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$500 NLHE Hand from Today (3 Viewers)

SO... after Villain’s donk bet of $16, Hero makes it $50 to go, and Villain snap calls (usually very indicative of a draw or weak hand online). There is now $142.50 in the pot, and effective stacks are $470.

The turn comes the:5d:. Bingo! Hero turns the nuts! Villain checks this time. Action is on Hero.

What’s our move?

A quick note about our raise. As @DrStrange pointed out, our SPR was high, giving us some room to move around, and this was my exact thought about putting in the raise.

Sorry for not posting sooner, but I wanted to make sure that everyone that wanted to post got the chance! :tup:
 
Last edited:
chipsncoffee said:
SO... after Villain’s donk bet of $16, Hero makes it $50 to go, and Villain snap calls (super indicative of a draw or weak hand online generally). There is now $142.50 in the pot, and effective stacks are $470.

The turn comes the:5d:. Bingo! Hero turns the nuts! Villain checks this time. Action is on Hero.

What’s our move?

A quick note about our raise. As @DrStrange pointed out, our SPR was high, giving us some room to move around, and this was my exact thought about putting in the raise.

Sorry for not posting sooner, but I wanted to make sure that everyone that wanted to post got the chance! :tup:
Click to expand...
We all know what happens next. :)
 
Beakertwang said:
We all know what happens next. :)
Click to expand...

5B13362E-412A-4738-BC00-ECC4A4CE8438.jpeg
 
chipsncoffee said:
SO... after Villain’s donk bet of $16, Hero makes it $50 to go, and Villain snap calls (usually very indicative of a draw or weak hand online). There is now $142.50 in the pot, and effective stacks are $470.

The turn comes the:5d:. Bingo! Hero turns the nuts! Villain checks this time. Action is on Hero.

What’s our move?
Click to expand...

HERO does not hold the nuts, as there are now 2 SF possibilities, both of which are in Villain's range as described.

HERO needs to bet of course... despite the modest threat of the SF possibility HERO can extract value from all other flushes, the straight that got there and of course all the two-pairs Villain may have turned. I'm betting $100 here, and depending on how Villain reacts and what the river card is, probably proceeding with caution on the river.

A common line for players OOP holding the uncounterfeitable nuts on the turn is to check/call and then lead any river. If Villain takes this line, I'm probably calling but not raising.
 
Given the potential range and supposed craziness of the villain, I don't see how you can bet the turn.

If he has a flush, he's paying you off on the river regardless. If he has two pair and rivers a full house, gg. Obviously we can come up with a few scenarios where he calls the turn, but IMO the best way to exploit a true maniac is to check back, try to get him to lead the river, and *ideally* get him to a point where he's pot committed and has to call you on the river...

Again, I'm going at this as to how I'd hate to be played against. I'd expect players who make the flush to bet out at me. If they check back the turn, I then think they were proceeding with caution hoping to see a blank on the turn...

It's also worth noting that I'm incredibly swingy...I like playing big pot poker and trying to stack people. My style is definitely exploitable, but it also makes people uncomfortable when they know they will most likely have to put their stack in the middle I'd they're against me...I'm just trying to reverse engineer how I hate to be played against.

Also, one more thing worth noting...

I'm not a winning player...I'm just there for the food, drink, company, and most importantly, the massages ;p
 
Villain checks the turn ............... One of 3 scenarios here, and all three tell me to do the exact same thing.

1. Villain has straight flush. He checks the nuts. Check back at him.
2. Villain has a decent hand, but fears the third diamond. A bet here might tell the villain you have the flush - check back to him.
3. Villain has two high cards and completely missed the flop. He did the usual continuation bet on the flop, got raised and called (people do this a whole lot more than they are willing to admit to). Checked turn because he still completely missed. Any bet here tells him you have something and he runs - check it back to him.

I know I may be in the minority here, but I see no reason to bet anything at all here. Either he has the straight flush and you are beaten, or he has nothing that concerns you, and an extra card might motivate him to bet the river. Check the turn all the way. Also, I might be missing something here, but this hand smells like villain has pocket 8's or 9's.
 
Moxie Mike said:
HERO does not hold the nuts, as there are now 2 SF possibilities, both of which are in Villain's range as described.

HERO needs to bet of course... despite the modest threat of the SF possibility HERO can extract value from all other flushes, the straight that got there and of course all the two-pairs Villain may have turned. I'm betting $100 here, and depending on how Villain reacts and what the river card is, probably proceeding with caution on the river.

A common line for players OOP holding the uncounterfeitable nuts on the turn is to check/call and then lead any river. If Villain takes this line, I'm probably calling but not raising.
Click to expand...

You’re absolutely right. I typed that too quickly, but of course we don’t have the nuts here. There are definite possibilities for a straight flush, so thank you for correcting me on that! :tup:
 
But... will it be straight flush over straight flush when the 3d comes? I agree with betting the turn.
 
Does Hero want a shot at villain's stack? The best way is to bet. There are ways to trap villain on the river, but I think hero gets paid more by betting vs trapping.

A river that pairs the board is going to quench the action. Villain might hold a single diamond plus a pair and think he should pay a turn bet. Or, villain might not hold a diamond and snap fold to a river bet if a fourth diamond comes. Hero is going to be hard pressed to get $470 in the pot with river action looking at less than $150 in the pot on the turn.

I think smash mouth poker is better than tricky-trappy here. Bet $125 and reevaluate on the river. Thinking of how much to bet not to fold or check behind but the sizing of a river value bet depends on how things finish out on the river. Normally my default would be ~60% pot but Hero needs to be a bit heavy here to set up a river jam.

While I note the possibility of a straight flush, the stacks are way too shallow to be fearing that monster under the bed. This is roughly 100bb, I stack off without concern to this villain if he holds the straight flush vs Hero's ace high flush.

DrStrange

PS be mindful this is $500 ON-LINE poker. A world dominated by the big boys playing for a living. This isn't a casino game populated by drunk tourists.
 
DrStrange said:
Does Hero want a shot at villain's stack? The best way is to bet. There are ways to trap villain on the river, but I think hero gets paid more by betting vs trapping.

A river that pairs the board is going to quench the action. Villain might hold a single diamond plus a pair and think he should pay a turn bet. Or, villain might not hold a diamond and snap fold to a river bet if a fourth diamond comes. Hero is going to be hard pressed to get $470 in the pot with river action looking at less than $150 in the pot on the turn.

I think smash mouth poker is better than tricky-trappy here. Bet $125 and reevaluate on the river. Thinking of how much to bet not to fold or check behind but the sizing of a river value bet depends on how things finish out on the river. Normally my default would be ~60% pot but Hero needs to be a bit heavy here to set up a river jam.

While I note the possibility of a straight flush, the stacks are way too shallow to be fearing that monster under the bed. This is roughly 100bb, I stack off without concern to this villain if he holds the straight flush vs Hero's ace high flush.

DrStrange

PS be mindful this is $500 ON-LINE poker. A world dominated by the big boys playing for a living. This isn't a casino game populated by drunk tourists.
Click to expand...

Oh, Hero DEFINITELY wants a shot at Villain’s stack here. I’m in no way worried about the straight flush possibilities. If it happens, the only thing I’m worried about is that Villain will slow down once I rebuy.

Also, thinking of myself as one of the “big boys” gave me a rush of blood to my ego. :ROFL: :ROFLMAO:
 
DrStrange said:
While I note the possibility of a straight flush, the stacks are way too shallow to be fearing that monster under the bed. This is roughly 100bb, I stack off without concern to this villain if he holds the straight flush vs Hero's ace high flush.
Click to expand...
Right? If I'm on day 5 of the main event, I'll worry about the straight flush. But with one buyin in front of me in a cash game, and a nut flush, you can beat me with a straight flush 7 days a week.
 
DrStrange said:
PS be mindful this is $500 ON-LINE poker. A world dominated by the big boys playing for a living. This isn't a casino game populated by drunk tourists.
Click to expand...

In terms of relativity to live poker, do you think that $500NL is tougher or easier online? I honestly haven’t played much in a casino setting, but I’ve played some super juicy $1/$2 home games where you could buy in for up to $1k and straddle from any position for any amount. :nailbite:

Those were some fun/super high variance games.
 
At the same stakes online will always be tougher to beat than live. Online has HUDs that track betting frequencies to tenths or hundreths of a single percentage point. Those who can disseminate that information the quickest and most efficiently will reap the rewards.
 
$500 on-line should be vastly harder than any regularly spread casino game. Not so much speaking from experience these days - my on-line life died long ago along with most of my $20,000 bankroll lost when Netteller and then the poker sites were closed to US citizens. Also, my bankroll was greatly enhanced by being a bonus whore. I turned $100 into $20,000 sure, but most of it was on bonuses.

*** fond memories waft before my eyes, remembering the good old days *** Party poker paid $100 bonus for depositing $500 and then playing enough raked hands. On a good weekend you could find five valid codes. And knock out a $100 in less time than it took to watch a baseball game. On the best months, that was $2,000 in bonuses if you did the work, just from one poker site. If I hadn't been a lazy $#%*, I likely could have been making $5,000 - $10,000 per month on the bonuses alone. *** Sigh, the good old days indeed! ***

Perhaps things are crazy again with the coronavirus and legions of bored people with stimulus checks. Perhaps not.

But $2/$5 played on multiple tables is a serous income for a winning player. A couple of BB per hour X eight tables is something like $100/hr. That is $200,000 / year for a 40 hr / week full time guy. Plenty enough income to round up the sharks. AND keep in mind $200,000 / year in US dollars is a massive income in less developed countries. So yes, those waters are surely shark infested.
 
I like a raise on the flop. Villains donk-bet into Hero of that sizing generally indicates a small pair or some draw that he wants to control the price on. Raising with position may take it down, or at least get us checked to on the turn so we can decide to see a free river or not.

On the turn, if this villain is the type to check-raise then I'd probably bet small, like $60, just begging for the checkraise. If they're more of a station then I like a larger bet north of $100.
 
Okay! Time for some turn action! This is where things get real fun... and potentially ridiculous.

I had seen Villain potting and over-betting bluffs, so I decided, “I’m going to take this fight to him”. Pot is $142, and I want it all, so I bet $260.

NOW... before we go any further, I do know that I’m risking missing value here for sure, but I was really trying to level Villain into a shove or a hero call. I wanted it to look like a bully move. I’m certainly aware that I’ve now backed myself into a corner should something terrible happen on the river.

Villain SNAP calls. Pot is $662 and effective stack is only $215.

Your thoughts?
 
Anthony Martino said:
I like a raise on the flop. Villains donk-bet into Hero of that sizing generally indicates a small pair or some draw that he wants to control the price on. Raising with position may take it down, or at least get us checked to on the turn so we can decide to see a free river or not.

On the turn, if this villain is the type to check-raise then I'd probably bet small, like $60, just begging for the checkraise. If they're more of a station then I like a larger bet north of $100.
Click to expand...

How’s an over bet of $260 on turn sound? :ROFL: :ROFLMAO:
 
chipsncoffee said:
Okay! Time for some turn action! This is where things get real fun... and potentially ridiculous.

I had seen Villain potting and over-betting bluffs, so I decided, “I’m going to take this fight to him”. Pot is $142, and I want it all, so I bet $260.

NOW... before we go any further, I do know that I’m risking missing value here for sure, but I was really trying to level Villain into a shove or a hero call. I wanted it to look like a bully move. I’m certainly aware that I’ve now backed myself into a corner should something terrible happen on the river.

Villain SNAP calls. Pot is $662 and effective stack is only $215.

Your thoughts?
Click to expand...
“Hey dealer how bout that river”
 
chipsncoffee said:
Okay! Time for some turn action! This is where things get real fun... and potentially ridiculous.

I had seen Villain potting and over-betting bluffs, so I decided, “I’m going to take this fight to him”. Pot is $142, and I want it all, so I bet $260.

NOW... before we go any further, I do know that I’m risking missing value here for sure, but I was really trying to level Villain into a shove or a hero call. I wanted it to look like a bully move. I’m certainly aware that I’ve now backed myself into a corner should something terrible happen on the river.

Villain SNAP calls. Pot is $662 and effective stack is only $215.

Your thoughts?
Click to expand...

I mean, you can never fold the river here regardless of what hits, given SPR
 

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