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Have Chinese cards mold replica sets gone too far? (7 Viewers)
- Thread starter aggie
- Start date
Some are, some aren’t.
Depends on the amount of Jumers in play..,
Johnblue
Flush
Oh well, then if that is all we are allowed to talk about, then no, cards mold chips I don’t think are bad at all, I could not care less, they are just ceramic chips from a manuafacturer with its own custom ceramic chip blank..
I think if the same crew that makes these cards molds for a fun hobby tries to do TinaHC, then, WE (PCF) is going to have a problem.
I am not an authority, I’m not moral police, I don’t think I could influence anyone here.
But I also don’t need to stay quiet about something that is a blatant China trademark violation of a company that I respect and collect.
12thMan
Full House
Yeah but the vast majority of people who complained about the NAGBs were complaining because they were mad they weren't invited, right? Almost every argument I've read on NAGBs boil down to it not being fair that everyone didn't have the opportunity or that people profited/are profiting off things that weren't meant to be and the rift it created in the community- not an altruistic need to protect Paulson.
Johnblue
Flush
I don’t even really think that it’s the same thing, some people faked a casino license or something. I don’t see it as the same thing as counterfeiting the hat and Kane logo.
Also, I don’t really care to protect Paulson, I’d be more worried about the PCF, and the future of GPI even manufacturing compression clay chips
You know, honesty, I personally do not care one way or the other what the help people do, but I mean we are the only ones that are gonna give a shit if these ceramic chips are on the hat and cane mold, we are the only people that would be buying them because they have the hat and cane on them so maybe it’s a good idea that we just say no you know what cards mold is good enough at least give some distinguishable difference if we’re going to copy a bunch of casino designs.
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FOMO and envy are some of the stupidest of motivations. I just want to maintain honesty and some integrity in this hobby, and promote creativity over crass simulation. I'm quite happy for the people who have ex-casino chip collections that can rival the value of my real estate. I'm equally happy for those who make a beautiful personalized custom set of Card Mold ceramics as they share their process with us. I'm happy for the people that play every week with their certified genuine official weight clay casino dice chips because at the very least it means they are playing, and screw us snobs.
Somehow we've driven a whole lot of folks to take the path of banality because we've failed to call it out, and now it has escalated to the production of a hat and cane debossed ceramic blank. Of course this will mean there will be a stampede to obtain them, using loads of graphics that mimic casinos of yore as well as live cash value chips and tournament knockoffs, and our hobby will be the worse for it.
Somehow we've driven a whole lot of folks to take the path of banality because we've failed to call it out, and now it has escalated to the production of a hat and cane debossed ceramic blank. Of course this will mean there will be a stampede to obtain them, using loads of graphics that mimic casinos of yore as well as live cash value chips and tournament knockoffs, and our hobby will be the worse for it.
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I have disagreed with so many of your opinions. But finally we agree!!!
So let's all ask ourselves, regardless of who was invited or not, were the availability of the NAGB chips a "good thing" for the hobby? Should we be happy and complicit that a fraud was perpetrated against a legit company that has the right to set its own rules on who they decide to do business with? Should the bottom line be, "I don't care how it comes about, as long as I get what I want"?
It's not such a far step to see how even ceramic fake hat and cane will get us.
I guess I'm glad about that (?)
12thMan
Full House
I guess my thought isn't directly directed at the new mold that may or may not be coming but more so just pointing out I think anyone being mad about NAGBs are mad because they weren't part of it and not if it's good for the hobby or not.
Not really making a judgement based off it or anything, just pointing out there are two very different "arguments" on why NAGBs and card mold knock offs are good for the hobby or not.
bergs
Royal Flush
The guy that I know of that actually complained did it to protect friends at Caesar’s. I never complained to GPI or anything of the sort but my problem with the NAGB had zero to do with me not being invited. I’m not going to rehash it for the 4000th time but not everyone had the same motivation around that situation.
bergs
Royal Flush
That’s a gross generalization that isn’t accurate.
RichMahogany
Straight Flush
bergs
Royal Flush
On the whole, actually, yeah.
Everyone who engages with another company or party in bad faith does so at their own peril.
I don’t agree, but that’s sort of the American way nowadays, isn’t it?
bergs
Royal Flush
If you want to improve the hobby stop the flippers. The rising prices AA the hobby expanded directly drove the desire for the cheaper ceramics.
12thMan
Full House
I have no clue, I don't own any other than a complete sample set of the chickens because I won a flip for the opportunity to buy them and I thought they looked cool. I don't know all the back stories on what, and more importantly who, this community has missed out on because of the rift the NAGBs caused.
I can see it both ways though-on one hand I think it's sad that some people aren't part of the community anymore (although I think politics were just as big of a catalyst for some) and it sucks some (seemingly) good people got (seemingly) left out.
But on the other hand I think it's kind of bad ass that some people in a hobby got together and found a way to get the unubtanium that people dream of. And, if I'm being honest, the fuzziness (yeah, fraud I guess) that made it all possible slightly adds to the coolness of it.
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It’s a topic that has many layers for sure. But in the light of the initial question - are card mold copies good for the hobby - I think the NAGB chips that were copies of the WSOP chips (which apparently resulted in those WSOP chips being pulled from play) might not have been a good thing. I’d say those chips flew a little too close to the sun and brought additional scrutiny on future NAGB chips. Except there have been others since then. So I guess the jury is still out?
12thMan
Full House
Fair enough, I openly and loudly admit I am probably one of the most naive out of the members that were on the board before NAGBs were a thing, my knowledge is limited to the conversations and posts that have been made in the surface of PCF and I've probably missed the vast majority of those.
I'm mistaken, sorry. I'll stand by my statement and say that a lot of people were angry they weren't involved, but obviously there are many reasons people were pissed about them.
Considering Im not even 100% on who you're referring to that complained to protect Caesars, and a lot of other members can probably fill in those blanks easily, I don't know too much about what happened behind the scenes.
I just don't understand how people who love poker chips and frequent a poker chip forum regularly are upset about a new source of poker chips being made available to everyone to the point that they feel it might lead to the end of poker chips and/or the end of PCF. Am I missing something here?
Did everyone pull out the pitchforks when CPC first started making "non and/or fake Paulsons"? How about with Gene at ABC/BR Poker? How about Sunfly? Why suddenly is the Tina/Cards Mold making of alleged "fake Paulson" poker chips such a crazy and dangerous endeavor?
I do understand that a TinaHC mold of chips of currently open casinos is probably not a good idea. However, as far as OP's issue, I really don't understand it in the slightest. More chips available for chippers to buy!? Egregious!
Did everyone pull out the pitchforks when CPC first started making "non and/or fake Paulsons"? How about with Gene at ABC/BR Poker? How about Sunfly? Why suddenly is the Tina/Cards Mold making of alleged "fake Paulson" poker chips such a crazy and dangerous endeavor?
I do understand that a TinaHC mold of chips of currently open casinos is probably not a good idea. However, as far as OP's issue, I really don't understand it in the slightest. More chips available for chippers to buy!? Egregious!
None of those companies ever made exact copies of other chips. They won’t do that. But the cards mold people will print anything.
Nanook
Full House
Yea, I think you are. It's way more than just a new source of poker chips.
CPC has never made fake paulsons. Where are you getting this from?
well, they aren't selling chips that are on a mold that someone else owns the rights to. Seems quute different to me.... duh
You can't be serious...
Johnblue
Flush
Hot take.
Ceramics suck anyways.
Sorry guys.
Ceramics suck anyways.
Sorry guys.
Nanook
Full House
Well. Ya, but an exact copy of RHC or THC with exact same art as both current live chips and/or past live collectible chips is going to cause lots of problems
You had to have known that you'd be asked wtf you're talking about.
Johnblue
Flush
you copied belagio, because you can’t beat the baron.
This is responsible Tina patronage, and seriously, the coolest chips I’ve seen come out of China.
This is responsible Tina patronage, and seriously, the coolest chips I’ve seen come out of China.
It just seems like people are selling the as fast as they are ordering them, myself included.
I think people buy them hoping that it will scratch the itch of some grail set they have in mind but upon receiving them, they realize they still want the real thing and ceramic replicas just don’t cut it.
I think people buy them hoping that it will scratch the itch of some grail set they have in mind but upon receiving them, they realize they still want the real thing and ceramic replicas just don’t cut it.
There was a Hathaway shirt manufacturing facility in my small hometown and a woolen factory 20 miles away that made blankets for L.L. Bean in the eighties. My aunt who worked there bought me one for Christmas. Both buildings stand vacant and are in decay. Same with the Saucony sneaker factory in Bangor that closed in 2001 to the detriment of 100 employees and their families.
I invite members to find a footwear store that sells sneakers or work boots made in the USA or a furniture store that sells bedroom or dining room sets made in the USA. But now we are angry that there are clay discs being produced in China.
I invite members to find a footwear store that sells sneakers or work boots made in the USA or a furniture store that sells bedroom or dining room sets made in the USA. But now we are angry that there are clay discs being produced in China.
Marius L
4 of a Kind
I don't think anyone is complaining that chips are being producer in China. That's not what this is about.
The problem is producing chips with identical designs as current live Casino chips. (copyright issue + potential casino scams getting PCF and chip collector community in trouble). The identical designs has probably been ok when done with obsolete casino chips on the cards mold, but the question is whether we as a community are crossing a line with a mold copying the main branding logo of GPI with the TinaHC.
All I'm trying to say here is that the arguments put forth so far against CM (such as: those new to chipping could be fooled by these; if a grandmother was buying chips for someone she could be mistaken thinking these are real, etc.) could easily be used against CPC, BR Poker, Sunfly, etc. but they weren't (or at least if they were I was not aware of it happening). No actual chipper on here is going to mistake a CM chip for a Paulson, but newbies might. Just like newbies might think that real clay CPC chips are actual Paulsons. Where were all the pitchforks then? It doesn't have to be a chip that's an actual real casino. Paulson made chips that weren't for real casinos but they were still real Paulsons. So newbies still might be fooled in those cases.
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