What is the Allure of Leaded Chips?? (4 Viewers)

[bergs]

Even if one big buyer did accumulate a ton of chips, he only got single sets. It’s not like he has 80,000 Outposts in a closet somewhere. Or 120,000 PCAs. People are hanging onto these and not posting them for sale, not even for ridonkulous prices.

 

[RocAFella1]

Even if one big buyer did accumulate a ton of chips, he only got single sets. It’s not like he has 80,000 Outposts in a closet somewhere. Or 120,000 PCAs. People are hanging onto these and not posting them for sale, not even for ridonkulous prices.

 

[TX_Golf_N_Poker]

As far as "the allure" of Leaded chips go this topic makes me laugh. I'm not saying the difference between Leaded & not Leaded is like Dice Chips to Paulson but I am saying some people don't see/hear the difference. Similar to people who don't hear & feel the difference between Leaded & not leaded.

Not sure who you think these people are who can't tell the difference. You? Or non chippers? As someone who spent my first two years here collecting inexpensive china clay and cards mold chips, once I decided to take the plunge into real compressed clay, the difference in feel was pretty obvious. I've always been pretty budget minded, so my first clay chips were non leaded RHC, then a few THC. Trying to assemble a mixed THC set, I ended up with some that were leaded, and others that were not. I absolutely did not like the differences. I'm now selling almost all my non leaded THC chips. And I'm definitely still a n00b chipper.

 

[upNdown]

Not sure who you think these people are who can't tell the difference. You? Or non chippers? As someone who spent my first two years here collecting inexpensive china clay and cards mold chips, once I decided to take the plunge into real compressed clay, the difference in feel was pretty obvious. I've always been pretty budget minded, so my first clay chips were non leaded RHC, then a few THC. Trying to assemble a mixed THC set, I ended up with some that were leaded, and others that were not. I absolutely did not like the differences. I'm now selling almost all my non leaded THC chips. And I'm definitely still a n00b chipper.

Maybe he’s only handled those barely leaded chips from the early 2000s - the ones with like 7% lead (instead or 40%.)
They get sold around here as LEADED, and then you handle them and you can’t figure out if they’re leaded or not.
Personally, if somebody has to tell me that chips are leaded for me to be sure, I’m damn sure not paying a premium for them.

 

[ssanel54]

Not sure who you think these people are who can't tell the difference. You? Or non chippers? As someone who spent my first two years here collecting inexpensive china clay and cards mold chips, once I decided to take the plunge into real compressed clay, the difference in feel was pretty obvious. I've always been pretty budget minded, so my first clay chips were non leaded RHC, then a few THC. Trying to assemble a mixed THC set, I ended up with some that were leaded, and others that were not. I absolutely did not like the differences. I'm now selling almost all my non leaded THC chips. And I'm definitely still a n00b chipper.

I think I put myself in that category. I can definitely feel big differences in weight, but I have experienced that with both leaded and non leaded chips.

Last night I started going through my collection of house molds. I know for certain that some of them are leaded, and I know for certain that some of them are not, and then there are a bunch that I have no clue. They all feel pretty similar to me. It’s easy to look at the chips I like the best, and then convince myself that they feel and sound superior than the rest, but when you take the visual out of the equation it’s much harder. When it’s same mold, same color, different era… I’d say impossible for me. Maybe as the start to wear down I’ll get the softness, but I may not live that long

 

[ssanel54]

Even if one big buyer did accumulate a ton of chips, he only got single sets. It’s not like he has 80,000 Outposts in a closet somewhere. Or 120,000 PCAs. People are hanging onto these and not posting them for sale, not even for ridonkulous prices.

I do think for a long time everyone was shitting on RHC and large inlays which maybe drove a few of these sets underground. People may have got sick of hearing how inferior those chips are to THC.

PCA only sell in back rooms behind closed doors, but yeah where are all those Outposts, and Aztars?

 

[MatB]

maybe with so many more people collecting now, sets that got moved around a lot from buyer to buyer are finding forever homes.

SDM tourney chips for instance. Huge find. makes its way to PCF, multiple sales, resales, and more resales.
I haven't seen a decent sized set of them for sale in a while. I know im not selling mine ever.

Playable older sets from the 80s, 90s, are subject to this too. Leaded or not.

 

[upNdown]

maybe with so many more people collecting now, sets that got moved around a lot from buyer to buyer are finding forever homes.

SDM tourney chips for instance. Huge find. makes its way to PCF, multiple sales, resales, and more resales.
I haven't seen a decent sized set of them for sale in a while. I know im not selling mine ever.

Playable older sets from the 80s, 90s, are subject to this too. Leaded or not.

I think that’s right. I have to think that for every guy with a big vault, there must be a bunch of guys like me who are good with one or two nice sets. And yeah, as more people join the hobby and get their one premium set, those sets stay put.

 

[Jeevansluck]

I think that’s right. I have to think that for everybody with a bug vault, there must be a bunch of guys like me who are good with one or two nice sets. And yeah, as more people join the hobby and get their one premium set, those sets stay put.

+1

I’m also still a relative noob mileage wise, but I managed to snag some sharp minty leaded THCs and some sharp TRKs. They aren’t even clean sets, all are mixed but still, I’d never sell them. They are like you say, my one and only.

 

[TheRealTeddyKGB]

Not sure who you think these people are who can't tell the difference. You? Or non chippers? As someone who spent my first two years here collecting inexpensive china clay and cards mold chips, once I decided to take the plunge into real compressed clay, the difference in feel was pretty obvious. I've always been pretty budget minded, so my first clay chips were non leaded RHC, then a few THC. Trying to assemble a mixed THC set, I ended up with some that were leaded, and others that were not. I absolutely did not like the differences. I'm now selling almost all my non leaded THC chips. And I'm definitely still a n00b chipper.

maybe with so many more people collecting now, sets that got moved around a lot from buyer to buyer are finding forever homes.

SDM tourney chips for instance. Huge find. makes its way to PCF, multiple sales, resales, and more resales.
I haven't seen a decent sized set of them for sale in a while. I know im not selling mine ever.

Playable older sets from the 80s, 90s, are subject to this too. Leaded or not.

No, I was actually replying to some other post where the guy was implying as if lead was just the new hot word & actually not a thing. I am what you probably consider a noob too because I've only been HERE a short time. Nevermind the last 25 years when I wasn't here but still playing with chips. I noticed on second one the differences. Some people notice, some people don't. Some people care some people don't.

 

[ssanel54]

maybe with so many more people collecting now, sets that got moved around a lot from buyer to buyer are finding forever homes.

SDM tourney chips for instance. Huge find. makes its way to PCF, multiple sales, resales, and more resales.
I haven't seen a decent sized set of them for sale in a while. I know im not selling mine ever.

Playable older sets from the 80s, 90s, are subject to this too. Leaded or not.

Do you really think the number of collectors has increased that drastically? PCF members has increased, but that just could be the digital age we are in. eBay used to be an abundant source for new sets and collectors, but that seems to have completely disappeared. People do certainly cycle in and out of the hobby

 

[Thomacetti]

Sure, some did. But like I said, things were drying up before that guy got here.

Very true....most veterans were amazed by what he was able to shake loose.

In most case by offering way above market but he had more then one way to obtain sets there were considered 'lost'
But way before Krish joined, looking for PCA $5 (sec) was already difficult & expensive.

And if availability was the sole driving factor, leaded RHC would be king since there a WAY WAY less of those then THC leaded.
There was only a few years between introduction of RHC mold and the end of the leaded clay era.

 

[Thomacetti]

Do you really think the number of collectors has increased that drastically?

Wow Scott, al least 10-fold since CT times (and i'm talking active members that own more then 1 (clay) set

 

[ssanel54]

Wow Scott, al least 10-fold since CT times (and i'm talking active members that own more then 1 (clay) set

Again, I have no data. And I have no idea the breakdown of active people on this site, how many buy/sell chips, vs here for other discussions or poker in general.

I can name at least 10 sets that I bought off of eBay, from people who were not members on CT or PCF. Were they collectors? I don’t know, but it was during the poker boom. Now pretty much all selling activity is here.

 

[Thomacetti]

I can name at least 10 sets that I bought off of eBay, from people who were not members on CT or PCF. Were they collectors? I don’t know, but it was during the poker boom. Now pretty much all selling activity is here.

Chipping became serious business during your hiatus...
The chance of you binking a nice set on eBay is slim to none due to multiple web crawlers that scan numerous site for chips 24/7.

Those chips will eventually end up in the classifieds (at marked up prices obv.)

 

[ssanel54]

Chipping became serious business during your hiatus...
The chance of you binking a nice set on eBay is slim to none due to multiple web crawlers that scan numerous site for chips 24/7.

Those chips will eventually end up in the classifieds (at marked up prices obv.)

Yeah, I don’t disagree with that. I guess I would rephrase things to say

Back in the day I feel there was still a very large interest in high end clay, and Paulson in particular, however people also had many retail outlets where they could purchase those chips whenever they wanted. The Chip Forum community and classifieds was much smaller, but there was constant buying and selling happening on eBay.

Now that Paulson doesn’t sell to the home market, most activity has shifted to PCF. The community is much larger, but that could also be a product of the digital age and smart phones. eBay has dried up and most of the selling now happens here. Did the numbers of people interested in high end chips increase exponentially or just move to a more concentrated pool? IDK the answer.

 

[Thomacetti]

Did the numbers of people interested in high end chips increase exponentially or just move to a more concentrated pool? IDK the answer.

The first...back during CT times (and even in the early years of PCF) sets with a value of +$2000 (and there were not many) ofen changed hands via raffles.
Nowadays (and espec. during peak pring times) these sets have multiple buyers and/or are snatched up in minutes.

It's the +10K sets that now would fall into the same category as 2K sets 10 years ago
Boat chips changed it all

 

[MeridianFC]

Increase in PCF vs CT membership is certainly a factor but the biggest thing by far has to be no Paulson, BCC, TRK, ChipCo, etc. for the home market. There was always some amount of ex/unopened casino going on but you could still get decent chip sets for your home game in many different ways. Now most of those ways are gone.

in the many years I was away the whole thing turned on it’s ear.

As an aside way back in the day, I thought most of the best looking chipsets weren’t the casino ones. A lot of the individual designers for things oriented at the Home market had a lot more freedom than things that needed to be designed with cost and security driving everything.

 

[ssanel54]

The first...back during CT times (and even in the early years of PCF) sets with a value of +$2000 (and there were not many) ofen changed hands via raffles.
Nowadays (and espec. during peak pring times) these sets have multiple buyers and/or are snatched up in minutes.

It's the +10K sets that now would fall into the same category as 2K sets 10 years ago
Boat chips changed it all

Lol….I had totally blocked out those raffle years

 

[TX_Golf_N_Poker]

More people are condition snobs ahead of lead snobs.

This makes me very happy. Because I love leaded chips, and unlike many here, I actually use my chips to play poker with. And because nicely broken in chips are less desirable to many, I was able to purchase my dream of a fully playable set of leaded THC chips for just a touch over $2 a chip.

 

[ssanel54]

Alright, I just saw the classified listing for WTHC listing, and I’m not trolling, but are those leaded? That’s one of the classic home sets that checked all the boxes with the shaped inlays etc. I have no idea what formula they were using when they were available for purchase?

 

[FDLmold]

Alright, I just saw the classified listing for WTHC listing, and I’m not trolling, but are those leaded? That’s one of the classic home sets that checked all the boxes with the shaped inlays etc. I have no idea what formula they were using when they were available for purchase?

If leaded, it's a minimal amount. They are not fully leaded.

 

[doublebooyah85]

Alright, I just saw the classified listing for WTHC listing, and I’m not trolling, but are those leaded? That’s one of the classic home sets that checked all the boxes with the shaped inlays etc. I have no idea what formula they were using when they were available for purchase?

Guessing no. But they are a nice chip…I don’t think that mold was leaded…

 

[ssanel54]

If leaded, it's a minimal amount. They are not fully leaded.

This is exactly what I do not understand. What does fully leaded mean? Obviously it’s not a metal chip. What is the percentage of lead that we categorize as leaded? Or is it binary and all leaded chips will still have weight variance?

 

[upNdown]

This is exactly what I do not understand. What does fully leaded mean? Obviously it’s not a metal chip. What is the percentage of lead that we categorize as leaded? Or is it binary and all leaded chips will still have weight variance?

This guy @PhillyB says this. I have no reason to doubt him:

 

[ssanel54]

This guy @PhillyB says this. I have no reason to doubt him:
View attachment 1106168

If that’s true, 60% sounds like a lot of lead

 

[upNdown]

If that’s true, 60% sounds like a lot of lead

I’ve heard the 40ish percent number floated around for years. Recently phillyB has been spitting facts that I’ve been trying to chase down but could never find or confirm. He seems to know what he’s talking about - shrug

 

[FDLmold]

If that’s true, 60% sounds like a lot of lead

If it's by weight, not really. Lead has a huge density compared to other chip ingredients like dry vinyl, barium sulfate, and colorants. If lead has five times the density of the other ingredients, which can't be too far off, then by volume, a 60% lead by weight chip is 25-35% lead by volume.

 

[ssanel54]

If it's by weight, not really. Lead has a huge density compared to other chip ingredients like dry vinyl, barium sulfate, and colorants. If lead has five times the density of the other ingredients, which can't be too far off, then by volume, a 60% lead by weight chip is 25-35% lead by volume.

That makes more sense

 

[PhillyB]

Lead silicate, lead oxide and lead carbonate is used in these chips, mainly silicate.

Health authorities in Arizona and California have already tested lots of chips and some chips at 50% and above lead and I have tested chips from different eras of Paulson as I work in ballistics and can test for lead and how much lead dust is exposed from gun fire, I also knew someone at Paulson long ago and that’s what I was told and everything lines up. I also mentioned you can get yourself a 3m lead test kit since most of you can not test ppm, so take high grit sand paper and rub chip on it and test it, it turns dark red fast it means lots of lead, it turns red with pace then obv lesser, if it turns pinkish or red very slow it’s even lower levels, if it’s still gel color(amber) then it’s nothing or less than 600ppm. you won’t get ppm but you get the idea and goes as low as 600ppm.

start of Paulson - 1998 chips were 60-40% with most being 45% and that range is give and take meaning some colors could be 35%/38%/61% etc
1998-2007 they were 10-6% give or take with some colors still being 60-40%

2007-2011 they were .5-.005/”0.003”%

2011- present they are 0%

Chips were made with sand, their proprietary clay and composite. When they used metal flecks 1987-2004/2005 these were gold dust, Tantalum, Tin and Tungsten flakes.