Best Way to Identify Positive/Negative Interactions (2 Viewers)

[umbkcshah]

I was going to post this yesterday, but then the thread had vanished LOL. Genuinely curious if you guys would consider the following seller a flipper:

Chipper 1 and chipper 2 bought a bunch of tiger chips, but chipper 1 really wants some X chips to add to his set, and openly offers the original price plus 25% on top for them. Chipper 2 then decides proceeds to sell the requested X chips from his set at the offered price.

Was chipper 2 just being a nice guy or should that be considered flipping?

Chipper 1 (Buyer) made an offer. Chipper 2 accepted the offer.

Flipping for me is buying, followed by actively selling at an increased price without ever planning to enjoy the chips.

If someone is freely offering a price more than the value the holder places on it, why wouldn't they sell or help out? Sure, there could have been a 'friend' deal maybe, but not necessary in my opinion.

 

[Budha]

I was going to post this yesterday, but then the thread had vanished LOL. Genuinely curious if you guys would consider the following seller a flipper:

Chipper 1 and chipper 2 bought a bunch of tiger chips, but chipper 1 really wants some X chips to add to his set, and openly offers the original price plus 25% on top for them. Chipper 2 then decides proceeds to sell the requested X chips from his set at the offered price.

Was chipper 2 just being a nice guy or should that be considered flipping?

This is pretty clearly not flipping, at least IMHO.

Seller did not initiate, and did not list the chips (ie - no intent to sell). He was given an offer vs soliciting an offer for more than was paid.

- seller is not planning to sell the chips, so in order to sell them, the buyer offered additional incentive.

Apples and oranges.

 

[upNdown]

In that, I think we lost some really helpful and important information/feedback.

At the end of the day, it appears that most chippers accept the fact that not everyone will agree on exact definitions and that there is more gray than white and black when it comes to PCF, community, and classifieds.

I personally wrote it up along the lines of both PCF and member interactions varying from member to member, both are unique in experience and expectations.

This is all to say say, I think that there *should* be a way to simply deposit some type of “not in good taste” sentiment - without attacking or emotion. And that seems to be what that thread was turning towards.

I don’t PM, I’m not in a ton external group texts, etc. PCF feedback system is meaningless for anything other than highlighting drag em out fights.

Due to this, I’ve now sold several times to chippers I wouldn’t have otherwise. I post, they dibs, and then I start getting the PMs and Texts detailing their private shenanigans.

Even if member engineered, is there a way to attempt to curb or solve this? Or is this, like trying to have everyone agree on a term, futile?

It could simply be a thread with rules in place - list chips, username, offer, and objective summary sentence without emotion that details why you found it distasteful.

Or maybe it’s not that deep. This is probably too late I suppose, as it seems most everyone has moved to only selling friendly pricing to real life friends, and fmv to the remaining community.

If so, maybe that was always a natural evolution of a growing memberbase. Too bad we as members and admins didn’t get ahead of it before it was too late though.

Any helpful thoughts on how member interaction information could be gathered and shared while somehow not delving into mud slinging fights? (Like objectively, my profile would obviously include historical shipping issues, but would also include plenty of positive and other notes)

Happy Easter, Benarrie book courtesy of me sitting in traffic as a passenger

@Tommy has consistently said that he doesn’t care what prices people ask for their chips and that he doesn’t want thread crapping in sales, so that’s the reality here.
That said, if somebody wants to circulate an external “bad actors / bad flippers” newsletter, sure please include me.

 

[Josh Kifer]

@Tommy has consistently said that he doesn’t care what prices people ask for their chips and that he doesn’t want thread crapping in sales, so that’s the reality here.
That said, if somebody wants to circulate an external “bad actors / bad flippers” newsletter, sure please include me.

Oh god yes. A newsletter. Modern problems require modern solutions.

Can we have trivia on it too?

 

[Lil Tuna]

Oh god yes. A newsletter. Modern problems require modern solutions.

Can we have trivia on it too?

The solution is don’t do business with them.

 

[upNdown]

Can we have trivia on it too?

Hopefully. And little caricature cartoony things too.

 

[BarrieJ3]

@Tommy has consistently said that he doesn’t care what prices people ask for their chips and that he doesn’t want thread crapping in sales, so that’s the reality here.
That said, if somebody wants to circulate an external “bad actors / bad flippers” newsletter, sure please include me.

Understood, but I’ve repeatedly sold things to people that I wouldn’t have. I’ve sold somewhere in the realm of 100,000 chips and don’t know who is who.

I’m not asking for Tommy to change that stance, I’m trying to find a solution for how I can be an educated community member without having to be on 20 PM groups.

 

[Pony]

still not seeing an issue with simply asking a polite, clarifying question such as; "Nice chips, GLWS, are these the same chips that were listed for $XXX.xx in this thread?"

 

[Highli99]

still not seeing an issue with simply asking a polite, clarifying question such as; "Nice chips, GLWS, are these the same chips that were listed for $XXX.xx in this thread?"

A passive aggressive thread crap is still a thread crap.

The solution is easy guys. Just block and ignore members who transact in a manner you dislike. You won't see their threads anymore or be triggered by their actions.

Then move on. There are bigger injustices in this world to focus on.

 

[upNdown]

A passive aggressive thread crap is still a thread crap.

The solution is easy guys. Just block and ignore members who transact in a manner you dislike. You won't see their threads anymore or be triggered by their actions.

Then move on. There are bigger injustices in this world to focus on.

So, we should turn our focus to the politics section?

 

[NotRealNameNoSir]

So, we should turn our focus to the politics section?

 

[Josh Kifer]

Hopefully. And little caricature cartoony things too.

I'd say Dilbert comics, but it's Burgsbert. It can be three panels about getting a taco stuck in his throat.

The solution is don’t do business with them.

Oh I'm just fucking around, I really don't care.

 

[Lil Tuna]

A passive aggressive thread crap is still a thread crap.

The solution is easy guys. Just block and ignore members who transact in a manner you dislike. You won't see their threads anymore or be triggered by their actions.

Then move on. There are bigger injustices in this world to focus on.

At some point though their actions most likely come back and affect you in one way or another.
I’ve never blocked anyone, I want to know exactly who I should stay away from or maybe even find some common ground with.

 

[mipevi]

Thanks @umbkcshah and @Budha , so actively selling is seen as an integral part of flipping. I do think it can be tricky with items of high interest, because realistically a flipper would not even need to post a WTS and could fly under the radar. The intent to flip may have always been there, just not in a transparent way.

I’m not trying to defend anyone nor throw anyone under the bus. I think blatant flipping is what seems to get people riled up, but there are other levels to it as well. And even blatant flipping would be fine in some cases IMO, say you find a rack of Paulson Dunes $1’s at a yard sale for $100. Most chippers would buy them in a second even if they have no use for them, and sell them for much more than a hundred bucks.

 

[Budha]

still not seeing an issue with simply asking a polite, clarifying question such as; "Nice chips, GLWS, are these the same chips that were listed for $XXX.xx in this thread?"

I see this approach, well pretty much in every other forum I participate in.

It should not be considered thread crapping to point out blatant pricing inconsistencies….

People are still free to do whatever they want with the information and sell/buy at whatever price point they desire.

 

[Highli99]

At some point though their actions most likely come back and affect you in one way or another.
I’ve never blocked anyone, I want to know exactly who I should stay away from or maybe even find some common ground with.

I get your point but you can't really have your cake and eat it too. If particular member acts in a way that I disagree with, I have to decide if the value of avoiding future issues is higher than the opportunity cost of lost future interactions. This helps me make clear decisions which in some cases is letting some actions not bother me.

 

[Budha]

The solution is easy guys. Just block and ignore members who transact in a manner you dislike.

If it’s not very transparent, because no one ever says anything - or it’s considered thread crapping (until the frustration levels boil over, like the last 24/48 hrs). How is one to know who to avoid…?

Especially and particularly new members whom we claim to care about and want to bring into the fold.

 

[TheDuke]

Easiest solution is a google docs spreadsheet that is community maintained. Need one or two members to maintain the spreadsheet.

Don't need alot of data points. Just send the Doc owner the following: username, chips in question, brief synopsis of what went down, and links to the threads/posts. It would then be easy to search by username and see if there's a history or pattern of behavior.

No name calling, mud slinging. Just facts. People have different interpretations of what constitutes flipping or abhorrent behavior. This spreadsheet would just contain facts and let the readers decide if they want to deal with the noted user.

 

[Budha]

because realistically a flipper would not even need to post a WTS and could fly under the radar.

Good point, and probably valid. I guess I didn’t consider that level of “skullduggery”.

Valid point.

 

[Lil Tuna]

I get your point but you can't really have your cake and eat it too. If particular member acts in a way that I disagree with, I have to decide if the value of avoiding future issues is higher than the opportunity cost of lost future interactions. This helps me make clear decisions which in some cases is letting some actions not bother me.

Aren’t you potentially losing future interactions by blocking members? What I hear when you say “in some cases NOT LETTING some actions bother you” is this,
those actions probably do bother you but your going to let them slide because it could hurt a future interaction?

See no evil hear no evil I guess. When it’s knocking on your doorstep it’s “How Did This Happen”

 

[bergs]

The solution is don’t do business with them.

Right — so, who actually are they? If they don’t get publicly called out, you’ll never know.

I should just start flipping with reckless aplomb. Damn it feels good to be a gangster.

 

[JMC9389]

Right — so, who actually are they? If they don’t get publicly called out, you’ll never know.

I should just start flipping with reckless aplomb. Damn it feels good to be a gangster.

Dibs Trumans.

 

[Lil Tuna]

Right — so, who actually are they? If they don’t get publicly called out, you’ll never know.

I should just start flipping with reckless aplomb. Damn it feels good to be a gangster.

We all know who they are Rob, we can’t say it out loud here because it potentially gets us banned. You know this. I’ve had plenty reach out in private with their guesses and most are right on the money every time.

 

[Pony]

Here's a real-life situation involving myself and one of my wife's adult kids (....yes, I've been married more than once, I happen to like the taste of wedding cake, don't judge....)

They need a car because their other car was totaled by someone running a red light, and they finally got the insurance payout. They know I know about cars (I buy recreationally from the auto auctions, do repairs, etc). When they were looking, I told them to beware of vehicles where the seller doesn't/won't provide a vin, and when it's got a rebuilt/reconstructed title and the seller indicates it's from something exceptionally minor. All the cool kids want to buy cars via FB Marketplace, where every hack and scammer also want to sell, and of course these sellers are 'really chill and really friendly and nice!'. I've saved their butts from buying cleaned-up disasters a couple times. Here's the last exchange (they now have a vehicle)


I know that some of the vehicles they were looking at were from either scammers or curbstoners flipping trashed vehicles that shouldn't be on the road (most of the time no inspections are done on rebuilt vehicles - just simply sign a statement that it's good-to-go). I'd also let them know about some vehicles that were sold for pennies on the dollar at the auction. And provided before-pics of some vehicles.

1) Do I let them know about some 'dealers' they need to be wary of?

2) Do I point out that they're getting ripped off, and maybe advise them to wait a bit to see what else turns up?

or

3) Do I say "well, you're an adult, this is the real world and people can buy/sell whatever they want, and since you're younger and don't have my experience - tough luck, life's a bitch, hope the roll of the dice turns out in your favor"


Most of this is rhetorical. Because this is family - I would want to make sure they are not taken advantage of. But I'd also feel the same about my good neighbor. But not the bad neighbor, they can rot in hell .

To me PCF is more of a community than an open classifieds marketplace, and a quick point-out (to me) would not be unreasonable. But I'm also going to say that I don't know if there's going to be a correct answer. Way I still see it, is what's good for one is good for the other. Gonna blatantly try to excessively profit at the cost of community? Be prepared for someone to point out what you paid for those items last week/month.

 

[Lil Tuna]

Here's a real-life situation involving myself and one of my wife's adult kids (....yes, I've been married more than once, I happen to like the taste of wedding cake, don't judge....)

They need a car because their other car was totaled by someone running a red light, and they finally got the insurance payout. They know I know about cars (I buy recreationally from the auto auctions, do repairs, etc). When they were looking, I told them to beware of vehicles where the seller doesn't/won't provide a vin, and when it's got a rebuilt/reconstructed title and the seller indicates it's from something exceptionally minor. All the cool kids want to buy cars via FB Marketplace, where every hack and scammer also want to sell, and of course these sellers are 'really chill and really friendly and nice!'. I've saved their butts from buying cleaned-up disasters a couple times. Here's the last exchange (they now have a vehicle)
View attachment 1116410

I know that some of the vehicles they were looking at were from either scammers or curbstoners flipping trashed vehicles that shouldn't be on the road (most of the time no inspections are done on rebuilt vehicles - just simply sign a statement that it's good-to-go). I'd also let them know about some vehicles that were sold for pennies on the dollar at the auction. And provided before-pics of some vehicles.

1) Do I let them know about some 'dealers' they need to be wary of?

2) Do I point out that they're getting ripped off, and maybe advise them to wait a bit to see what else turns up?

or

3) Do I say "well, you're an adult, this is the real world and people can buy/sell whatever they want, and since you're younger and don't have my experience - tough luck, life's a bitch, hope the roll of the dice turns out in your favor"


Most of this is rhetorical. Because this is family - I would want to make sure they are not taken advantage of. But I'd also feel the same about my good neighbor. But not the bad neighbor, they can rot in hell .

To me PCF is more of a community than an open classifieds marketplace, and a quick point-out (to me) would not be unreasonable. But I'm also going to say that I don't know if there's going to be a correct answer. Way I still see it, is what's good for one is good for the other. Gonna blatantly try to excessively profit at the cost of community? Be prepared for someone to point out what you paid for those items last week/month.

And you don’t see one so called “flipper” in this thread defending their actions either. Should speak volumes to anybody on the fence about it.

 

[ArielVer18]

I kinda like the idea of a “transaction feedback thread” where you can post positive and negative feedback. Not sure you want to buy from someone? Search that thread for their name. You’re not crapping in their transaction thread, which I think was the intent of Tommy’s no threadcrapping rule.

Isn't that what the Feedback system is supposed to accomplish? People need to stop being shy about posting non-positive feedback.

 

[TheDuke]

Heck, this is how everyone’s favorite eBay vendor makes his killing. It’s disgusting. Openly talks about hating RHC chips, somebody posts a want ad for an obscure, cheap, RHC chip, and there he is bidding them to the moon. It’s happened so many times that one can’t keep track. Word has definitely made its way around about him (he was a dolphin from the second he joined), but some are still willing to be fooled.

And you don’t see one so called “flipper” in this thread defending their actions either. Should speak volumes to anybody on the fence about it.

I have no idea who you guys are referring to. That's why we need some kind of reference guide for noobs like me.

 

[krafticus]

@Tommy has consistently said that he doesn’t care what prices people ask for their chips and that he doesn’t want thread crapping in sales, so that’s the reality here.
That said, if somebody wants to circulate an external “bad actors / bad flippers” newsletter, sure please include me.

So, you can be a real ass, but you can’t be an ass to the ass for being an ass…..

 

[Eriks]

Isn't that what the Feedback system is supposed to accomplish? People need to stop being shy about posting non-positive feedback.

It’s for completed deals only. So unless you’re the seller or buyer you can’t post feedback. That said, you’re definitely right that the stigma of posting negative feedback needs to go

 

[KHarp1]

Isn't that what the Feedback system is supposed to accomplish? People need to stop being shy about posting non-positive feedback.

Not really, the feedback system is between buyer and seller. It's very unlikely that I'm going to buy something from a flipper, pay more than I should have, then actually post a negative feedback about the price.

The independent thread about potential flippers/scammers/pricing & sales history is a great idea. That would bypass the "sales thread crapping" rules while offering a valuable tool for the community.