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$500 NLHE Hand from Today (2 Viewers)

Against this Villain, and, in this spot, I’m not looking to check back or fold any river.

Given everything that’s happened so far, what sort of range can we put Villain on?
 
chipsncoffee said:
Against this Villain, and, in this spot, I’m not looking to check back or fold any river.

Given everything that’s happened so far, what sort of range can we put Villain on?
Click to expand...
Friendly reminder: This is the part in the thread where you tell us what the river card was :)

If the 6 of diamonds hits or if the board pairs on the river I might give some serious consideration to checking back if given the opportunity. A snap call from this type of villain against the type of aggression you've shown is rather concerning.

BTW I don't care for the 2x pot on the turn... you might as well jam if you're going to overbet the pot by that wide of margin...

Villain's snap call on that type of overbet means he was going to call ANY bet. I expect him to open jam the river, since he doesn't want to risk you checking back. Maybe you're beat and maybe you win, but you have to call at that point, even if the river sucks.

What do I put him on? A straight at a minimum... but a set, a smaller flush, or a SF are all possibilities. Honestly it really doesn't matter that much at this point in the hand... if you catch a clean river card it's all going in... maybe it's all going in whether you love it or not.

Not much more to analyze IMO... so what happened? Don't be like @Payback or @Beakertwang and make us wait 3 days for the results!
 
BGinGA said:
The argument -- right or wrong -- is that :6d::8d: makes the nut straight flush, not a flush (nut or otherwise).
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Well you know which side I’m on here. Straight flush beats an A high flush every day.

But I’ll agree to disagree on this because no matter which side you are on I doubt anyone is going to change their minds.

I just want to know how the hand plays out.
 
Moxie Mike said:
Friendly reminder: This is the part in the thread where you tell us what the river card was :)

If the 6 of diamonds hits or if the board pairs on the river I might give some serious consideration to checking back if given the opportunity. A snap call from this type of villain against the type of aggression you've shown is rather concerning.

BTW I don't care for the 2x pot on the turn... you might as well jam if you're going to overbet the pot by that wide of margin...

Villain's snap call on that type of overbet means he was going to call ANY bet. I expect him to open jam the river, since he doesn't want to risk you checking back. Maybe you're beat and maybe you win, but you have to call at that point, even if the river sucks.

What do I put him on? A straight at a minimum... but a set, a smaller flush, or a SF are all possibilities. Honestly it really doesn't matter that much at this point in the hand... if you catch a clean river card it's all going in... maybe it's all going in whether you love it or not.

Not much more to analyze IMO... so what happened? Don't be like @Payback or @Beakertwang and make us wait 3 days for the results!
Click to expand...

Haha, I won’t make anyone wait. I was just curious to hear what people thought that villain might be holding, because it surprised the crap out of me!

Here we go. River time. Pot is $662. I won’t even bother with the whole “what is Hero’s move” nonsense because I really can’t fold.

The river comes the:4h:. Villain insta-shoves, and Hero calls the $215. Villain turns over :4c::9d: for trips.

This was such a strange hand once it went to showdown because Villain called 52BBs with a pair and a bad flush draw.

Happy ending! It would have been nice if Villain would’ve reloaded, but no such luck.
 
chipsncoffee said:
Haha, I won’t make anyone wait. I was just curious to hear what people thought that villain might be holding, because it surprised the crap out of me!

Here we go. River time. Pot is $662. I won’t even bother with the whole “what is Hero’s move” nonsense because I really can’t fold.

The river comes the:4h:. Villain insta-shoves, and Hero calls the $215. Villain turns over :4c::9d: for trips.

This was such a strange hand once it went to showdown because Villain called 52BBs with a pair and a bad flush draw.

Happy ending! It would have been nice if Villain would’ve reloaded, but no such luck.
Click to expand...

Horrible river card but glad it worked out for you. NH!

Really a bizarre hand overall. I hope you've noted to never, never, NEVER try to bluff this opponent if you ever encounter them again.
 
Thanks for posting this thread - it's always fascinating to see thought processes on hand development.
 
Organista1 said:
Great post, I have a lot to say but I’ll say this - no one snap calls with the nuts, well IMO.. when you have a straight flush or the nuts you want to appear your tanking. I would have felt safe that I had the best hand after villain snap calls the turn :tup:
Click to expand...

Right! When playing online, a lot of bad players snap with marginal hands to try to convince their opponents that they have a strong holding. Snap calls and bet sizings are two of the most reliable tells in the online poker world.
 
chipsncoffee said:
Haha, I won’t make anyone wait. I was just curious to hear what people thought that villain might be holding, because it surprised the crap out of me!

Here we go. River time. Pot is $662. I won’t even bother with the whole “what is Hero’s move” nonsense because I really can’t fold.

The river comes the:4h:. Villain insta-shoves, and Hero calls the $215. Villain turns over :4c::9d: for trips.

This was such a strange hand once it went to showdown because Villain called 52BBs with a pair and a bad flush draw.

Happy ending! It would have been nice if Villain would’ve reloaded, but no such luck.
Click to expand...


Poker is not dead :P
 
I haven't stopped buying chips in the midst of the plague.

I added on three racks to my Tropicana set. Including completing the rack of $100 chips.

I have a start on a hot stamp set using the recent wave mold blanks. Still short many chips though.

I bought 400 "late model" Tropicana $1 chips with an eye towards a mixed set limit game - I host that sort of game a couple of times a year.

Plus a few odds and ends, but most of them will see some play.

As for "someday soon" - - - well not that soon. The incidence of Covid19 in my county is growing at 25% PER DAY at the moment. It is even worse if we focus just on San Marcos, Texas. While a majority of my player pool will wear masks, a significant minority will not. I can not see a prudent restart to my poker game under these conditions. Maybe not till 2021 :dead:.

But some day the game will rise again -=- DrStrange
 
DrStrange said:
I haven't stopped buying chips in the midst of the plague.

I added on three racks to my Tropicana set. Including completing the rack of $100 chips.

I have a start on a hot stamp set using the recent wave mold blanks. Still short many chips though.

I bought 400 "late model" Tropicana $1 chips with an eye towards a mixed set limit game - I host that sort of game a couple of times a year.

Plus a few odds and ends, but most of them will see some play.

As for "someday soon" - - - well not that soon. The incidence of Covid19 in my county is growing at 25% PER DAY at the moment. It is even worse if we focus just on San Marcos, Texas. While a majority of my player pool will wear masks, a significant minority will not. I can not see a prudent restart to my poker game under these conditions. Maybe not till 2021 :dead:.

But some day the game will rise again -=- DrStrange
Click to expand...

Please stay safe and thank you for your valuable insight!

...I’d really like to see those Tropicana’s, by the way...:D
 
Jake14mw said:
Good post, well done, I enjoyed it. Thanks for not giving it away by your comments.
Click to expand...

Thank you! I’m really glad you enjoyed it! It's really interesting to see different people's approaches to different situations, and I always love reading what @DrStrange has to say. I love his super statistical approach to the game.
 
Kain8 said:
You bet double the pot on the turn and he calls with bottom pair and a dubious flush draw? I anticipate that many adult beverages were being consumed by the villain when we got to this point.
Click to expand...

I definitely should’ve included this piece of information in the OP. Villain came in with a strange buy-in amount. It was something like $483 as opposed to the usual $500 , so it’s very likely that he was playing a larger game with an inadequate bankroll, lost a lot of money, and stepped down. This would explain why he was so spewy, and such a calling station. Either way, I am just happy with the results!

Burke said:
yeah this is honestly dream villain...way to get all his stack!
Click to expand...

No joke! Best Villain ever! And thank you! I think he was left with around 4.5BBs after the hand, and of course just set it on fire the next hand. Realistically, he kind of set just over 100BBs on fire in the hand against me.

EDIT: Just realized that my phone autocorrected “spewy” to “spooky”. :ROFL: :ROFLMAO:
 
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chipsncoffee said:
I’m really curious as to why more people aren’t advocating for a raise here with the nut flush draw and the fact that the ace is most likely good here. This gives us significant equity against any hand, and we’re flipping against any pair.
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I guess the question is: Have you seen him fold postflop when he bets small and gets raised? Is this fish capable of folding?

If you have no fold equity, I would not raise with the draw even though A high might be good, and has 3 outs to beat a weaker pair. If you think you can get him to fold with your draw a decent percentage of the time, then it seems worth raising big enough to make him uncomfortable.
 
P.S. Combinatorially, the two possible straight flushes are outweighed by a zillion other combos this loose fish can have, based on the limited evidence. His actual holding suggests that almost every conceivable made hand is still in his range going to the river (including pretty much every worse flush, straight, set, two pair, all the way down to bottom pair plus a weak one-card flush draw).

I wonder if he had not had the 9d in his hand, would he have still called on the turn? In his mind, he apparently thought that gave him extra equity, if he was thinking at all. Even though a 9-high one-card flush can’t possibly be good based on your behavior, if that fourth diamond comes.

Anyway... While I can’t do all those zillion combos in my head on the fly, but his two straight flush combos have got to be at most maybe 1% of even his narrowed range. He has suited diamonds with Kx, Qx... down to 32s, probably. He has all cards that pair the board plus at least a 9 or better of diamonds. Plus all two pair, sets, probably all Tx even without a diamond... On and on.

So in retrospect, we know this guy was continuing with bottom pair or better post flop, and probably all draws including gunshots, and not folding to pretty much any bet. There were plenty of scare cards on the board already, and he played it all the way down.

The only real question I have is the size of the turn bet. Was overbetting the pot on the turn really the best way to stack him? I would have probably gone smaller for fear of chasing him off, and giving myself more options on the river depending what comes. Leaving only about $200 behind basically means you both have to sigh-call almost no matter what river comes...
 
Since playing a lot more online post-COVID, I’ve encounter these loose-passive fish a lot... who will continue if they hit any piece of the flop (including bottom pair and bad draws). They seem to always think that you are just bullying/bluffing when you bet. Once in a while they suck out, but mostly it is just profitable to call down or bet the maximum you think you can without finally waking them up out of their station-stupor.
 
Taghkanic said:
P.S. Combinatorially, the two possible straight flushes are outweighed by a zillion other combos this loose fish can have, based on the limited evidence. His actual holding suggests that almost every conceivable made hand is still in his range going to the river (including pretty much every worse flush, straight, set, two pair, all the way down to bottom pair plus a weak one-card flush draw).

I wonder if he had not had the 9d in his hand, would he have still called on the turn? In his mind, he apparently thought that gave him extra equity, if he was thinking at all. Even though a 9-high one-card flush can’t possibly be good based on your behavior, if that fourth diamond comes.

Anyway... While I can’t do all those zillion combos in my head on the fly, but his two straight flush combos have got to be at most maybe 1% of even his narrowed range. He has suited diamonds with Kx, Qx... down to 32s, probably. He has all cards that pair the board plus at least a 9 or better of diamonds. Plus all two pair, sets, probably all Tx even without a diamond... On and on.

So in retrospect, we know this guy was continuing with bottom pair or better post flop, and probably all draws including gunshots, and not folding to pretty much any bet. There were plenty of scare cards on the board already, and he played it all the way down.

The only real question I have is the size of the turn bet. Was overbetting the pot on the turn really the best way to stack him? I would have probably gone smaller for fear of chasing him off, and giving myself more options on the river depending what comes. Leaving only about $200 behind basically means you both have to sigh-call almost no matter what river comes...
Click to expand...

Against this type of villain, I’m calling any river without a second thought. If he fills up or has a straight flush, “nice hand” and reload. More than anything, I was trying to induce a shove on the turn. I was not expecting a flat call. I actually mentioned in one of my posts that I knew that in a lot of spots I would be missing value by betting two times the size of the pot, but if I’ve ever encountered a villain that’s going to call off or shove here, I’m pretty sure it’s this one.
 

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