Controversial Chip & Poker Opinions (12 Viewers)

[upNdown]

I'm new here and Cards Mold chips interest me most. After browsing around the forum, I've noticed some strange stuff. Here are my opinions, and based on the reactions and responses in the other thread I created, they're probably controversial. Let's give it a shot anyway.

1) Why does this community allow a member to try to blatantly rip others off? From what I gather, Cards Molds cost $0.39 each (including artwork fees) + reshipping costs, which I estimate to be $10-$30 for most sets. Yet someone is listing a Cards Mold set for $0.73 per chip + shipping. Aren't Cards Molds chips a commodity? Am I missing something?

2) From the same Cards Mold Group Buy link above - I don't really get the artwork fees. Are all fees the same for each piece of "art?" Though the Hot Dog Sandwich chips aren't my cup of tea, I'd understand paying an artwork fee for something unique and 100% self-made. But,

a) Am I paying the same artwork fee for the Aria's and Bellagio chips? Is it that tough to clone something that already exists?

b) Are Aria/Bellagio okay with these reproductions? I'd bet the answer is a hard no. Do they get a cut of the artwork fees? Again, I bet no. Then why am I paying the "artist" for these clear violations of copyright law? The most common argument I've seen on this forum is that the clones might be kosher because the chips are not made for resale at a profit. I don't think that's correct since the "artists" are clearly profiting.

 

[LowerBama1714]

Yep, would take them over Tina’s chips 10 times out of 10. Only issue I’ve ever had with them were some of the inlay stickers popping off, but a little superglue takes care of that.

I trust everyone in my games, but monte carlos are as ubiquitous as sand on a beach….tough to have a secure game. Most CMs are unique enough (especially if you design them yourself) to prevent “visitor chips”. Maybe that’s stupid…like most of my thoughts.

 

[Tonysquander]

I trust everyone in my games, but monte carlos are as ubiquitous as sand on a beach….tough to have a secure game. Most CMs are unique enough (especially if you design them yourself) to prevent “visitor chips”. Maybe that’s stupid…like most of my thoughts.

Valid point. Never had to worry about that with the folks playing in my game when we were using them, was mostly just talking about the chips themselves. Would still rather play with the Monte Carlos over Tina's up until the day an extra chip turned up in the MC set lol.

 

[bergs]

I hesitate to call them ugly (beauty and beholder eyes, something like that), but I will say that contrary to seemingly everyone else on PCF, the Tiger chips never spoke to me. Even before pricing was announced, I knew I wasn't interested in getting a set.

Of course, I have objectively bad taste, so there's that.

I think there was an explosion of color with 15 or so chips across 2-3 chip lines. Maybe would’ve been better to reveal 1 set at a time, or the primary set and then individually secondary racks.

I like a few of the chips, but I don’t think I could effectively put an entire cash set together than I’d love.

 

[Jeevansluck]

I hesitate to call them ugly (beauty and beholder eyes, something like that), but I will say that contrary to seemingly everyone else on PCF, the Tiger chips never spoke to me. Even before pricing was announced, I knew I wasn't interested in getting a set.

Of course, I have objectively bad taste, so there's that.

Nope. Not alone.

I never went for a single chip. Only a sample, and I am not bothered I didn’t score that either.

They ain’t ugly. So I also agree on that front. They didn’t convince me to dish out the $$$, however. That’s it really.

I don’t agree you have bad taste. It’s your palette and there is no rule book on what to like and how it should appeal to you. I love my Detroit Jacks and that’s that. It’s been 3 years and I have a few other cool sets, THC, BCC, and TRKs. I love them all. However, I’m a fiend for the Jacks. I don’t think I have bad taste, rather just my own taste.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

Why does this community allow a member to try to blatantly rip others off? From what I gather, Cards Molds cost $0.39 each (including artwork fees) + reshipping costs, which I estimate to be $10-$30 for most sets. Yet someone is listing a Cards Mold set for $0.73 per chip + shipping. Aren't Cards Molds chips a commodity? Am I missing something?

First, the only real power "the community" has in this case is to buy or not buy. Sounds like no one has bought it yet, so there you go.

And while IMO $0.73/chip is way too much, I can understand paying a small premium to get the chips now instead of waiting two months or more to get them from a GB. It's the same reason I'll buy something from Walgreens for $5.99 and get it right now when I could order it from Amazon for $4.50 and get it in 2-3 days.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

Nope. Not alone.

I never went for a single chip. Only a sample, and I am not bothered I didn’t score that either.

They ain’t ugly. So I also agree on that front. They didn’t convince me to dish out the $$$, however. That’s it really.

I don’t agree you have bad taste. It’s your palette and there is no rule book on what to like and how it should appeal to you. I love my Detroit Jacks and that’s that. It’s been 3 years and I have a few other cool sets, THC, BCC, and TRKs. I love them all. However, I’m a fiend for the Jacks. I don’t think I have bad taste, rather just my own taste.

Yeah, that was a bit of a self-deprecating joke.

It's impossible to have objectively bad taste, or even bad taste for that matter. You might not like what I like, that's all.

 

[LowerBama1714]

Yeah, that was a bit of a self-deprecating joke.

It's impossible to have objectively bad taste, or even bad taste for that matter. You might not like what I like, that's all.

You (not you specifically) are a lucky ass bastard if no one likes what you like….the economics of that scenario are outstanding.

 

[Schmendr1ck]

You (not you specifically) are a lucky ass bastard if no one likes what you like….the economics of that scenario are outstanding.

To some degree, but it also becomes a lot harder to find the things that you do like.

 

[Jeevansluck]

You (not you specifically) are a lucky ass bastard if no one likes what you like….the economics of that scenario are outstanding.

Indeed sir!

Got me my Jack Detroit $1KP for basically TCR prices because even today, they are considered ugly or undesirable. Maybe not anymore because the scarcity has caught up, but when Jim released these chips, nobody wanted them.

I felt I was easily able to gobble these up while everyone else scrambled for $1KS.

A prime example of said economics!

 

[Tonysquander]

I have great taste. Anyone know where I can get some more of these?

 

[glynn]

1) Why does this community allow a member to try to blatantly rip others off? From what I gather, Cards Molds cost $0.39 each (including artwork fees) + reshipping costs, which I estimate to be $10-$30 for most sets. Yet someone is listing a Cards Mold set for $0.73 per chip + shipping. Aren't Cards Molds chips a commodity? Am I missing something?

There are better examples of ripoff attempts imo. I am not in the Cards Mold market, but as others have said, Cards Mold chips that you can have this week are not a commodity.

That said, there should be a limit to the number of times you can bump a sale thread without a significant price reduction. This isn't a case of a niche item trying to catch the right eyeballs — it's safe to say that the market is aware of and has spoken about these chips at that price.

Possibly not controversial: I would rather push around colored paperclips than have chips that say "Aria's" on them.

 

[LowerBama1714]

Indeed sir!

Got me my Jack Detroit $1KP for basically TCR prices because even today, they are considered ugly or undesirable. Maybe not anymore because the scarcity has caught up, but when Jim released these chips, nobody wanted them.

I felt I was easily able to gobble these up while everyone else scrambled for $1KS.

A prime example of said economics! View attachment 1068996

I thought everyone had a Herculean hard-on for blaze orange….nice work.

 

[Silver_Fiend]

I have great taste. Anyone know where I can get some more of these?

View attachment 1069002

No, but I found the perfect inlay image for the tiger chips!

 

[Lil Tuna]

I thought everyone had a Herculean hard-on for blaze orange….nice work.

 

[TX_Golf_N_Poker]

I'm new here and Cards Mold chips interest me most. After browsing around the forum, I've noticed some strange stuff. Here are my opinions, and based on the reactions and responses in the other thread I created, they're probably controversial. Let's give it a shot anyway.

1) Why does this community allow a member to try to blatantly rip others off? From what I gather, Cards Molds cost $0.39 each (including artwork fees) + reshipping costs, which I estimate to be $10-$30 for most sets. Yet someone is listing a Cards Mold set for $0.73 per chip + shipping. Aren't Cards Molds chips a commodity? Am I missing something?

2) From the same Cards Mold Group Buy link above - I don't really get the artwork fees. Are all fees the same for each piece of "art?" Though the Hot Dog Sandwich chips aren't my cup of tea, I'd understand paying an artwork fee for something unique and 100% self-made. But,

a) Am I paying the same artwork fee for the Aria's and Bellagio chips? Is it that tough to clone something that already exists?

b) Are Aria/Bellagio okay with these reproductions? I'd bet the answer is a hard no. Do they get a cut of the artwork fees? Again, I bet no. Then why am I paying the "artist" for these clear violations of copyright law? The most common argument I've seen on this forum is that the clones might be kosher because the chips are not made for resale at a profit. I don't think that's correct since the "artists" are clearly profiting.

1) No one is being forced to buy anything, so no one is being ripped off. The "community" has no say in what two individuals agree on as a price for a set to change hands. Yes, that set is overpriced and that's part of why it's sitting unsold. There's also the point that if you want to order a set from Tina, there's a 2-3 month wait before you will have them in hand. Is it worth a little more if someone is selling exactly what you want and you can get it in less than a week? Maybe, so it's up to buyer and seller to determine how small or large that premium should be.

2) The files submitted to Tina to produce any cards mold sets need to be in specific formats. Do you know how to produce those files? If so, then create them yourself. If not, then a couple pennies a chip paid to the artist for his time and talent to create the needed files seems like a pretty reasonable request. The graphic artists we have here on PCF that I've worked with are extremely reasonable. Isn't that the way our economy works? If you can't do something yourself, you pay someone else who has the skills to do it for you?

 

[quintooo]

There are some people on the forum who will say "a certain flipper here blahs blahs," "there's a specific flipper in the community that blahs blahs," etc etc. Why do people not just name the flippers? Am I missing something?

Is it because:

No one is being forced to buy anything, so no one is being ripped off. The "community" has no say in what two individuals agree on as a price for a set to change hands.

?

This is not a sarcastic post or anything really, I'm just genuinely curious why people who call out flippers don't just say the damn name?

 

[DMack]

There are some people on the forum who will say "a certain flipper here blahs blahs," "there's a specific flipper in the community that blahs blahs," etc etc. Why do people not just name the flippers? Am I missing something?

Is it because:

?

This is not a sarcastic post or anything really, I'm just genuinely curious why people who call out flippers don't just say the damn name?

I think that’s pretty easy…I think a lot of people are afraid the moderation that would come with it, especially when vendor status is involved.

 

[quintooo]

I think that’s pretty easy…I think a lot of people are afraid the moderation that would come with it, especially when vendor status is involved.

I see, makes sense... I think? I feel like community should be free to call out members, but I guess it may come too close to thread crapping/personal attacks/simply not true?

 

[upNdown]

The most common argument I've seen on this forum is that the clones might be kosher because the chips are not made for resale at a profit.

Followed closely by:
A) Its okay to buy clones because everybody can’t afford the expensive real chips, and
B) it’s okay to rip off casinos because they’re corporations that exist to take our money.
How can you argue with such wisdom?

 

[DMack]

I see, makes sense... I think? I feel like community should be free to call out members, but I guess it may come too close to thread crapping/personal attacks/simply not true?

I agree, but in the times we live in, we might hurt a feeling or two during the process. That is like a class A felony these days.

 

[OfficerLovejoy]

I agree, but in the times we live in, we might hurt a feeling or two during the process. That is like a class A felony these days.

The tone you wrote that in is making me feel unsafe.
Time for your to clean out your desk, I'm afraid.

 

[aggie]

There are some people on the forum who will say "a certain flipper here blahs blahs," "there's a specific flipper in the community that blahs blahs," etc etc. Why do people not just name the flippers? Am I missing something?

I agree, but in the times we live in, we might hurt a feeling or two during the process. That is like a class A felony these days.

I just assumed it was a personal vendetta more than actual concern for flipping?

Names or no names, it does get tiring. Sure it needles whoever’s involved (I guess?), but out-of-context it just comes across as petty.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

1) Why does this community allow a member to try to blatantly rip others off? From what I gather, Cards Molds cost $0.39 each (including artwork fees) + reshipping costs, which I estimate to be $10-$30 for most sets.Yet someone is listing a Cards Mold set for $0.73 per chip + shipping.

2) From the same Cards Mold Group Buy link above - I don't really get the artwork fees. Are all fees the same for each piece of "art?"

a) Am I paying the same artwork fee for the Aria's and Bellagio chips? Is it that tough to clone something that already exists?

b) Are Aria/Bellagio okay with these reproductions? I'd bet the answer is a hard no. Do they get a cut of the artwork fees? Again, I bet no. Then why am I paying the "artist" for these clear violations of copyright law?

1) dont have to buy, and for that price its not selling. Plus, the 0.39 each is including shipping to the US, and youll wait a few months. What do you think the community should be doing about that?

2a) not too tough, feel free to do it yourself if you want. Not being rude, but I appreciate high resolution art that looks good.

2b) because you want the item. Illegal or not, you're paying for it, why not pay the artist 2 or 3 cents a chip? Lol at you buying the illegal things but being frustrated the artist that made the illegal thing is getting a few bucks.

You're already looking at buying the cheapest chips out there, and now you're complaining about paying $30ish/1000 chips to the artist. I dont mind the discussion about whether its ethical to rip off casinos (LOL) but to consider the artists as predatory is just silly.

 

[DMack]

I just assumed it was a personal vendetta more than actual concern for flipping?

Names or no names, it does get tiring. Sure it needles whoever’s involved (I guess?), but out-of-context it just comes across as petty.

Does it get as tiring as your “needles” to old, veteran chippers that aren’t big fans of the new “community?”

 

[aggie]

Does it get as tiring as your “needles” to old, veteran chippers that aren’t big fans of the new “community?”

Didn’t mean to hit a nerve, which I clearly did. Apologies if I’ve offended you somehow along the way.

For the record, I have an enormous amount of respect for the chipping veterans who continue to work to make this a fun, enjoyable place. I wouldn’t be a part of this community without them.

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

Didn’t mean to hit a nerve, which I clearly did. Apologies if I’ve offended you somehow along the way.

For the record, I have an enormous amount of respect for the chipping veterans who continue to work to make this a fun, enjoyable place. I wouldn’t be a part of this community without them.

Dont feed the troll, you're fine.

 

[DMack]

Dont feed the troll, you're fine.

LOL. As expected!

 

[Saoliver]

There are some people on the forum who will say "a certain flipper here blahs blahs," "there's a specific flipper in the community that blahs blahs," etc etc. Why do people not just name the flippers? Am I missing something?

Is it because:

?

This is not a sarcastic post or anything really, I'm just genuinely curious why people who call out flippers don't just say the damn name?

Because, one day, the flipper might have exactly what you need.

 

[elemeno]

1) No one is being forced to buy anything, so no one is being ripped off. The "community" has no say in what two individuals agree on as a price for a set to change hands. Yes, that set is overpriced and that's part of why it's sitting unsold. There's also the point that if you want to order a set from Tina, there's a 2-3 month wait before you will have them in hand. Is it worth a little more if someone is selling exactly what you want and you can get it in less than a week? Maybe, so it's up to buyer and seller to determine how small or large that premium should be.

2) The files submitted to Tina to produce any cards mold sets need to be in specific formats. Do you know how to produce those files? If so, then create them yourself. If not, then a couple pennies a chip paid to the artist for his time and talent to create the needed files seems like a pretty reasonable request. The graphic artists we have here on PCF that I've worked with are extremely reasonable. Isn't that the way our economy works? If you can't do something yourself, you pay someone else who has the skills to do it for you?

1) I guess that makes sense, but it would be a shame if I, or another new member, bought at a rip-off price in the spur of the moment/without doing diligence.

2) I strongly disagree with you, but not everyone has the same set of principles. For example, I wouldn't reproduce the Tiger Palace chips onto the Cards Mold without kk405 and/or JeepologyOffroad's express consent. Since I wouldn't do that, I also wouldn't do the same thing to Aria/Bellagio.