis had to be mentioned in this way, "
But, I find it disappointing that an employee of Spinetti's, a company that sells real casino chips and has been a great friend of the hobby, is promoting these Fakes. As a Caribbean chip collector I find these Fakes to be offensive, they cheapen my collection and make it less likely that others will collect them knowing that there are fakes out there." Sure I work there, but never once did I mention in the video that I was promoting fake chips. I understand that Caribbean chips are near and dear to your heart so maybe I'll just stay away from them for now and possibly never talk about them again. I think they have some of the most beautiful inlays, color designs and more. It makes no sense to me at all...
I guess the thing I'm trying to get after is what am I doing wrong or what needs to be changed so I don't have to get policed around. It almost feels like I need to be on my toes whenever I make a video or do something in between. This is also one reason why I haven't made as many videos as I did maybe a year ago. I've been much busier with school this semester along with other things in life. It gets to a point where I'm thinking about a video idea and have to really think about if it's the right thing to do right now. Aruba chips were something that I hadn't seen ever talked about much in a video format and I just got to se some really nice ones at work so why not make the video when I have all those fresh emotions in my head. I could keep making videos about TRKs, but it gets repetitive, not something I want to do. I want to keep things fresh, new and fun! It sounds like what so many people in the hobby want.
Who knows who'll actually read this all the way to the end, but if you do, thanks. If you have an idea or any opinion reply and we'll see what is said. It's getting pretty tiring to see the same people coming after me on here, when on another forum I only get positive feedback for everything I do. Constantly get messages about the cool videos I make and what great information is inside of them.
While I'm at it, does anyone know my videos are on ChipGuide.com? They're in the archives section of casinos that I've made videos for. How many people know about the archives and actively use them? I remember when I was doing research I found out about it because I was randomly clicking buttons and stumbled on them. There's some GREAT information by people that aren't with us anymore. Handwritten notes, personal stories, interviews and more that 95% of people have no idea exists. Just an FYI. If I'm going to get policed around constantly and ChipGuide gets to use my videos for free, then why not take them down if you don't think they're beneficial.
I'm going to go and enjoy my day, hope you guys can too.
